# Is there a woman alive more willfully obtuse than Lynndie England? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 19, 2008, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909 "2008-03-19T04:04:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/21 "2008-03-19T13:43:28Z")
I said it before and I’ll say it again: Lynndie England has a glorious career in pr0n awaiting her. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/22 "2008-03-19T13:54:10Z")
[QUOTE=DrCube] C) I agree that by dropping the ASVAB standards, the Army as a whole would be getting “dumber”. The ASVAB was a several hour test, akin to the SAT or ACT, that I felt did a good job measuring both intelligence and education. However, the **article only mentioned that the Army was getting more recruits with lower scores, not that the standard for joining had gotten any lower**. [/QUOTE] (bolding mine) > [@](#): > > There used to be a regulation that no more than 2 percent of all recruits could be “Category IV”—defined as applicants who score in the 10th to 30th percentile on the aptitude tests. In 2004, just 0.6 percent of new soldiers scored so low. In 2005, as the Army had a hard time recruiting, the cap was raised to 4 percent. And in 2007, according to the new data, the Army exceeded even that limit—4.1 percent of new recruits last year were Cat IVs. So the standard for joining hasn’t gotten any lower, but the number of recruits who barely meet the standard is a lot higher than previously required. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/23 "2008-03-19T14:19:54Z")
[QUOTE=FarmerChick] Ummm… cite? [/QUOTE] For which part? Her low IQ was mentioned in almost all reports when the story broke, she’s hills of Kentucky born, mountains of WV bred which = hick. The inbred part is the only questionable part, and my money’s on a straight line family tree just by looking at her. And for her to do porn it would have to be on some sort of niche site- manly looking girls or something. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/24 "2008-03-19T14:21:20Z")
[QUOTE=Scumpup] I said it before and I’ll say it again: Lynndie England has a glorious career in pr0n awaiting her. [/QUOTE] _ **MY EYES!!!11!!! MYYYY EYYYYYYYES!!!11!!!1!1** _ ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/25 "2008-03-19T14:36:27Z")
[QUOTE=Evil Captor] Um, it IS appalling to claim that the press should lay off reporting a fucking WAR ATROCITY. We have freedom of the press here in America for a REASON, dude. The press is SUPPOSED to catch shit like this and expose it to public scrutiny. What they did with the Abu Ghraib story was one of the few instances of war coverage (in the early years) that WASN’T a shameful failure. [/quote] Read my posts carefully. ☹ I said that you can easily imagine situations wherein one might reasonably _wish_ a story go unreported _even as_ one recognizes it can not go unreported due to (in my words) “_the very mission_” of the news agencies. Perhaps the reporting of the story will, in the short term, in measurable terms, do more harm than good, _even though_ in the long term, in less measurable terms, it is better that news agencies do their reporting without restriction. England apparently thinks this is such a case. To think this is not appalling in and of itself. She apparently also does not understand the importance (or perhaps the nature) of the mission of the news agencies. Smart educated people tend to forget this is a somewhat sophisticated concept, though. It is similar to the liberal doctrine of the marketplace of ideas–another idea whose sophistication often goes unrecognized. (How is it similar? Both centrally involve the fact that it is important that dissenters be allowed to express their view, even when the measurable immediate consequences of this expression are negative overall.) These two ideas are engrained into most of us from childhood in a way such that they become nearly reflexive thoughts. This is probably a good thing, but it tends to make us forget there are other ways to think, and that our way of thinking actually has a somewhat complicated conceptual history behind it–one that is not that easy to grasp naturally, if one has somehow missed the education train. Because of this, I can not find it “appalling” if someone hasn’t grasped it.\* > [@](#): > > I’m sure if that New York Times bitch … the one who did time for helping cover up the Valerie Plame story (contempt of court, I believe) had been in charge of the Times they would NEVER have covered the Abu Ghraib story. THAT would have been shameful, however much Lynndie England might have approved it. Every sentence in this paragraph is true. That you would think I would think otherwise is symptomatic of the inexplicable policy most people on this board have of _not reading for understanding_ before they fire off their post. -FrL- \*Full disclosure: It may be that my years of experience reading truly breathtakingly appallingly stupid comments by college students taking philosophy classes to “fulfill a requirement” has caused me to adjust my appall-o-meter. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/26 "2008-03-19T14:43:20Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] For which part? Her low IQ was mentioned in almost all reports when the story broke, she’s hills of Kentucky born, mountains of WV bred which = hick. The inbred part is the only questionable part, and my money’s on a straight line family tree just by looking at her. And for her to do porn it would have to be on some sort of niche site- manly looking girls or something. [/QUOTE] Again, cite? ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/27 "2008-03-19T14:48:24Z")
[QUOTE=Gatopescado] Hillary Clinton? Mia Angelou? (is that how you spell that?) [/QUOTE] Willfully obtuse? Bringing up two completely unrelated names in a thread? And misspelling one of the names? ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/28 "2008-03-19T14:51:10Z")
[QUOTE=Frylock] \*Full disclosure: It may be that my years of experience reading truly breathtakingly appallingly stupid comments by college students taking philosophy classes to “fulfill a requirement” has caused me to adjust my appall-o-meter. [/QUOTE] ::shudder:: Indeed. Not to mention the distorting effects of PTSD of the mind. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/29 "2008-03-19T14:57:46Z")
