# Is there a strong Christian backlash to Trump's sedition? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 19, 2021, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895 "2021-01-19T16:45:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/121 "2021-01-25T01:56:19Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > > [@DrDeth](#): > > > > Now, if you had added “Evangelical” as a modifier to Christian, I’d give you some slack and maybe even agree. But tarring all of American Christianity that participates in politics as “sneaky, hypocritical, and dishonest” is bigoted. > > I didn’t want to limit myself to Evangelicals, they have a recognizable name these days, but there are plenty of people with a political identity that they state is based on their Christian identity. It’s usually a two part spec, specifying ‘Christian’, but associating some other philosophy, like Christian Conservative. It isn’t simply the label either, they will identify their politics as being Christian in nature, and then have some set of political values/causes/whatevers to go with it. And they are sneaky, they are hiding the details of their political philosophy. They use the ‘Christian’ as both a shield and a battering ram, but they rarely reveal a consistent christian philosophy in any detail. I believe underneath they are economic elitists, and moral elitists, and quite often white supremacists. They believe they are superior people morally and use Christianity as their justification. They also believe they are economically superior as well, believing they are due a better deal than others, and their representation among the wealthy and the upper middle class often unrecognized. Like Raphael Warnock or the Black Church? Or the Christian Left? Or do you just mean Christian Conservatives? So why claim all Christians who have a political identify based on their faith share the misdeed you attribute to Christian Conservatives? Your explanation explains nothing. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/122 "2021-01-25T01:57:13Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Not that _you_ are sorry for the original post. I am not sorry for what I meant in the original post. I am sorry that my words were taken that way, and more directly, my words were not sufficiently clear to avoid misunderstanding. But I am not going to apologize for what I intended to say, that there people who identify themselves politically as Christians, often associating with other political philosophies as well, who hide their true political motivations behind those labels. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/123 "2021-01-25T01:57:58Z")
If this is the explanation you are referring to, it is just as stereotyped as your original comment: > [@TriPolar](#): > > What was the broad brush attack? I specified Christians as a political group, not all Christians as someone said and was noted for. I can certainly expand on what I mean by Christians as a political group if anyone is interested in discussing the subject. You are saying that all Christians, when they act in a political group, are _sneaky, hypocritical, and dishonest._ That’s all you need to know, apparently: any and all Christians, acting in a political group, are _sneaky, hypocritical, and dishonest._ You are attributing personal characteristics to all members of a group, based solely on their religion and the fact that they are exercising their right to act in a political group. No further information is needed, apparently, about the personal values and conduct of the individuals in that group. Based on their religion, we know that they are _sneaky, hypocritical, and dishonest_ when they act politically. That is the epitome of stereotyping and prejudice. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/124 "2021-01-25T02:10:37Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > It was around that time that there began to be a movement of people from mainstream Protestant denominations (and to a small extent Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox people too) into churches that weren’t members of any denomination. These churches were often the ones that call themselves evangelical today and often were explicitly right-wing. How come that non-denominational aspect is often linked to being right-wing? Why would they often overlap? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/125 "2021-01-25T02:44:01Z")
It’s more like the type of Evangelical/Fundamentalist churches which now dominate the “Religious Right/Conservative Christian” factions had evolved out of a movement that felt that the historic denominations were too intertwined with the worldly establishment, and that the true believers needed to set themselves apart from that corruption. So a political movement tied to how we need to return to the Good Old Values would find fertile ground there. A quite extensive discussion of this was done in the NPR Throughline series back in [September](https://www.npr.org/2020/09/23/916048798/the-evangelical-vote) ([transcript](https://www.npr.org/transcripts/916048798)). TL/DR: opportunistically, the Right Wing seized on these denominations being already predisposed to see the Culture War as bringing down righteous values (and leading to, y’know, exposing their kids to the heathens) , to create wedges and build power bases. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/126 "2021-01-25T03:02:21Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > You are saying that all Christians, when they act in a political group, are _sneaky, hypocritical, and dishonest._ That’s not how I interpret such a statement. He didn’t use the word “all.” I see “when acting as a political group” as a limiter, an attempt to limit the topic to particular Christians and not all of them. I do think his limiter was insufficient. There are left-wing groups who identify only as “Christian.” But, at the same time, I share the frustration that there’s not really a good specific term. “Christian Right” is probably the closest, but lately I’m not sure the word “right wing” really describes them. I’m a Christian myself, and I was not offended, as I knew what he was trying to say. But I do thank him for clarifying what he meant. And I agree with his general sentiment. While individual right-leaning Christians can be decent, the political group that identifies as the Christian Right seems to be led by people who are sneaky, hypocritical and dishonest. The biggest reveal of this was how they not only supported Trump but also tried to integrate him into their theology. This man who violates all the Christian commandments, who fits none of the guidelines on how to select a leader, who shows no fruit of the Spirit, who worships himself and Mammon (money) and has thinks he’s never sinned–they act like he’s somehow God’s chosen one and that opposing him is blasphemy. Many of these leaders are now pivoting back, since it’s becoming politically advantageous to do so. But the fact they did this at all shows that they were being sneaky, hypocritical, and dishonest. And since they were and are still leaders in the “Christian Right,” the movement as a whole was willing to go along with that. Even the Bible talks about how you can be judged by those you choose to follow and associate with. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/127 "2021-01-25T03:21:29Z")
TriPolar didn’t use the word “all”, true: just said “Christians” without any qualification or limitation. That includes all Christians. Where’s the limitation in the reference? > [@TriPolar](#): > > As a political group Christians are sneaky, hypocritical, and dishonest. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/128 "2021-01-25T06:39:00Z")
