# Is this bestiality, and if so should it be illegal? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 17, 2009, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134 "2009-10-17T11:48:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/41 "2009-10-18T15:58:55Z")
> [@beo.thuck](#): > > “Is this bestiality, and ought it be illegal?” > > Yes if it results in orgasm, otherwise maybe? Well, that just goes back to the “how” problem, namely the only way to gather this kind of information is from the alleged criminal. And if a human can take the 5th, does that mean the dog has to take the 35th? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/42 "2009-10-18T16:48:49Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > | thought it was Carter, not Clinton, who was into peanut butter. Yes, but only in his heart. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/43 "2009-10-18T16:53:22Z")
I thought the dog n’ peanut butter thing had happened only on **Nip/Tuck**. ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/44 "2009-10-18T19:54:41Z")
Really? Man I need to start watching that show. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/45 "2009-10-18T20:15:46Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > I’m under the impression that humping for dominance is a lot different than humping to get off. A dog might hump another male to show him what’s up, but he’s not gonna try to actually fuck him. Maybe some bestiality vids are that, but most include penetration, knotting and/or ejaculation, usually with the dog going at his own pace. > > As for training, yes, I’m to understand there is some of that. I’ve also read plenty about women not even trying to do this sorta thing at first and their pet being quite curious about um…yeah. I’m turning into “that guy,” aren’t I? Is it a male/female thing, though? That is, if a guy wanted a male dog to penetrate him, would it be harder than a woman trying to get a male dog to penetrate her? Does the dog see its owner as female and therefore as sexier than a guy owner? Or do they not really differentiate? I mean, I don’t know a male from a female dog without looking at the genitals. > [@cwthree](#): > > Serious question, not directed specifically at **miss elizabeth** : Why should sexual satisfaction be a special case? Is it unethical for me to ride my horse because it pleases me, even when it’s not her idea of a good time? What if I go in the paddock to pet her nice, soft nose when she’d rather be grazing? Consider, too, that if she opposed either activity (riding or petting), she’s quite capable of withholding “consent.” She could toss me off her back or walk away, and there’s not a lot I could do about it. That she does neither of these implies consent, although it does not imply any significant understanding of anything beyond “it feels good/bad at this moment.” That is a good point. And I don’t know if the horse really can comprehend that. That is, there’s no way of communicating to the horse, “I’m only riding you to get off.” The horse isn’t going to really know or care or be disturbed. Unless you’re savagely beating it or trying to hurt it. It’s not thinking, “Ewww, he was thinking about SEX when he was riding me? Brain bleach, please.” > [@](#): > > I think this is an important difference versus the hypothetical “what if **Cesario** came over” situation that you described. Even though no physical harm occurs, the child might look back on the situation later and feel embarrassed or exploited. A non-human animal, on the other hand, isn’t likely to feel that way (indeed, it may be incapable of feeling that way) if no injury, pain or distress was involved. Are there any situations where the child just couldn’t know? Okay, I guess if you have a skeevy uncle and the uncle is always saying stuff like, “Come sit on my lap!” or “Come dance for me!” Is dancing or sitting on a relative’s lap inherently sexy? No, but I’ve heard a lot of people tell stories about weird uncles who just felt off. If you’re a pedophile and no one knows and you’re not the one asking the kid to dance, is it a problem? Like say you’re a pedophile, you know that Sally’s a good little tap dancer, and you come over for dinner one night and her mom’s all, “Come show us what you learned today,” and you find it gratifying…is that wrong? ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/46 "2009-10-18T22:07:23Z")
> [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](#): > > Really? Man I need to start watching that show. It was Melissa Gilbert and a Rottweiller, as I recall. Hard to forget! ---
**Author:** ![yoyodyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a9a28c/32.png) [@yoyodyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yoyodyne)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2009, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/47 "2009-10-18T22:25:25Z")
To add to the OP: Does your answer change if the animal is prepubescent? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/48 "2009-10-19T00:46:42Z")
