# Is this an anti-semetic cartoon or not? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 12, 2001, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744 "2001-04-12T19:46:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SuaSponte](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/67e7ee/32.png) [@SuaSponte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuaSponte)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2001, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/21 "2001-04-12T23:27:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by cmkeller \* > \*\*Didn’t seem to me to be any more anti-Semitic to me than the premise of Christianity in general. \*\* So, is it anti-Semitic or not? Sua ---
**Author:** ![RTA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b4bc9f/32.png) [@RTA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTA)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2001, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/22 "2001-04-12T23:57:39Z")
It seems pretty obvious to me that it is **not** “anti-Semitic”. I didn’t see the “call for the destruction of Judaism” that the JDL claims to have seen - not even a “Christ-killer” reference (and on Easter, no less)! However, if you know anything about the comics, you know that Johnny Hart has always been a proselytizing, God-Squad idiot, second only to Bil Keane in preachiness - and much like _The Family Circus, B.C._ (“Before Christ”, for those who forgot) has never ever, in my memory, been remotely funny. It’s just not a funny comic strip. Never a smile to be had. “Garfield” is funnier. My conclusion: This is a great opportunity for those who frown on people who try to force their religion on others. I have always been offended by Ned Flanders-esque comic artists trying to sneak their horseshit Gospel into my newspaper’s funny pages. So in the spirit of brotherhood with all my Jewish friends, I will make a petition to the local newspaper that carries _B.C._ to demand that this “anti-Semitic abomination” be cancelled, or else I will be cancelling my (non-existent in the real world) subscription. ---
**Author:** ![socialxray](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/35a633/32.png) [@socialxray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/socialxray)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/23 "2001-04-13T00:28:47Z")
**being this is the straight dope…** I’m a bit surprised no one’s called into question that it might be a forgery. I mean, yeah, it looks really similar to Johnny Hart’s drawing style (which resembles some Jack Chick drawings…hmm…) but is there a possibility it’s a fake just produced to rile people up? If it’s a Sunday strip why is it not in colour like all Sunday strips are? Can the JDL not afford a good enough scanner? 😛 Just wonderin’. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/24 "2001-04-13T00:52:43Z")
According to [http://www.poynter.org/medianews/](http://www.poynter.org/medianews/) "B.C. creator Johnny Hart says the panel is meant to pay tribute to Christians and Jews. “I sincerely apologize if I have offended any readers, and I also sincerely hope that this cartoon will generate increased interest in religious awareness.” There is a bit in the Washington Times as well… [http://www.washtimes.com/culture/default-2001412212226.htm](http://www.washtimes.com/culture/default-2001412212226.htm) ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/25 "2001-04-13T01:11:11Z")
Meant to pay tribute to Christians and Jews? You got an odd way of paying tribute to Jews, Mr. Hart. Did you seriously think they’d be thrilled at having one of their spiritual symbols extinguished and triumphantly transformed into a symbol of an entirely different religious group? Jerk. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/26 "2001-04-13T01:25:37Z")
If the situation were reversed (a popular Jewish cartoonist publishes a strip showing the flame of Christianity burning out and the crucifix as symbol of the “false Messiah” being transformed into a menorah), I doubt that Christians would be amused. This strip fits in with the practice of some Christians who denigrate other religions and assume that their followers are heathens to be converted. But I don’t believe the mainstream buys into Hart’s brand of gross offensiveness. As to the claim that he is “paying tribute” to Christians _and_ Jews, he is either demented or a lying sack of frankincense. B.C. has increasingly focused on proselytizing at the expense of humor. I hope this strip appears as scheduled and spurs editors to move B.C. to a more appropriate venue - the religion or editorial pages. Just think - Doonesbury, Mallard Fillmore and B.C. side by side in the editorial section. That would be truly pro-“semetic”; i.e. it would make me barf. ---
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/27 "2001-04-13T01:55:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RTA \* > **_B.C._ (“Before Christ”, for those who forgot)** I haven’t forgotten, though it seems Johnny Hart has. Someone explain to me how Christ fits into a comic strip called “B.C.”? I think the strip USED to be funny, but not any more. ---
