# Is this article racist? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 11, 2008, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617 "2008-06-11T20:53:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![blinkingblinking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ea5d25/32.png) [@blinkingblinking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blinkingblinking)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/1 "2008-06-11T20:53:42Z")
[Embrace irritable vowel syndrome](http://www.theage.com.au/news/tv--radio/embrace-irritable-vowel-syndrome/2008/06/05/1212259005476.html) Aussies make a lot of jokes about Kiwis. New Zealanders make a lot of jokes about Australians. It is supposed to be all in good fun. The height of Australian culture is the sheep joke. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/2 "2008-06-11T21:11:54Z")
“New Zealand: Australia’s Canada” – [_America: The Book,_](http://www.amazon.com/Daily-Show-Stewart-Presents-America/dp/0713998946/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1213218687&sr=1-2) by John Stewart ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/3 "2008-06-11T21:23:32Z")
Seems like satire to me. Besides, “New Zealand” is not a race. Did you mean was it bigoted? ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/4 "2008-06-11T21:26:05Z")
[QUOTE=blinkingblinking] The height of Australian culture is the sheep joke. [/QUOTE] And, of course, sheep are grown in both Oz and NZ, which is part of the joke. You make jokes about people who are like you, but with the subtle differences that outsiders don’t notice. That’s why Australians have jokes about NZers, but don’t so much about Papua New Guineans or Indonesians, who are much closer neighbours. And then there are the jokes about rivalry about the different Australian states, and especially between Sydney and Melbourne – a rivalry that was so imprtant that they had to build the national capital in a sheep paddock well away from both cities. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/5 "2008-06-11T21:46:24Z")
The article is, I _think_, a review (or at least a recommendation to watch) of _Flight of the Conchords_. It may help you to know that a recurring gag in that show involves the two NZ’er main characters finding themselves victims of anti-NZ’er bigotry. It’s played for quasi-absurd comic effect. It appears to me the article you’ve linked to intends to play along with this gag–though on the whole it (the article’s attempt at this kind of humor) is way overdone. -FrL- ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/6 "2008-06-11T23:11:19Z")
[QUOTE=blinkingblinking] The height of Australian culture is the sheep joke. [/QUOTE] Too bad it’s an unoriginal joke. The English have been making the same cracks about the Scots and the Welsh for years. Here in the U.S., we just substitute the Kiwis with people from Montana, Wyoming, Oklahoma, or anyplace south of the Mason-Dixon line or Ohio River (regardless of whether there’s actually a large sheep population or not). ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/7 "2008-06-12T01:02:47Z")
Definitely somewhat heavy-handed satire and humour. I particularly like the last line: “Sure, we hang it on our cousins across the ditch but we love 'em. But not like they love sheep. The way we love beer. Because we’re not freaks. Who shag sheep.” ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/8 "2008-06-12T01:08:33Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Besides, “New Zealand” is not a race. [/QUOTE] It is if you think it is. No, I’m not kidding. ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/9 "2008-06-12T03:27:16Z")
[QUOTE=RickJay] No, I’m not kidding. [/QUOTE] Really? I’m happy to argue for “New Zealander” as a distinct ethnicity… but not as a race. Wikipedia has a [breakdown of ethnic groups](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_New_Zealand#Ethnic_groups) in New Zealand; Statistics New Zealand does not collect “race” data, only [ethnicity (culture & identity)](http://www.stats.govt.nz/census/2006-census-data/quickstats-about-culture-identity/quickstats-about-culture-and-identity.htm) as part of our census. (The 2006 census was the first time that “New Zealander” was an official category… not to say that many people, myself included, had not checked “Other” and then hand-written in New Zealander on a previous census). ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/10 "2008-06-12T03:30:57Z")
[QUOTE=Apollyon] Really? I’m happy to argue for “New Zealander” as a distinct ethnicity… but not as a race. [/QUOTE] “Race” is a sociological construct. A group of humans is a race because other humans (or themselves) consider it a race. It’s not long ago that it was commonplace for people to consider the Irish a “race.” Jews have been considered their own “race.” The word “race” is often used to describe what you, in 2008, would consider a nationality; you’ll hear about the “French race” or “English race,” all of which is quite acceptable linguistically, and biologically makes as much (or as little) sense as any other qualifier. And while a white guy like me can’t see a lot of difference between Hutu and Tutsi, they sure do. ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/11 "2008-06-12T04:59:58Z")
[QUOTE=RickJay] The word “race” is often used to describe what you, in 2008, would consider a nationality… [/quote] What I “in 2008, would consider a nationality”… ermmm… you’re somehow posting from the 19th century? 😃 > [@](#): > > …you’ll hear about the “French race” or “English race,” all of which is quite acceptable linguistically, and biologically makes as much (or as little) sense as any other qualifier. OK, happy to accept “race” as linguistically acceptable then, provided were talking in that vein (as opposed to specifying in some form physical characteristics). > [@](#): > > And while a white guy like me can’t see a lot of difference between Hutu and Tutsi, they sure do. But would anyone describe the Hutu or Tutsi as “races”? As opposed to “ethnicities” or “ethnic groups”? ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 9:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/12 "2008-06-12T09:56:11Z")
Can I just say that as a Limey I totally recommend Flight of the Conchords,its hilarious and original. ---
**Author:** ![sandra\_nz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eada6e/32.png) [@sandra\_nz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sandra_nz)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 10:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/13 "2008-06-12T10:08:07Z")
Didn’t see anything racist in the article. And buy Flight of the Conchords DVDs. It’s an awesome show. Rilly. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/14 "2008-06-12T10:50:44Z")
…it takes a thread like this to bring out the Kiwis! With respect to the article: how dare those Aussies treat us like second class citizens: I’m a person, the people on this message board are persons, that person over there is a person, and each person deserves to be treated like a person. [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/zs_rXxi0zhM/hqdefault.jpg "Flight of the Conchords - Racism") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zs_rXxi0zhM) As to the author of the article, Brett and Jermaine would probably like to do this: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/IBG8UtgD0m8/hqdefault.jpg "Flippin' the bird at the Australian Embassy") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBG8UtgD0m8) 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-article-racist/452617/15 "2008-06-12T12:10:57Z")
Having not seen any of Flight of the Conchords (hangs head in shame), but having now followed **Banquet Bear** ’s links and viewed some related videos methinks the OP is perhaps not exactly a serious question. Very amusing stuff. (Particularly as, in real life, I’ve had someone tell me NZ is a Scandinavian country) 😃