# Is there any possibility that we'll get a bipartisan Health Care Bill? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 18, 2017, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593 "2017-07-18T19:58:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Grim\_Render](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@Grim\_Render](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grim_Render)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2017, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/61 "2017-07-23T03:44:54Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > If we set up single-payer, we will need to ration care. That might address rising costs, but then the health care will not be the best in the world, because we will let people die or go untreated in order to save money. Nobody is going to like that. > > Regards, > Shodan You already ration care much more harshly than single payer countries, to get worse care at higher costs. I mean seriously, millions of people do not get any healthcare beyond emergency care, a large section of the population is under-insured, and people who are insured still have to worry about costs and potential bankruptcy if they need healthcare… \*\* and you are talking about rationing care _further?_\*\* Might we venture to suggest that you instead consider rationing the amount of bureaucracy, pointless middlemen and profits for actors that other nations don’t generally see the point of at all? Regards, the rest of the developed world. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/62 "2017-07-28T06:42:34Z")
I’m very encouraged by Senator Schumer’s comments after the skinny bill failed. It’s only 5 mins long and worth watching. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/Ff7VA_W-2gM/maxresdefault.jpg "Sen. Chuck Schumer addresses the Senate after the 'skinny' ACA repeal bill fails") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ff7VA_W-2gM) Some key points… He uses the term Obamacare and acknowledges it needs fixing. That’s a signal from his side that he’s serious about this. He mentions pending legislation that can quickly be passed if the parties work together. He’s willing to look at several pending nominations and get them passed. It seems to me the Minority Leader genuinely wants to work with Republicans. I really hope the Republicans will give this opportunity a chance. They’re out of options on health care. They have to work with Democrats to fix health care. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/63 "2017-07-28T06:54:17Z")
I can’t find video. But apparently McCain spoke about bipartisanship when he defended his vote against the skinny bill. Schumer was replying back to that. He was clearly emotional and not just blowing smoke up anyone’s ass. It is definitely time for both parties to work together and get important work done. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/64 "2017-07-28T07:23:58Z")
CNN posted McCain’s speech on bipartisanship. It’s one of the most compelling speeches I’ve heard him give. Maybe we will see a return to normal business. Obviously rabid partisanship isn’t working. > **[McCain returns to Senate floor (full speech) | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2017/07/25/mccain-returns-to-senate-floor-full-remarks.cnn)** > > Senator John McCain (R-AZ) made a poignant return to the Senate, less than a week after learning he has an aggressive form of brain cancer. ---
**Author:** ![Grestarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grestarian/32/3227_2.png) [@Grestarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grestarian)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/65 "2017-07-30T02:35:03Z")
> [@Gary\_T](#): > > …While the Democrats aren’t always saintly, the Republicans have made it an express policy not to cooperate with Dems, for over eight years now, with an intensity not seen before. Democrats on the whole will work with reasonable Republicans. Republicans on the whole will not even consider working with Democrats, reasonable or not. > > ETA: And it seems that most Republicans will not work with reasonable Republicans. > [@Gary\_T](#): > > That’s not equally true. While the Democrats aren’t always saintly, the Republicans have made it an express policy not to cooperate with Dems, for over eight years now, with an intensity not seen before. Democrats on the whole will work with reasonable Republicans. Republicans on the whole will not even consider working with Democrats, reasonable or not. > > ETA: And it seems that most Republicans will not work with reasonable Republicans. [COLOR=Red]Eight years? Ohhh, yes! WELL OVER eight years! I have a coworker who quite earnestly complained the other day, “Gosh, I wish the Democrats weren’t doing this stonewalling thing. That just means the Republicans are going to turn around and do it back when a Democrat becomes Prez and nothings going to get done for decades.” He was making this complaint as if it was a new thing going on in Washington DC and the Democrats had invented it. Try twenty! The Republicans started the we’re-not-going-to-budge game back in the late 1980’s under George H.W. Bush (Mr. 41). They haven’t stopped since! They turned up the rudeness when Bill Clinton was in office – doesn’t anyone else remember the