I’m surprised no one’s brought up Catherine the Great yet… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/49 "2009-10-19T00:48:39Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I’m surprised no one’s brought up Catherine the Great yet… Well that was a horse of a different color. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/50 "2009-10-19T19:52:14Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > You don’t think the Bible or other holy scriptures are valid on this issue so therefore the basis of morality would be what humans generally agree on is immoral. [Most humans believe atheism is immoral.](http://www.soc.umn.edu/~hartmann/files/atheist%20as%20the%20other.pdf)\* Does that make atheism objectively immoral? And more to the point, would that justify outlawing atheism? Warning: pdf. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/51 "2009-10-20T02:22:09Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > [Most humans believe atheism is immoral.](http://www.soc.umn.edu/~hartmann/files/atheist%20as%20the%20other.pdf)\* Does that make atheism objectively immoral? And more to the point, would that justify outlawing atheism? > > Warning: pdf. Banning atheism would be violating the First Amendment and most people do not wish to outlaw it, they only disagree with atheists. It’s different from this issue. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/52 "2009-10-20T05:51:12Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Banning atheism would be violating the First Amendment and most people do not wish to outlaw it, they only disagree with atheists. It’s different from this issue. How is it different? If morality is simply an issue of popular opinion, and immorality is sufficient reason to outlaw something, why should atheism not be outlawed? ---
**Author:** ![CutterJohn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/91b2a8/32.png) [@CutterJohn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CutterJohn)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/53 "2009-10-20T16:19:33Z")
Using animals in almost any fashion that is not overly cruel is legal. Hell, one can shove a giant, 2ft long, electric dildo up a bulls ass, shock its prostate to get semen, and sell it. Legal. But you go to jail if you were to stick your dick up the cows ass instead of a dildo? Doesn’t make sense. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/54 "2009-10-21T02:38:34Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > How is it different? If morality is simply an issue of popular opinion, and immorality is sufficient reason to outlaw something, why should atheism not be outlawed? By using your logic the idea that murder is immoral is simply popular opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/55 "2009-10-21T03:09:58Z")
> [@CutterJohn](#): > > Using animals in almost any fashion that is not overly cruel is legal. Hell, one can shove a giant, 2ft long, electric dildo up a bulls ass, shock its prostate to get semen, and sell it. Legal. > > But you go to jail if you were to stick your dick up the cows ass instead of a dildo? Doesn’t make sense. I think it’s just that the bull gets more fun out of the first? ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Dubinsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dbc845/32.png) [@Alex\_Dubinsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alex_Dubinsky)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/56 "2009-10-21T05:49:55Z")
Hey guys, want a [first hand account](http://www.asstr.org/files/FAQs_and_Information/How_to_Have_Sex_with_a_Dog.txt)? It will answer _all_ your questions. > [@](#): > > Women: Have you ever wished you could have- > > - The HOTTEST, most pleasurable, oral and vaginal sex imaginable? > - Simple, PURE physical satisfaction with no strings attached? > - Sex without AIDS or pregnancy fears? > - The privacy of masturbation, but the satisfaction and stimulation of sex? > - A truly HOT, nasty sex experience to share with your significant other? > > If you answered “yes” to any of these, then you should consider having sex with a DOG. Wait, don’t laugh! I am VERY serious. I know it sounds gross, but you really don’t know what you are missing until you’ve tried it. Thousands of women and girls worldwide agree with me (just read the animal sex newsgroups and web pages), and, by all indications, more women are discovering this secret every day. > [@](#): > > So, you have your dog, but how do you get him interested? I suggest that first you get yourself stimulated so that you are producing your natural scent and lubrication. Do this while snuggling with him on the bed or floor so that he can start to smell it. After a few minutes, start with him. Pull the sheath back from his cock and study his cock; get to know it’s shape and size. Work the sheath back and forth over it until it expands a little and begins to stick out of the sheath on its own. (If you have the guts, give it a little suck with your lips!) Then gently take hold of the red shaft between your thumb and finger and move it back and forth. His penis should start to grow a lot then. Masturbate him basically like you would a guy. Once it is fully erect, he should be getting pretty horny. (One important thing to remember when handling a dog: While most men like to have their balls rubbed or this is not so with all dogs. I recommend avoiding his testicles altogether, at least at the start.) ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Dubinsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dbc845/32.png) [@Alex\_Dubinsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alex_Dubinsky)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/57 "2009-10-21T05:56:54Z")
