# is there any differences in meaning between the two following sentences: **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 3, 2014, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895 "2014-06-03T04:41:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/21 "2014-06-05T05:28:22Z")
> [@tapu](#): > > Somewhat related: the So Cal and other dialect expression: Want to come with? “Want to come with” is in no way grammatically correct. Sure, it’s idiomatic to a specific group, or groups of English speakers, but is in no possible way considered correct English grammar. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/22 "2014-06-05T06:21:16Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > “Want to come with” is in no way grammatically correct. Sure, it’s idiomatic to a specific group, or groups of English speakers, but is in no possible way considered correct English grammar. There’s no reason why it can’t easily be grammatical, providing that _come with_ is a phrasal verb, meaning about the same thing as _come along_. In the same way that we ask: _Do you want to come along?_ we could say: _Do you want to come with?_ German, in fact, has such a verb (_mitkommen_), and could in fact be one reason why the English version persists in the States, where so many Germans settled. So your objection has nothing to do with grammar. It’s simply a question of lexicon, because you don’t accept this particular phrasal verb as standard. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/23 "2014-06-05T06:25:46Z")
After several days of reflection, I think I actually prefer the “go to” construction of the sentence, because it removes ambiguity. “Where do you want to go?” = “What location do you wish to physically move towards” or “Where do you want to pee/poop?” or “At what location do you wish to play the game of Go” Whereas “Where do you want to go to?” pretty much can’t be interpreted any way other than “Where would you like to physically move towards” ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/24 "2014-06-05T06:34:13Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The main complaint is not the preposition itself, or terminating a sentence with one, but rather that it’s redundant. That might be the (supposed) reason for the complaint, but in usage, people don’t say this to be redundant. In fact, **it’s not a preposition at all** when people say _Where are you going to?_, but rather an emphatic particle. It serves the same function as _on_, when people say: _Come on in!_ (instead of just _Come in!_) ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/25 "2014-06-05T07:24:49Z")
As others have said, the first sentence seems a little more open-ended. “Where do you want to go?” can be answered with anything - “Winchester”, “North”, “abroad somewhere”, “down the road”, “away from here” “Where do you want to go _to_?” is asking me to pinpoint the destination. ---
**Author:** ![RobDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f07891/32.png) [@RobDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RobDog)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/26 "2014-06-05T07:55:14Z")
I’ve no real explanation for this, but I strongly feel that “Where do you want to go” is something I’m more likely to write, but “Where do you want to go to” is something I’m more likely to say. Agree though that the second “to” is redundant and the difference is present but nuanced. Not as egregiously awkward as Paul McCartney’s “world in which we live in” though. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/27 "2014-06-05T11:52:29Z")
> [@RobDog](#): > > Not as egregiously awkward as Paul McCartney’s “world in which we live in” though. Just because: [Live and Let Die (song) - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Live_and_Let_Die_(song)#.22in_which_we_live_in.22_or_.22in_which_we.27re_living.22) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/28 "2014-06-05T14:52:53Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > That might be the (supposed) reason for the complaint, but in usage, people don’t say this to be redundant. > > In fact, **it’s not a preposition at all** when people say _Where are you going to?_, but rather an emphatic particle. It serves the same function as _on_, when people say: > > _Come on in!_ (instead of just _Come in!_) I don’t hear it that way. I hear it as a repositioning of the preposition from the head to the tail of the sentence, i.e. instead of “To where are you going” it becomes “Where are you going to?” I don’t hear it as an emphatic particle, myself. It follows a typical English pattern, just like “With whom are you going to the movies” becomes “Who(m) are you going to the movies with.” That’s what I see happening with that “to” at the end–it’s split off the “where.” ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/29 "2014-06-05T14:56:26Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Just because: [Live and Let Die (song) - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Live_and_Let_Die_(song)#.22in_which_we_live_in.22_or_.22in_which_we.27re_living.22) I’ve used that explanation before, but I’m no longer wholly convinced it’s true after listening to a few live recordings where it pretty clearly sounds like “in which we live in” and not "in which we’re livin’. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/30 "2014-06-05T15:04:09Z")
Reminds me of the William Safire’s Fumblerules of Grammar: Don’t use a preposition to end a sentence with. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/31 "2014-06-05T15:09:01Z")