first attempt to get nationwide healthcare passed? Japan, forever taking the Disorganized States’ lead, learned from the example. The conservatives in the Diet (just think of it as Japan’s version of Congress) blocked everything the Prime Minister tried to do, from commemorating WWII soldiers to wiping his nose after a sneeze [yes, I’m intentionally exaggerating; deal with it], to the extent that he got disgusted and decided to just step down (let’s just say the 90’s were quite tumultuous). I don’t recall (though I could be wrong but let’s not sidetrack this thread) Bush Jr. ever even suggesting cooperation across the aisle. But then again, that was an administration in contention to begin with and such a suggestion might have been nixed as seeming insincere. And then when the nation legitimately elected President Barack Obama (without a need for recounting chads or debating the legitimacy of the Electoral College), the Republicans tripled-down and did everything they could to make him a one-term President, even to the extent of holding government funding hostage (while also joining demonstrations that decried the closure of war memorials). And when that failed, they doubled-down on their triple-down! If you (in general, not Gary T in particular) don’t remember these things, you either have a very conveniently selective memory on par with Tea Party attempts to revise and white-wash history or–well, where the heck were you in the last three decades? I was in Japan for part of that stretch and still remember the constant Republican blockade. Good heavens! Have I become one of the reminiscing old-timers around here?! –G! Do you remember Yer President Nixon Do you remember The bills you have to pay for even yesterday? …–David Bowie …_Young Americans_ …Young Americans (1975) [/COLOR] ---
**Author:** ![Grestarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grestarian/32/3227_2.png) [@Grestarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grestarian)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/66 "2017-07-30T03:04:43Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Percentage of GDP spent on Healthcare; > > Britain 9.1% > Canada 10.4% > France 11.5% > > United States 17.1% > > Are we getting 50-90% better care than these nations? No, we’re simply paying more for our services and far more for our drugs. Cecil had a column earlier this year addressing the issue of ridiculously expensive drugs. Basically it was 'Yeah, Canada and other countries can control prices but, here in the US of A, Capitalism reigns supreme." And, basically, that’s the situation with health care in general (which includes pharmaceuticals). The fact of the matter is that the US of A is not a democracy and hasn’t been one for a long time. It’s a _capitalist plutocracy_ and the politicians are doing what politicians in a plutocracy do: Cater to the people who fund their quest for power and glory; vote they way they’ve been paid (the most) to vote. The fact that some form of nationalized health care was voted in at all (mind you it was the second Democratic attempt and was greatly patterned after a Republican model from a politician who is often more of a Democrat than a lot of politicians who run on the (D) ticket!) would suggest there are (were?) still some politicians who try to do what’s right, rather than just what Big Money tells them to do. Politicians with such integrity seem to be a dying breed. * * * I still think the tide of popular opinion turned in favor of the Affordable Care Act when the Big Blue Insurance Giant tripled its premium rates in the middle of the debates. They epitomized Greedy Corporate Healthcare and politicians couldn’t ignore the resultant outrage. More recent Epi-pen scandals and similar instances of publicized healthcare greed have simply reinforced negative reception of the “Hey, it’s just capitalism!” argument. But, hey, doing what’s best for the masses would be, like socialist or something and that’s just a hair’s breadth away from communism and then Communism and… —G! The fundamental literature of every culture on the planet portrays greedy and power-hungry characters as antagonists; they are the evil to be vanquished by the hero. Yet, in American politics, we idolize greed and ambition! ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/67 "2017-07-30T17:17:42Z")
> [@Grestarian](#): > > . . . the US of A is not a democracy and hasn’t been one for a long time. It’s a _capitalist plutocracy_ . . . Well, it has a hell of a lot of input from the monied interests, but that also does include groups like gun lobbyists and the AARP. It isn’t all “capitalist” money buying votes, but other kinds of special interests too. And our individual votes, each election, still count for a hell of a lot. We aren’t totally swayed by bought-and-paid advertisements. Just hugely influenced. It might be a slight improvement if the situation were formalized, and Congressional votes could, in fact, be bought outright. The pro- and anti- sides would have to bid in recurring auctions, especially regarding closely divided issues, providing a HUGE revenue stream for the nation. Money wouldn’t go to advertisers; it would go right into the Treasury! ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/68 "2017-07-30T20:38:56Z")
