# Is this a decent list of SF reads? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 8, 2006, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535 "2006-03-08T13:51:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/21 "2006-03-08T17:02:58Z")
> [@ddgryphon](#): > > You know of course that this phrase will never catch on. No worse than Tapioca Dextrin’s “crammed full of dick” 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/22 "2006-03-08T17:20:24Z")
> [@Tapioca Dextrin](#): > > and the list is crammed full of Dick, > [@CalMeacham](#): > > Still. One Heinlein and all those PK Dicks seems — unbalanced. > [@Scumpup](#): > > Too much Dick. Mr. Brown: It’s all about this cooze who’s a regular fuck machine, I’m talking morning, day, night, afternoon, dick, dick, dick, dick, dick, dick, dick, dick, dick. Mr. Blue: How many dicks is that? Mr. White: A lot. > [@Stark Raven Mad](#): > > Douglas Adams’ stuff was meant to be funny, but that doesn’t make it any less steeped in the genre. Any list of SF Greats without at least the first book in his Hitchhiker series is incomplete, IMO. I totally agree. Actually, make that the first three books, plus _Dirk Gently’s Holistic Detective Agency_. There are endless references to relativity, quantum physics, evolution, et cetera. Despite the humor, Douglas deserves to be lumped in with the best of the hard SF authors. I don’t think a canonical list of good SF would be complete without at least a mention of Harry Harrison, and it ought to include at least a few books from Steven Baxter’s Xeelee Sequence. And yeah, _The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress_ is a must, even if you’re not a Heinlein fan. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![ddgryphon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8c91f0/32.png) [@ddgryphon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ddgryphon)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/23 "2006-03-08T17:27:52Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > No worse than Tapioca Dextrin’s “crammed full of dick” 😛 Actually, I could see that one catching on: Did you read that last report? Yeah, man was that crammed full of dick. Or How was the party? Great, just crammed full of dick and happening! In fact, this is a great phrase I may co-opt for a character in a script I’m working on. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/24 "2006-03-08T17:31:19Z")
It’s a UK list, which means it’s skewed towards British authors as well. I’d dump most of the Dick, Ballard, Aldiss, Delany, and Vance. Add a lot more Asimov, Clarke, Heinlein, Smith etc. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/25 "2006-03-08T17:45:15Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Asimov, Heinlein, and Clarke are probably still in print by other publishers in the UK. Their omission has nothing to do with their quality, just the problems of getting the rights to their books. That will skew against authors whose books are in print. I’m tempted to start a separate thread on the list of _Fantasy_ Masterworks that that page links to; but that list _really_ suffers from this restriction, it looks like. (No Tolkien, for example, amongst other glaring omissions.) ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/26 "2006-03-08T17:46:55Z")
It’s a list of very good SF, but it’s hardly definitive. More someone’s personal preferences, based on what was popular in the UK in the late '60’s early '70’s. I’d add more hard SF and ease back on the Dick. I love PKD but some of his books are hardly SF at all. (Valis, 3 Stigmata, A Scanner Darkly.) ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/27 "2006-03-08T17:52:10Z")
It’s a list of very good SF, but it’s hardly definitive. More someone’s personal preferences, based on what was popular in the UK in the late '60’s early '70’s. I’d add more hard SF and ease back on the Dick. I love PKD but some of his books are hardly SF at all. (Valis, 3 Stigmata, A Scanner Darkly.) ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/28 "2006-03-08T17:58:32Z")
> [@Tapioca Dextrin](#): > > crammed full of Dick Admit it, you did that on purpose . . . ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/29 "2006-03-08T18:54:12Z")
Interesting that after I complained about how few women were on the list, more than a dozen Dopers have posted and not one mentioned a single woman’s name. Do they just know their audience or is it a chicken and egg thing? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/30 "2006-03-08T19:04:13Z")