Native US English speaker here. They have the same meaning. > [@PSXer](#): > > …ending a sentence with a preposition is wrong, wrong, and horribly wrong It should be plainly clear that a preposition is not an appropriate thing to end a sentence with. Also, don’t use no double negatives. If a mixed metaphor sprouts up, it should be derailed. Careful writers know that it is important to never split an infinitive. And don’t start a sentence with a conjunction. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/32 "2014-06-05T15:24:33Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > Native US English speaker here. They have the same meaning. > > It should be plainly clear that a preposition is not an appropriate thing to end a sentence with. Also, don’t use no double negatives. If a mixed metaphor sprouts up, it should be derailed. Careful writers know that it is important to never split an infinitive. And don’t start a sentence with a conjunction. While humorous, of course, it’s okay to start a sentence with a conjunction, to split an infinitive, and to end a sentence with a preposition. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/33 "2014-06-05T16:37:05Z")
The sentence could be “Where do you want to GOTO?” - asked by one programmer of another about where they want to get down and dirty with some old-school code. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/34 "2014-06-05T17:26:05Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I don’t hear it that way. I hear it as a repositioning of the preposition from the head to the tail of the sentence, i.e. instead of “To where are you going” it becomes “Where are you going to?” Clearly that’s the syntactic origin of this usage, but speakers no longer have that reason _not_ to merge _where_ and _to where_, as with other case of preposition stranding such as _Who are you having lunch with?_ (We don’t see \*\*Who are you having lunch?\*) IOW, _ **it is precisely because it is “redundant”** _ that it can serve as an emphatic particle. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/35 "2014-06-05T18:08:13Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > Clearly that’s the syntactic origin of this usage, but speakers no longer have that reason _not_ to merge _where_ and _to where_, as with other case of preposition stranding such as _Who are you having lunch with?_ (We don’t see \*\*Who are you having lunch?\*) > > IOW, _ **it is precisely because it is “redundant”** _ that it can serve as an emphatic particle. I’m not necessarily going to argue that it acts as an emphatic–I can buy that. But it’s still a preposition to me, and just as emphatic as if it were placed at the front of the sentence, where there is no doubt of it being a preposition. It does not feel analogous to the use of “on” in your “come on in,” example, but I think we’re splitting hairs here. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/36 "2014-06-05T21:52:45Z")
I’d say the “to” serves the same purpose of “at” in “Where are you at?” And, thinking that, gave a link to Grammar Girl, who pretty much says what we’ve said here, but adds a history lesson if you click on the subsequent pages. > **[Where Are You At? - Quick and Dirty Tips](https://www.quickanddirtytips.com/articles/where-are-you-at/)** > > Grammar Girl here, and today I’m going to tell you where it’s at! ‘Where It’s At’ Just kidding. I used the phrase “Where it’s at” in an episode a few years ago, and a listener called me on it. How embarrassing, given that I always give the same... (She also says I’m wrong about “at,” claiming it’s always redundant except in idiomatic expressions.) ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/37 "2014-06-06T07:08:42Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I’m not necessarily going to argue that it acts as an emphatic–I can buy that. But it’s still a preposition to me, and just as emphatic as if it were placed at the front of the sentence, where there is no doubt of it being a preposition. It does not feel analogous to the use of “on” in your “come on in,” example, but I think we’re splitting hairs here. This is a hair I’m guilty of splitting, if only because I believe that, in order to fully portray what we do with language, we can’t allow form to cloud our view of function, which often isn’t adequately described by the traditional repertoire of parts of speech. ---
**Author:** ![tapu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@tapu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tapu)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/38 "2014-06-06T14:58:24Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’d say the “to” serves the same purpose of “at” in “Where are you at?” And, thinking that, gave a link to Grammar Girl, who pretty much says what we’ve said here, but adds a history lesson if you click on the subsequent pages. > > [Where Are You At?](http://www.quickanddirtytips.com/education/grammar/where-are-you-at) > > (She also says I’m wrong about “at,” claiming it’s always redundant except in idiomatic expressions.) In a few subdialects of Amer Eng, you can say, “Want to come with?” It’s considered slang, whereas the examples above are not so received anymore. Of course that’s just an earlier stage to being accepted more generally in the dialect. ---
**Author:** ![tapu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@tapu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tapu)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/39 "2014-06-06T15:10:17Z")
Prescriptive grammarians vs. descriptive linguists. Take the preposition at the end of sentence. (Please. ha ha) Prescriptive Grammarians above say it’s not grammatical because it doesn’t follow a rule that’s established and taught in English grammar. Descriptive sorts above are making statements about where along a continuum of “ungrammatical” or “grammatical” an expression falls. Of course, their intuitions will differ based on how standard or nonstandard the form is in their subdialect and idiolect. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895/40 "2014-06-06T15:26:02Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’d say the “to” serves the same purpose of “at” in “Where are you at?” …) And what purpose would that be? “Where are you at?” grates the hell out of my ears. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-differences-in-meaning-between-the-two-following-sentences/689895.md?page=3)