# Is there an alternative theory for this Universe thing **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 18, 2016, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493 "2016-01-18T13:00:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![IDtenT\_Error](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@IDtenT\_Error](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IDtenT_Error)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/41 "2016-01-20T15:31:10Z")
> [@Find\_Friends](#): > > * * * > > - (Upper case) Galaxy and galactic refers to our own little pinwheel, as for example loose “open” clusters of stars within. For clusters of galaxies (lower case) we use “galaxian”. You mean [like this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhYVcwhSWjI)? ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/42 "2016-01-20T15:38:43Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Which doesn’t work, because the light you’re seeing is thousands of years old. In that time, a variable star’s period could change, or even stop varying at all. There are ways to find your position, but that’s not one of them. I wonder if **bob++** was referring to pulsars, not variable stars. The plaque on the Pioneer probe contains a [diagram that shows our location relative to prominent pulsars.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_plaque#Relative_position_of_the_Sun_to_the_center_of_the_Galaxy_and_14_pulsars) And [pulsar navigation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-ray_pulsar-based_navigation) for interplanetary navigation has been proposed. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/43 "2016-01-20T16:06:16Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > I wonder if **bob++** was referring to pulsars, not variable stars. The plaque on the Pioneer probe contains a [diagram that shows our location relative to prominent pulsars.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_plaque#Relative_position_of_the_Sun_to_the_center_of_the_Galaxy_and_14_pulsars) And [pulsar navigation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-ray_pulsar-based_navigation) for interplanetary navigation has been proposed. Nothing like giving the Kzinti a gorram road map for their conquest / harvester fleet. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/44 "2016-01-20T17:19:53Z")
Except that pulsars also change with time, and are also directional. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/45 "2016-01-20T17:50:08Z")
To the OP: you use the words “atom” and “proton,” so you are comfortable enough with them–can fathom them–to a certain extent. The actual, real dimensions of these things, how they exist and operate, is about as unfathomable as anything else in this whole damn Universe, including this whole damn Universe with us in it deciding what is “fathomable” and what isn’t, let alone if decision a or decision b bugs us. In one of his movies Woody Allen is asked if he can fathom the Holocaust, and he says “I don’t even get how scissors work.” I find this a consoling joke. ---
**Author:** ![Nansbread1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Nansbread1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nansbread1)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/46 "2016-01-20T18:33:19Z")
Do Americans have a problem with using the word fathom as a verb?:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Turgu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@Turgu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Turgu)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/47 "2016-01-20T18:35:30Z")
I find it hard to belive you can split everything in half until you get to planck length. Why can’t you have half planck length? Just split it in half, lol. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/48 "2016-01-20T19:29:14Z")
My pet theory is that every particle in the universe reflexively contains the entire universe within it, and the passage of time is the flow of everything exchanging itself with each thing. Where ever the universe is emptiest, there is no real passage of time. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/49 "2016-01-20T20:21:11Z")
> [@Turgu](#): > > I find it hard to belive you can split everything in half until you get to planck length. Why can’t you have half planck length? > > Just split it in half, lol. At the level of Planck length, measurement starts to become meaningless. What are you measuring _with_? What aspect of reality will matter at a smaller length? You can _think_ about smaller lengths, but anything _physical_ at smaller lengths becomes, at best, a blur. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/50 "2016-01-20T21:07:19Z")
> [@Nansbread1](#): > > Do Americans have a problem with using the word fathom as a verb?:rolleyes: 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/51 "2016-01-20T21:41:31Z")
> [@Nansbread1](#): > > Do Americans have a problem with using the word fathom as a verb?:rolleyes: You realize that your theis, at its essence, is just an argument from incredulity? “I can’t understand it, therefore it’s impossible.” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/52 "2016-01-20T21:45:41Z")
> [@Nansbread1](#): > > Do Americans have a problem with using the word fathom as a verb?:rolleyes: I find it hard to fathom why you would pick that one and only thing out of everything that has been said to pettily respond to. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/53 "2016-01-20T22:25:28Z")
> [@Nansbread1](#): > > Do Americans have a problem with using the word fathom as a verb?:rolleyes: Perhaps we do not think it means what you think it means. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/54 "2016-01-20T23:13:28Z")
Fathom means six feet. Fathoming therefore means measuring things by six foot lengths. See? We do understand. ---
**Author:** ![sevenwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6de8d8/32.png) [@sevenwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sevenwood)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/55 "2016-01-20T23:15:30Z")
> [@Nansbread1](#): > > Do Americans have a problem with using the word fathom as a verb?:rolleyes: I am genuinely confused. **You’ve** never used the word “fathom” as a verb at any time in this thread, but you seem to be concerned that nobody else has either. I just can’t grok this. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/56 "2016-01-20T23:25:39Z")
I think “fathom” was not commonly used as a verb for measuring depth. Seems to me more common nautical term is “sounding”, which predates sonar (a rope with six-foot-interval knots in it is a soundline). And the Mississippi riverboat sounders called out a safe depth of two fathoms with the cry “_mark twain_”. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2016, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/57 "2016-01-20T23:39:34Z")
“Do Americans whitewash every thing pointed out to them, no matter how loathsome and vile, such as unfathoming words, by dragging in Mark Twain?” [heh, “whitewash.” Plus I upped the verb count.] ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2016, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/58 "2016-01-21T00:51:43Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **Turgu** : > > I find it hard to belive you can split everything in half until you get to planck length. Why can’t you have half planck length? What makes you think you can’t? There is nothing known to science that would prevent it. Now, granted, there’s a heck of a lot we don’t know about what goes on at that scale, so maybe you can’t have a half of a Planck length… but maybe you can. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2016, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/59 "2016-01-21T01:07:17Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > What makes you think you can’t? There is nothing known to science that would prevent it. Now, granted, there’s a heck of a lot we don’t know about what goes on at that scale, so maybe you can’t have a half of a Planck length… but maybe you can. That’s hard to fathom! ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2016, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493/60 "2016-01-21T01:15:40Z")
> [@Nansbread1](#): > > Do Americans have a problem with using the word fathom as a verb?:rolleyes: Who are you calling an American? Anyway, you used the word “unfathomable” which is an adjective. It isn’t clear what the initial question was if you raise this question. I think most people have taken the meaning of unfathomable to be that of not being capable of being understood. Are you using it in the sense of not capable of being explored? Given the initial question segued to a question on alternative theories of the universe, it seems rather reasonable to assume the question was directed at understandably, not exploration. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-an-alternative-theory-for-this-universe-thing/743493.md?page=2)