Finally!!! The news I’ve been waiting to hear since this thread was created July 18. Slowly but surely the Republicans are warming up to bipartisanship. It’s in the article, further down from where I quoted. Collins and Flake are echoing what McCain and Schumer said last week. Elephants can fly. 😃 This has made my entire week. It sounds like they’re ready to fix ACA one step at a time. Instead of some bloated overhaul of the entire program. Let’s just hope Trump doesn’t screw things up before the Senate can act. > **[Susan Collins: ‘Go back to committee’ on health care | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/2017/07/30/politics/susan-collins-health-care/index.html)** > > Sen. Susan Collins, one of three Republican senators who sunk the “skinny repeal” of Obamacare on Friday, said on CNN’s “State of the Union” Sunday that it was time to build a series of health care bills through the committee process. > [@](#): > > “The ball is really in our court right now,” Collins said. “Our job is not done.” > > The Maine Republican called for a return to the normal legislative process by addressing problems and crafting bills on the committee level before bringing them to a vote before the full chamber. > > “We need to go back to committee,” she said. > > Collins also emphasized her opposition to more comprehensive legislation and instead advocated the Senate “produce a series of bills” aimed at addressing pressing issues in health care. She said the first issue the Senate should focus on would be to stabilize the insurance markets. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/69 "2017-07-30T20:55:14Z")
I had to look this up. U.S. Senator Susan Collins, the Chairman of the Senate Aging Committee > **[United States Senate Special Committee on Aging](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_Special_Committee_on_Aging)** > > The United States Senate Special Committee on Aging was initially established in 1961 as a temporary committee; it became a permanent Senate committee in 1977. As a special committee, it has no legislative authority, but it studies issues related to older Americans, particularly Medicare and Social Security. > Prior to the passage of Medicare, the committee was studying health care insurance coverage for elderly American citizens. The committee conducts oversight of the Medicare program, Social Se... Flake is on that committee too and Energy & Natural Resources. He’s also on the Judiciary and Foreign Relation committees. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/70 "2017-07-31T05:32:38Z")
> [@davida03801](#): > > That works both ways. As I see it the Dems are equally guilty here. The idea of compromise no longer applies and that is a shame. Well, if one side wants some form of healthcare bill, and the other absolutely does not, what compromise is possible? No, seriously, how, in your mind, does this work? > [@](#): > > In my view the fault of the last 9 years falls squarely on Obama. When the ObamaCare was in the works he should have brought into the Oval Office Pelosi, Reid, McConnell and Boehner and told them to all work together give and take and compromise to come up with a bipartisan bill. At that time he had the political capital to do so and bring a plot of public pressure on both sides. He ran on the promise of bipartisanship which is what the voters really want. Instead he proved to be a partisan hack politician with no interest to actually do any work to manage the process. As others have pointed out: _he did_ try to push the bill bipartisanly. Republicans had tons of influence on the final product. He dropped the far more liberal ideas of single payer and even the public option precisely in order to gain bipartisan support. But here’s the thing. Here’s the dirty little secret that none of these middle-of-the-roaders seem to want to get: **Republican politicians do not want government-run health care**. They just don’t. Paul Ryan’s goal: cut the social safety net and cut taxes. Mitch McConnell’s goal: cut the social safety net and cut taxes. These people have _no interest_ in pushing a workable vision on health care. It’s the same bait and switch they played with Hillarycare - decry the Democratic Party’s vision on health care, argue that their version is so much better, then as soon as the dem bill is dead, proceed to _not_ unroll their own version. They may not be willing to admit it outright, but they have no interest in the government being involved in health care. Remember 2006? There was too much government in the healthcare back _then_. > [@](#): > > All major social change legislative bills for the last 120 years all had to some degree bipartisan support and that is why they were accepted. That is until ObamaCare which will fail on its own soon enough. There needs to be a bipartisan solution here and we will have this continuous battle until that happens. But there can’t _be_ a bipartisan solution here. It doesn’t work. One party wants the government to be involved with health care. One party doesn’t (but will gladly lie about it because they know it’s popular). It’s really that simple. There’s a reason the Republicans have been complaining about Obamacare for _seven fucking years_ and still don’t have a coherent bill to push! The only “bipartisan” solution is if members of one