**Author:** ![jshore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b5e925/32.png) [@jshore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jshore)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/28 "2001-04-13T02:37:22Z")
Someone once told me that, just as the Christian religion views itself as growing out of Judaism but bringing it to a higher level, Islam views itself as growing out of Christianity (and Judaism) and bringing to a higher level. I.e., Islam recognizes Abraham and Jesus as some sort of prophets but Mohammed as the final and greatest one. I’m too ignorant of Islam to know if this interpretation is correct, but if it is…Can we expect to see a sequel to this strip? And, if we did, what kind of reaction do you think that would generate in Middle America!?! (That being said, I have to agree with others who say that the JDL rhetoric is way overblown. Most religions seem to be pretty much all about saying that ours is the one right way and everyone else’s is wrong. That’s one of the things that annoys me about all of them…And makes those that don’t [or, at least don’t to as large a degree] like Unitarianism and Quakerism so refreshing.) ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/29 "2001-04-13T02:50:25Z")
Ok there are obviously some rabid, to hell-with-religion atheists here in The Straightdope. Now, as for the strip, I find it curious, as someone mentioned before, that there is extensive numerology in the strip, as well as the Judaic and Christendom symbols and messages. Numerology and other forms of diviniation is proscribed in both Judaism abd Christianity. Perhaps his juxtaposition of the symbols of Western religion and the old ways, related to Jesus Christ’s final hours as a man on Earth, became a lot more hybrid and intregrated than he intended, and as a result his message of tracking the path from Judaism to Christianity got lost in the process. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/30 "2001-04-13T03:09:52Z")
Is it preachy? Yes. Is it awkward and, perhaps, tacky? Yes. Is it anti-Jewish? No. And I am sad to say that I find the JDL becoming more like the Catholic League each year: shrilling screaming about silly things that it could safely ignore and becoming a parody of the original organization that was committed to defending Jewish people and the Jewish faith from genuine attacks. ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/31 "2001-04-13T03:12:17Z")
It’s the burning cross thing. I have no idea who Johnny Hart is or anything, but burning crosses make me shiver. That next-to-last image in that comic strip is very, very bad, whether he meant it to be so or not. My instinct tells me he meant it to be so. Comics are a visual medium, this guy’s been at it for years, and I have a hard time convincing myself that a highly experienced visual artist would put a burning cross into his work without knowing exactly what it means. Especially here in the U.S. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/32 "2001-04-13T03:53:49Z")
Hunh. I was raised evangelical Christian, so I get where he’s coming from. I don’t think he means to be anti-Jewish. He’s drawing the image of Christ’s Cross out of the Passover menorah, which is fair enough. Jesus was a Jew, executed on Passover by a Jewish government in collaboration with the pagan Romans. His roots were Jewish, his (posthumous) title of “Christ” a form of “Messiah”–i.e., King of the Jews. Judaism & Christianity are not entirely separate religions. And not all Christians are anti-Semitic ignoramuses. ---
**Author:** ![Kyomara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8edcca/32.png) [@Kyomara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyomara)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/33 "2001-04-13T03:55:24Z")
You’re all forgetting something really important: Johnny Hart isn’t smart enough to pull off an anti-semitic comic strip like this. I think the guy was trying to find a way to represent both Judaism and Christianity in the strip, since both have a relation to the Easter story. He probably thought he had hit on something really profound when he saw a cross hiding in the Menorah. The problem was the execution. All he wanted was a way to demonstrate this hidden cross and this hidden connection, and didn’t consider the fact (duh) that BURNING the menorah just might seem offensive to some folks. I seriously doubt he intended any message of “Christianity is better” or something. I think he is just a really really bad writer and fucked up when he tried to express himself. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/34 "2001-04-13T04:09:20Z")
And, not to be overly pedantic, but where he says “The last seven `words' of Jesus", shouldn't that be "The last seven `sound bites’ of Jesus”? ---