[QUOTE=Guinastasia] Again, cite? [/QUOTE] Get a life- are you seriously questioning her IQ or her birth state or where she was raised, or that she had a lower class upbringing? Go to her freaking wikipedia page or google Lynddie England IQ. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![FarmerChick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@FarmerChick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FarmerChick)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/30 "2008-03-19T14:59:49Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] For which part? Her low IQ was mentioned in almost all reports when the story broke, she’s hills of Kentucky born, mountains of WV bred which = hick. The inbred part is the only questionable part, and my money’s on a straight line family tree just by looking at her. And for her to do porn it would have to be on some sort of niche site- manly looking girls or something. [/QUOTE] Well based on your name you’re just a tiny drunken mick then right? Or maybe just a little bampot. ---
**Author:** ![BJMoose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5fc32e/32.png) [@BJMoose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BJMoose)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/31 "2008-03-19T15:00:51Z")
[QUOTE=Scumpup] I said it before and I’ll say it again: Lynndie England has a glorious career in pr0n awaiting her. [/QUOTE] Heh. She _does_ have experience in encouraging guys to jerk off, doesn’t she. ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/32 "2008-03-19T15:02:07Z")
Aside from the topic of this thread: what is the deal exactly with asking for cites for things that have been well publicized and/or are common knowledge? Not trying to jump on anyone. But I can’t see asking for a cite in this case. Is it just that you who are asking for a cite have not heard this said about her? Okay maybe not the “inbred” part but I took that as a Pit-style insult, not a declaration of fact. What’s the “rule” for these kinds of things? ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/33 "2008-03-19T15:04:42Z")
[QUOTE=FarmerChick] Well based on your name you’re just a tiny drunken mick then right? Or maybe just a little bampot. [/QUOTE] Funny 🙂 , but not really relevant. Am I taking crazy pills? Two people here are actually requesting cites that she’s a poor mountain chick with a two digit IQ? Really? Ok you got me I’m lying- she’s really the daughter of a shipping tycoon and a former Miss Universe, raised in Beverly Hills and summered in the Hamptons, and a Mensa member with a degree in aeronautical enginnering :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/34 "2008-03-19T15:11:26Z")
[QUOTE=EddyTeddyFreddy] ::shudder:: Indeed. Not to mention the distorting effects of PTSD of the mind. [/QUOTE] Sorry, PTSD? What’s that mean? -FrL- ETA: I looked it up. Heh. Yeah. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![FarmerChick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@FarmerChick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FarmerChick)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/35 "2008-03-19T15:16:47Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] Funny 🙂 , but not really relevant. Am I taking crazy pills? Two people here are actually requesting cites that she’s a poor mountain chick with a two digit IQ? Really? Ok you got me I’m lying- she’s really the daughter of a shipping tycoon and a former Miss Universe, raised in Beverly Hills and summered in the Hamptons, and a Mensa member with a degree in aeronautical enginnering :dubious: [/QUOTE] I guess I just find it offensive that just because she’s not the smartest knife in the drawer, you need to slam a whole region. Not everyone who lives in the mountains of West Virginia or Kentucky is an inbred hick. Even the stupid ones. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/36 "2008-03-19T15:18:52Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] Get a life- are you seriously questioning her IQ or her birth state or where she was raised, or that she had a lower class upbringing? Go to her freaking wikipedia page or google Lynddie England IQ. :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] How long have YOU been here? YOU google it. YOU make a claim, it’s up to YOU to prove it-not for others to search for it. And yes, I am questioning it. I’m supposed to take YOUR word as proof? ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/37 "2008-03-19T15:19:18Z")
[QUOTE=FarmerChick] I guess I just find it offensive that just because she’s not the smartest knife in the drawer, you need to slam a whole region. Not everyone who lives in the mountains of West Virginia or Kentucky is an inbred hick. Even the stupid ones. [/QUOTE] You’d have a valid point if I had said anything like that- I made no reference to anyone else in the region except her. Johnny Depp is the total opposite of a hick, and he was born in Owensboro Kentucky. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/38 "2008-03-19T15:20:58Z")
[QUOTE=Frylock] Sorry, PTSD? What’s that mean? -FrL- ETA: I looked it up. Heh. Yeah. 😉 [/QUOTE] 🙂 You may find it mildly amusing that, in composing that sentence, I dithered for a bit between “of the mind” and “on the mind” – could go either way, eh? ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/39 "2008-03-19T15:23:42Z")
[QUOTE=Guinastasia] How long have YOU been here? YOU google it. YOU make a claim, it’s up to YOU to prove it-not for others to search for it. And yes, I am questioning it. I’m supposed to take YOUR word as proof? [/QUOTE] I’ll provide you with proof only if you confirm that you’ve lived in a cave since the story on her broke several years ago- anyone with access to a TV or radio or internet or newspaper was bombarded with the details of her background for weeks. I’m not making a “claim”, I’m citing something that’s as well known to any sensible person as the Earth is the third planet from the sun. Asking for a cite on this makes you look either ignorant or difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909/40 "2008-03-19T15:35:06Z")
_sigh_ I give up. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-woman-alive-more-willfully-obtuse-than-lynndie-england/441909.md?page=3)