Copied from the ATMB thread offshoot from this thread: " OP of the original thread here. Frankly, I would like to avoid both widespread accusations about Christianity as a whole _and_ attempts to take any criticisms at all as attacks on all Christianity. All I wanted was a discussion of Christian groups that started out supporting Trump and whether any of them have turned away from that original position because of what he has done and/or said since they took that position. Personally, I wouldn’t mind if y’all started a separate thread about whatever it is _this_ discussion is about." ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/129 "2021-01-25T11:44:09Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > I don’t see any significant Christian backlash or even objection to the insurrection. > **[U.S. Bishops’ President Condemns Violent Protests and Prays for Safety as...](https://www.usccb.org/news/2021/us-bishops-president-condemns-violent-protests-and-prays-safety-chaos-threatens-us)** > > Archbishop José H. Gomez of Los Angeles, president of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB), issued the following statement in response to today�... I suppose it’s not really a “backlash,” since the USCCB was never on board with Trumpism, but it’s certainly an objection. And, whether or not you’re a Catholic, or a Christian of any stripe, the USCCB is hardly insignificant. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/130 "2021-01-25T12:22:08Z")
**Modnote** : Enough about making this thread about @TriPolar’s post. Please stop it now. The words he chose are not very clear. I believe he knows to be more careful next time. _This is just a guidance, not a warning. Nothing on your permanent record._ ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/131 "2021-01-25T12:25:21Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I suppose it’s not really a “backlash,” since the USCCB was never on board with Trumpism You are correct-It is not. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/132 "2021-01-25T12:27:31Z")
I know I’m correct. My post was quite clear. The post to which I responded asked about a backlash _ **or** _ objection. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/133 "2021-01-25T14:56:24Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > And you’re claiming that the views of one church today are indicative of what all American Christians Yes, it’s a data point in a rural community, My observation is that Trump was an effect rather than a cause. Trump blindly surfed a wave of right wing issues that predate his candidacy and survive his Presidency. They are part of the diverse views of citizens in a nominally Christian culture. I do not see evidence that anything has changed. There is no ‘backlash’. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/134 "2021-01-25T16:41:53Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > I do not see evidence that anything has changed. There is no ‘backlash’. Because as far as those groups are concerned he hasn’t done much, if anything, to offend them? ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/135 "2021-01-25T17:05:35Z")
Yes - what little they don’t like is blamed on the Progressives. Obviously the right wing was very pleased with Trump. America as it used to be. The America of Gordon Moore. Or, so it has been expressed to me. I believe the folks who may object are in a similar position now as before. Trump didn’t change the extremes. Any change was likely among moderates and independents. My opinion, no cite. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/136 "2021-01-25T17:28:18Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > Trump was an effect rather than a cause. Trump blindly surfed a wave of right wing issues that predate his candidacy and survive his Presidency. They are part of the diverse views of citizens in a nominally Christian culture. This is an important thing to bear in mind, especially when it comes to the leadership that steers the various RW factions (even the nonreligious ones). That many of the rank-and-file followers bought into the specific personal idolatry of Trump due to disinformation and anticritical conditioning in their religious or political bubbles, is a separate matter – the leaders will seek to move them on to the next shiny thing, while keeping Trump’s name, like Reagan’s before, as an object of veneration that you must invoke. At best among the radical so-called Relirious Right you may hope for a general disappointment that Trump was _personally_ a clay-footed idol and they got yet one more case of “we got the time for the prophesy wrong” – but we should not expect a mass rejection of the general goals and methods of the movement, or of using the notion that the political contest is an extension of Armaggedon and an existential struggle to prevent the extinction of “Real America” as the thing to keep the followers’ backs up. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/137 "2021-01-25T17:43:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Because as far as those groups are concerned he hasn’t done much, if anything, to offend them? He has offended them by urging them to attack the Capitol and overthrow the election result, then disowning them, refusing to pardon anyone who took part, backing down, and quietly going along with election result in the end. He looks useless and ‘weak’, and that’s the one thing they will never forgive. A lot of his followers apparently think he lied to them and betrayed him. To what extent pro-Trump evangelical groups think that, I don’t know. I agree with @JRDelirious that whatever they feel about Trump personally, it won’t change their thinking. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/138 "2021-01-25T19:35:09Z")
Am I correct in thinking that those conservative non-denominational Christians tend to be white and put emphasis on questions of race/law & order, that the Good Old Values were the values that predated the civil rights of the '60s? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2021, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/139 "2021-01-25T19:48:48Z")
Well, with the note that they’d been calling for a return to Good Old Values since much earlier even than that. They’ve been on and on about how whatever is the current social trend is a sign of the decadent corruption of the World and the imminent End Of Days for over a century. They just became actively politicized in the form we know them now after the 60s ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2021, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895/140 "2021-01-27T16:00:32Z")
Pastor Robert Jeffress, who was a strong evangelical Trump supporter, has taken a surprisingly circumspect approach to Biden: > **[Joe Biden Will Be President but 'Jesus Christ Is in Control,' Says Pastor...](https://www.christianheadlines.com/contributors/michael-foust/joe-biden-will-be-president-but-jesus-christ-is-in-control-says-pastor-robert-jeffress.html)** > > During his sermon this week, Pastor Robert Jeffress, who has long been a vocal Trump supporter, encouraged Christians to pray for the Biden Administration even if they disagree with their politics. So not a “backlash” or abandonment of Trump, but at least an appeal to his supporters to calm the fuck down. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-strong-christian-backlash-to-trumps-sedition/930895.md?page=8)