**Author:** ![Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df788c/32.png) [@Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/35 "2001-04-13T04:34:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by cmkeller \* > \*\*Didn’t seem to me to be any more anti-Semitic to me than the premise of Christianity in general. \*\* I would have to agree, to an extent- Johnny Hart believes that Christianity is the fulfillment of Judaism. He made a cartoon expressing that belief. If that’s anti-Semitic, then Christianity is inherently anti-Semitic. I’m reminded of the complaints over the “Holy Land” theme park. Jewish activists expressed shock that evangelical fundamentalist Christians would actually make a big statement that Christianity is the fulfillment of Judaism. As the fellow at the Skeptic’s Dictionary remarked, what do these guys want? A Christian theme park which portrays Christianity as a heretical offshoot of Judaism? -Ben ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/36 "2001-04-13T04:46:36Z")
> [@](#): > > And I am sad to say that I find the JDL becoming more like the Catholic League each year: shrilling screaming about silly things that it could safely ignore and becoming a parody of the original organization that was committed to defending Jewish people and the Jewish faith from genuine attacks. Hell, what do you expect from an organization founded by the late, unlamented Meir Kahane. > [@](#): > > I would have to agree, to an extent- Johnny Hart believes that Christianity is the fulfillment of Judaism. He made a cartoon expressing that belief. If that’s anti-Semitic, then Christianity is inherently anti-Semitic. That’s true, and I respect their doctrine, even when it conflicts with mine. You go to your churches, we’ll go to our temples, and all will be right with the world. But consider this - what if a Jewish artist drew a strip portraying Christ as a rabble-rousing, heretical demagogue who got what he deserved? What would Christians say to that? ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/37 "2001-04-13T04:47:13Z")
It is entirely possible that Johnny Hart is only vaugely aware that there are real live Jews today. I don’t know where he is located, but one thing I have noticed about evangelical Christians here in the South (with it’s small jewish population) is that they tend to think of Judiaism as a “historic” religion–it is something you learn about so that you can understand the bible. Actual Jews are assumed to be few and far between, historical anachronisms and really not a big issue either way. It may simply not have occured to him that any Jews would read the thing. ---
**Author:** ![Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df788c/32.png) [@Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/38 "2001-04-13T05:16:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Alessan \* > \*\*But consider this - what if a Jewish artist drew a strip portraying Christ as a rabble-rousing, heretical demagogue who got what he deserved? What would Christians say to that? \*\* But that’s grossly unlike what the strip actually portrayed. There’s a difference between “that demagogue got what he deserved” and “isn’t it wonderful that God’s plan was brought to fulfillment?” Hart presented Judaism in a much better light than you present Christianity in your hypothetical example. Hart doesn’t even seem to be trying to argue that Judaism is false- it’s very different from, for example, Hart writing a strip which shows the Koran withering before the blazing light of the Cross. In the latter example, the inclusion of the Koran could only result from a desire by the cartoonist to decry Islam. In Hart’s example, Judaism is brought in because he considers it to have been an essential part of God’s interaction with humanity. Suppose Hart had drawn a comic which did nothing more than portray Jesus as being Jewish. Would you find that anti-semitic? After all, that would imply that Judaism must be a false religion. -Ben ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/39 "2001-04-13T05:28:48Z")
> [@](#): > > Suppose Hart had drawn a comic which did nothing more than portray Jesus as being Jewish. Would you find that anti-semitic? After all, that would imply that Judaism must be a false religion I don’t exactly follow your train of logic here (who would ever deny that Jesus was Jewish?) but no, I wouldn’t find that as being offensive. I admit that my hypothetical was somewhat exaggerated, and hardly a perfect analogy. Still, I don’t see the strip to be as inoffensive as you do; in my eyes, he’s showing Judaism slowly dying out and being replaced by the new, improve Judaism 2.0: Christianity. I can accept that as being Christian belief - if they didn’t believe in the One, Absolute Truth then it wouldn’t be organized religeon - but there’s such a thing as tact. ---
**Author:** ![Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df788c/32.png) [@Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2001, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744/40 "2001-04-13T05:50:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Alessan \* > \*\*I don’t exactly follow your train of logic here (who would ever deny that Jesus was Jewish?) but no, I wouldn’t find that as being offensive. \*\* My logic is that he would be implying that God used to be Jewish, but he decided to drop it in favor of something better. In other words, to portray Jesus as Jewish is to make precisely the statement which Hart made. > [@](#): > > \*\* > I admit that my hypothetical was somewhat exaggerated, and hardly a perfect analogy. Still, I don’t see the strip to be as inoffensive as you do; in my eyes, he’s showing Judaism slowly dying out and being replaced by the new, improve Judaism 2.0: Christianity. I can accept that as being Christian belief - if they didn’t believe in the One, Absolute Truth then it wouldn’t be organized religeon - but there’s such a thing as tact. \*\* I don’t follow you here. What would have been the tactful course for Hart to take? -Ben [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-an-anti-semetic-cartoon-or-not/61744.md?page=3)