party abandon the party line on the issue completely. Which might happen - the republican position here is both incredibly dishonest and incredibly unpopular, and the only thing propping it up is the aforementioned dishonesty, which has come to light more and more recently. But then it’s still not a “bipartisan” bill. It’s a liberal bill with RINO support. Because that’s how the party lines are drawn at the moment. > [@rbroome](#): > > The problem is not that the Ds will block the Rs and vice versa, neither party can come together enough to get an effective bill passed even without the opposition party. The Ds already _did_ back in 2010. It was pretty big news. > [@Shodan](#): > > If we set up single-payer, we will need to ration care. That might address rising costs, but then the health care will not be the best in the world, because we will let people die or go untreated in order to save money. Nobody is going to like that. You do realize that “rationing care” isn’t just when the government says you can’t get that extremely expensive experimental treatment that probably won’t work and won’t save you even if it does, right? It’s also when a visit to the hospital costs tens of thousands of dollars and therefore excludes a great number of the population. The US already rations care. It just does so _incredibly badly_. It rations not according to what would be effective and what would save lives, but rather according to who can pay more. Which is stupid. Oh, and there’s all kinds of other things that the government could and should do but doesn’t. Things like saying “you can’t up the price on a life-saving, cheap-to-produce device you bought the rights to (which has existed for 20 years) by 500% just because you feel like you’d like a larger bonus”. But of course, to stop that, you need government intervention. This argument is just obscene. You know what death panels are in the US? It’s a woman looking at her bank account and realizing that the treatment for her stage I cancer isn’t something she could ever afford. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/71 "2017-07-31T11:04:12Z")
Perhaps the Democrats can pass a few bills to stabilize ACA? Republican Collins suggested starting with a bill to stabilize the insurance markets. There’s three Republicans that said No to gutting ACA. How many more would be needed to pass this first bill? Maybe four or five would stick their neck out and vote yes? They’re more likely to pass small bills instead of a full overhaul of ACA. Let’s hope McCain is able to return after chemo. He was the deciding vote last week. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/72 "2017-07-31T11:12:09Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Perhaps the Democrats can pass a few bills to stabilize ACA? > > Republican Collins suggested starting with a bill to stabilize the insurance markets. > > There’s three Republicans that said No to gutting ACA. How many more would be needed to pass this first bill? Maybe four or five would stick their neck out and vote yes? > > They’re more likely to pass small bills instead of a full overhaul. I could imagine this theoretically being possible, except for three little problems: 1. No way is McConnell going to let that happen, and good luck fixing these problems with just reconciliation (and can you even call reconciliation without the senate majority leader on board?). So we’re going to face an endless filibuster and it will go nowhere. 2. The house passed the AHCA. They’re sure as hell not going to pass a bill “fixing” Obamacare. You don’t have as slim of a margin, and you don’t have anywhere near as many rational people. 3. Donald Trump has made his opinion clear on numerous occasions: “Let Obamacare Fail”. You _really_ think he’s gonna put this past his desk without a veto? I expect him to do everything he can from the executive to hobble and harm Obamacare. “Let’s fix the existing law so that it works better and doesn’t collapse catastrophically” is a rational, reasonable plan that might help salvage our current health-care system without having to revert to a free market where everything is broken. And because of that, you will never in a million years get the core of republican politicians (or, more importantly, their base) to go along with it. ---
**Author:** ![Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Living_Well_Is_Best_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593/73 "2017-07-31T13:47:24Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Perhaps the Democrats can pass a few bills to stabilize ACA? > > Republican Collins suggested starting with a bill to stabilize the insurance markets. > > There’s three Republicans that said No to gutting ACA. How many more would be needed to pass this first bill? Maybe four or five would stick their neck out and vote yes? > > They’re more likely to pass small bills instead of a full overhaul of ACA. > > Let’s hope McCain is able to return after chemo. He was the deciding vote last week. You are being extremely naive. Trump would veto immediately. His goal as president is to destroy Obama’s legacy. He doesn’t care about ordinary people. He sees this as a game. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-possibility-that-well-get-a-bipartisan-health-care-bill/791593.md?page=3)