Ooo, I forgot the capper: > [@](#): > > If you own a dog, and don’t have sex with them, think on this; Dogs love sex. They enjoy the sensations of orgasm, and unless you help them to achieve it, cannot achieve it themselves. Think on how frustrated you would be if you couldn’t even masturbate yourself when you were horny. As a dog owner, you have taken the animal from his natural habitat where he would mate at every opportunity if he could, and put him in an environment where sex just isn’t available. If you love your dog, you should extend the gift of sexual release toward him or her. If you have any moral fiber in you, you will jerk off your dog! ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Dubinsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dbc845/32.png) [@Alex\_Dubinsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alex_Dubinsky)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/58 "2009-10-21T05:58:16Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Let me just note that this by no means apocryphal, though I have no idea how prevalent it is. A girl I knew from WoW had some sort of condition that her body was unable to form sufficient muscles for her to be able to do much more than occasionally crawl to the bathroom and back to bed. She would spread something (butter?) on herself so that her cats would lick her. > > This could possibly be the closest she’ll ever get to having a sex life. Dude… what… the… fuck.. Step 1 for growing muscles. STOP PLAYING WOW. Step 2 for getting laid. Post on craigslist re guys who like when girls lie there. Problem solved! ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/59 "2009-10-21T07:20:52Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > I’m under the impression that humping for dominance is a lot different than humping to get off. A dog might hump another male to show him what’s up, but he’s not gonna try to actually fuck him. Maybe some bestiality vids are that, but most include penetration, knotting and/or ejaculation, usually with the dog going at his own pace. > > As for training, yes, I’m to understand there is some of that. I’ve also read plenty about women not even trying to do this sorta thing at first and their pet being quite curious about um…yeah. I’m turning into “that guy,” aren’t I? > > Let’s talk about box turtles! Does anyone want to marry one? Hmm…me thinks you should tell more - I’ve never searched for it (really!), andd would actually be surprised to learn that a dog would undertake and ejaculate to full penetrative sex with a human, or even mastubatory - and morbid curiosity would actually compel me to watch a video (am I sick?) ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134/60 "2009-10-21T16:02:56Z")
Pretty much any time a debate about human/animal relations/ethics comes up I find myself in a quandry. I tend to think of things anthropologically, and the reality is that pretty much every species on the planet has screwed every other species on the planet that they’re capable of screwing(and a few they’re not). Ever since sexual reproduction evolved, the mandate has been “spread it far, spread it wide.” Thus we have budgees mating with their owner’s hands when they reach into the cage to feed them. We have ligers, and tigons, and [humsters](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humster). When it comes to humans exercising control over our domestic animals, it’s even more jacked up and pretty much indefensible. We breed them for all kinds of ridiculously unnatural purposes(anyone want to defend [intentionally breeding deaf cats](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deaf_white_cat)), and if one of them doesn’t turn out in the specially warped way we want, we drown it, or eat it. I mean really? Any idea what happens to animals in labs? Look, in nature if the dog encountered a top tier predator, instead of that predator giving them a tasty treat, a warm place to sleep, medical care, and affection, they’d face the realities of nature and end up as a tasty treat. I just can’t get worked up about bestiality. The most I can rationally justify is researching the connection between using an animal to get off and a lack of empathy for other humans. If there are people out there who don’t care about anything but their own desires, and are willing to manipulate an animal to satisfy them, then who is to say they wouldn’t do the same to a human if the opportunity arose. I’d like to get an answer to that question, but if no significant correlation is discovered, then freak freely. If I were a dog I’d rather be humping my master than his dinner or roadkill. Enjoy, Steven [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-bestiality-and-if-so-should-it-be-illegal/514134.md?page=4)