Name 10 great female SF writers. Good luck. The list is biased towards males because there are, and have been more males in the field, and more great males in the field. Face it, a number of female authors make lists like this one just because the list-makers want “diversity.” It is a moot point in the end anyway because such lists are always subjective, and arguing over tastes in SF is just as stupid as arguing over tastes in music or food. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/31 "2006-03-08T19:04:45Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > Interesting that after I complained about how few women were on the list, more than a dozen Dopers have posted and not one mentioned a single woman’s name. > > Do they just know their audience or is it a chicken and egg thing? List the older Science Fiction Writers that are Female. Anne McCaffrey and Marion Zimmer Bradley are more Fantasy then Sci-Fi. Ursula K. Le Guin was on the list. Susan Cooper is Fantasy. Phyllis Gottlieb is a little obscure but could have made the list. She doesn’t even have a wiki article. For whatever reason the female authors tended to Fantasy more than Science Fiction. The newer generation has many more Female Sci-Fi authors but you are hard pressed to find major authors in the 30’s to 60’s. Jim ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/32 "2006-03-08T19:18:42Z")
Boy, how soon they forget **Catherine L. Moore** and **Leigh Brackett** had their own “Best of…” collections. Leigh Brackett wrote the script for **The Empire Strikes Back** , fer cryin’ out loud! **Kate Wilhelm** and **le Guin** are on the list. \*\*James Tiptree, Jr. \*\* ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/33 "2006-03-08T19:24:00Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Boy, how soon they forget > **Catherine L. Moore** and **Leigh Brackett** had their own “Best of…” collections. Leigh Brackett wrote the script for **The Empire Strikes Back** , fer cryin’ out loud! > **Kate Wilhelm** and **le Guin** are on the list. > \*\*James Tiptree, Jr. \*\* You didn’t name 10 for \*\*Silenus \*\* and Leigh is too recent for my criteria. 😉 Jim ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/34 "2006-03-08T19:25:44Z")
> [@Larry Borgia](#): > > It’s a list of very good SF, but it’s hardly definitive. More someone’s personal preferences, based on what was popular in the UK in the late '60’s early '70’s. I’d add more hard SF and ease back on the Dick. I love PKD but some of his books are hardly SF at all. (Valis, 3 Stigmata, A Scanner Darkly.) I don’t think that this list is meant to be definitive. It’s just a publisher’s list of SF works that the publisher a) thinks should remain in print and b) that the publisher could get the right to republish. There are many books that I’d love to see reprinted, and maybe they will be. I’ve read the majority of the books on this particluar list, and most of what I read, I enjoyed. I’d say that anyone who enjoyed science fiction would probably find the list worthwhile. I’m not saying that an SF fan should buy all the books, just that the list is something to keep in mind while browsing in the library. I think that this is a good thing for the publisher to do, not just in terms of making money, but in the sense that the publisher is reprinting some of the old classics so that young readers can have them, and so that older readers can replace old copies, or buy copies that they originally borrowed from the library. Many of these titles are rather hard to find even used. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/35 "2006-03-08T19:31:05Z")
> [@](#): > > You didn’t name 10 for Silenus and Leigh is too recent for my criteria. > > Jim _RECENT???_ Brackett started publishing in 1940. What’re your standards? > **[Leigh Brackett](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leigh_Brackett)** > > Leigh Douglass Brackett (December 7, 1915 – March 18, 1978) was an American science fiction writer called "the Queen of Space Opera." She was also a screenwriter known for The Big Sleep (1946), Rio Bravo (1959), and The Long Goodbye (1973). She also worked on an early draft of The Empire Strikes Back (1980), elements of which remained in the film; she died before the film went into production. She was the first woman shortlisted for the Hugo Award. In 2020, she won a Retro Hugo for her novel T Le... ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/36 "2006-03-08T19:36:38Z")
Sticking only to women not on the list who were novel finalists for the Hugo or Nebula Awards pre-1985 (for classic): C. J. Cherryh, R. A. MacAvoy, Julian May, Joan D. Vinge, Patricia A. McKillip, Vonda M. McIntyre, James Tiptree Jr., Anne McCaffrey, Marion Zimmer Bradley, Andre Norton, Suzy McKee Charnas, Marta Randall, Tanith Lee, Katherine MacLean, Joanna Russ. You could add C. L. Moore, Octavia Butler, Leigh Brackett, Wilmar Shiras, Jo Clayton, Suzette Haden Elgin, Lee Killough, Elizabeth Lynn, Doris Piserchia, Kit Reed, Lisa Tuttle, and Chelsea Quinn Yarbro. You can quibble about whether some of them wrote only fantasy or whatever (so did Ray Bradbury and Richard Matheson), and of course the field was historically male-dominated. But 17 to 1 male? And I gotta love the comment that females could only make the list for reasons of “diversity”. I think that answers my question better than any direct answer could. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/37 "2006-03-08T19:42:51Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > C. J. Cherryh, R. A. MacAvoy, Julian May, **Joan D. Vinge** , Patricia A. McKillip, **Vonda M. McIntyre** , James Tiptree Jr., **Anne McCaffrey** , **Marion Zimmer Bradley** , **Andre Norton** , Suzy McKee Charnas, Marta Randall, Tanith Lee, Katherine MacLean, Joanna Russ. > > You could add C. L. Moore, Octavia Butler, Leigh Brackett, Wilmar Shiras, Jo Clayton, Suzette Haden Elgin, Lee Killough, Elizabeth Lynn, Doris Piserchia, Kit Reed, Lisa Tuttle, and Chelsea Quinn Yarbro. I would consider the bolded ones to be “great.” The others may be good (or not). Depends on taste, as I said. Personally, I think any list that has Delany on it to be suspect from the get go. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/38 "2006-03-08T19:46:21Z")
It’s pointless to complain about omissions. This is not a list of best SF novels of all time; it’s a list of classic SF books that this particular company is reprinting. Books are left off the list for many reasons: 1. The book is still in print with another publisher. This is true of Heinlein, Asimov, Verne, (even though he’s PD, there are many editions of his work currently available in the UK) and Douglas Adams. 2. The publisher was unable to obtain the rights to print the book. 3. The author or his/her estate asked for more money than the publisher was willing to pay. 4. The publisher felt that, though the book was good, it was too little known and probably wasn’t going to sell well enough to be profitable. 5. The publisher is British and thus may not be aware of some of the more obscure US science fiction authors and books. So there’s no point is complaining about omissions. It’s a pretty good list considering. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/39 "2006-03-08T19:46:30Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > _RECENT???_ > > Brackett started publishing in 1940. What’re your standards? > > [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leigh\_Brackett](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leigh_Brackett) Forgive me, please consider ignorance fought. I will gladly concede Ms. Brackett to you. > [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > Sticking only to women not on the list who were novel finalists for the Hugo or Nebula Awards pre-1985 (for classic): > > C. J. Cherryh, **R. A. MacAvoy, Julian May** , Joan D. Vinge, **Patricia A. McKillip** , Vonda M. McIntyre, James Tiptree Jr., Anne **McCaffrey, Marion Zimmer Bradley, Andre Norton** , Suzy McKee Charnas, Marta Randall, **Tanith Lee** , Katherine MacLean, Joanna Russ. > > You could add C. L. Moore, Octavia Butler, Leigh Brackett, Wilmar Shiras, Jo Clayton, Suzette Haden Elgin, Lee Killough, **Elizabeth Lynn** , Doris Piserchia, Kit Reed, Lisa Tuttle, and **Chelsea Quinn Yarbro**. > > You can quibble about whether some of them wrote only fantasy or whatever (so did Ray Bradbury and Richard Matheson), and of course the field was historically male-dominated. But 17 to 1 male? > > And I gotta love the comment that females could only make the list for reasons of “diversity”. I think that answers my question better than any direct answer could. 😃 So many of the authors you listed are considered Fantasy authors rather than Sci-Fi. I love many of the authors, but I would put them in a list of essential Fantasy and not Science Fiction. I bolded the authors I would consider Fantasy writers. I underlined the ones I am ignorant of. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535/40 "2006-03-08T20:01:10Z")
> [@What Exit?](#): > > . > > So many of the authors you listed are considered Fantasy authors rather than Sci-Fi. I love many of the authors, but I would put them in a list of essential Fantasy and not Science Fiction. I bolded the authors I would consider Fantasy writers. Most of Tanith Lee’s output has been fantasy, but her first two were quite fun little sci-fi romps. No love for Connie Willis :)? - Tamerlane [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-decent-list-of-sf-reads/347535.md?page=3)