# Is this claim that Gay concentration camp weren't liberated at the end of WWII? TRUE? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 17, 2016, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229 "2016-03-17T01:52:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/1 "2016-03-17T01:52:38Z")
Is Cracked’s claim that Gay concentration camp (inmates) weren’t liberated at the end of WWII? TRUE? I know Cracked isn’t always the most accurate source. But their historical articles are often intended to be true. This claim about the treatment of Gays at the end of WWII is pretty surprising. I’ve never heard anything about it and I read a lot of material about that era. Those pink badges were obviously photoshopped. [http://i.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/photoshop/4/3/6/516436\_v1.jpg](http://i.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/photoshop/4/3/6/516436_v1.jpg) from this long photoplasty article > **[26 Side By Side Comparisons That Fix Our Image Of History](https://www.cracked.com/pictofacts-460-how-you-picture-history-vs-reality-side-by-side)** > > Winston Churchill's famous speech was recorded nine years after he originally gave it. Can this claim be verified? It’s my understanding that the Germans sorted people as they were off loaded from the trains. Many were killed immediately and some kept alive for labor at the camp. I wonder if accused Gays were even spared death and sent into the camp for labor duties? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/2 "2016-03-17T02:40:53Z")
Well, there’s this, though it isn’t sourced: > **[Hardenet.com is for sale | HugeDomains](https://www.hugedomains.com/domain_profile.cfm?d=hardenet.com)** > > This domain name is available, own it today. Affordable payment options. Fast and professional service. ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/3 "2016-03-17T02:50:01Z")
I don’t know how they run things there, but apparently they have to post some sort of evidence for their photoplasty claims. Here’s the source that was provided by that particular contest winner: [https://www.ushmm.org/learn/students/learning-materials-and-resources/homosexuals-victims-of-the-nazi-era/persecution-of-homosexuals](https://www.ushmm.org/learn/students/learning-materials-and-resources/homosexuals-victims-of-the-nazi-era/persecution-of-homosexuals) Here is their contest posting: [http://forums.cracked.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=141001&start=20#p2760857](http://forums.cracked.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=141001&start=20#p2760857) ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/4 "2016-03-17T03:10:13Z")
The photoplasty entry left out the word some. Otherwise the contest winner’s graphic appears accurate. This is a cite that I find very credible. The US Holocaust Memorial Museum has done extensive research. This is a highly disturbing revelation. That I guess, involved all four occupying powers in Germany. i.e.[the four occupation zones](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied-occupied_Germany). The courts were under their control. Thank you for answering this question for me. > [@](#): > > After the war, homosexual concentration camp prisoners were not acknowledged as victims of Nazi persecution, and reparations were refused. Under the Allied Military Government of Germany, \*\*some \*\*homosexuals were forced to serve out their terms of imprisonment, regardless of the time spent in concentration camps. ---
**Author:** ![AHarris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bcef8e/32.png) [@AHarris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHarris)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/5 "2016-03-17T03:21:44Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The photoplasty entry left out the word some. Otherwise the contest winner’s graphic appears accurate. > > This is a cite that I find very credible. The US Holocaust Memorial Museum has done extensive research. > > This is a highly disturbing revelation. That I guess, involved all four occupying powers in Germany. i.e.[the four occupation zones](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied-occupied_Germany). The courts were under their control. > > Thank you for answering this question for me. To put it into perspective, all of the allies had similar laws against homosexual behaviour. Imprisoning someone for it wouldn’t have caught anyone’s attention as unusual. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/6 "2016-03-17T04:19:09Z")
The concentration camp system didn’t consist entirely of extermination/death camps, and accommodated a variety of classes of people, some of whom had been charged with, and convicted of, actual crimes. If convicted of a crime you could be sent to a regular prison or a concentration camp. The latter was more likely if you were convicted of a political crime, obviously, but also if you were a repeat offender (of any crime), were a “professional criminal”, were convicted of a (non-political) crime where the victim turned out to be someone influential, were convicted of a crime against a child, drug crimes, pimping, etc, etc. Or if they just wanted to make an example of you. Homosexual acts were a criminal offence in Germany at the time (as they were in many of the Allied nations, of course). Those convicted of homosexual offences were often (but not always) sent to concentration camps rather than prisons. When the Allies liberated the concentration camps. inmates were mostly released. But those who were there because they had been convicted of (non-political) offences mostly weren’t released; they were sent to regular prisons to complete their sentences. That included people convicted of homosexual offences. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/7 "2016-03-17T08:13:52Z")
In short, just because you were locked up by the Nazis did not mean you were not a criminal. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/8 "2016-03-17T08:54:40Z")
In addition to **UDS** ’s excellent explanation, the legal penalties for homosexual acts were very much increased in 1935 by - making not only not only actual gay sex against the law, but also (my paraphrase of a Reichsgericht interpretation of the new §175) acts that ‘objectively violate the common sense of shame and subectively intend to arouse one of the participants or a third party’, i.e. any mild instance of suspected gay erotical behaviour, including just associating with other gay men. - creating an aggravated case of gay sex involving a relationship involving dependency, or gay men under 21, or male prostitution. So the pink triangle concentration camp prisoners in part would not have been criminally convicted under the laws of the Allied nations, or convicted to a much shorter term. Still, they served a term of imprisonment imposed by a court of law. Something that I’d be interested in: the Allied occupation of Germany was planned and prepared for years in advance - at least in the case of the US, meticulously so. Starting with the advance into France and Italy, it was foreseeable that a lot of prisons and prison camps would be taken over where political prisoners, resisters and members of persecuted groups (to be liberated) would be mixed in with common criminals, partly dangerous ones (to be kept locked up). I should think the US forces would have had a manual for dealing with places of imprisonment. Is there a source for such a manual? ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/9 "2016-03-17T09:06:25Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > It’s my understanding that the Germans sorted people as they were off loaded from the trains. Many were killed immediately and some kept alive for labor at the camp. I wonder if accused Gays were even spared death and sent into the camp for labor duties? For the record: most of the concentration camps were not also extermination camps, and people were sent there to be incarcerated and to work. (Many of course died from maltreatment or from the appalling conditions.) Only relatively few camps were given over to systematic extermination, and had purpose-built facilities for that - but those camps were very large. They are generally referred to as extermination camps in contrast to your common-or-garden concentration camp. There never was a “final solution” decided up for Gays, as there was for Jews, so there was never a policy of routinely sending Gays to extermination camps. Plus, most of those convicted for homosexual offences were German citizens. (A Netherlander, say, convicted of homosexual offences in the occupied Netherlands wouldn’t have entered the German penal system; he would have been dealt with in the Dutch penal system, so no concentration camp for him.) And, even in the camps, German citizens generally didn’t get the shittiest end of the stick. That’s not to say that no Gay inmate was ever sent to Auschwitz or the like and gassed there, but it wasn’t the norm. No doubt Gays sent to the camps instead of to prison faced a much higher risk of death, but it was death by neglect, abuse or as a disciplinary measure, rather than deliberate gassing. ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/10 "2016-03-17T10:16:05Z")
People were often shot on the spot by guards for insubordination, and apparently Germans in concentration camps expected to be cut a lot more slack than Jews and found out the hard way that what guards wanted was compliant prisoners, Jew or not, especially on work crews. Smart-ass Germans didn’t last as long as compliant Jews. At least, that’s what I heard. Now, I don’t know any gentile survivors, and the Jews I have known (most are dead now, but I knew several as a child) probably were in places where Jews could survive on their behavior and wits. There probably were places where the hatred for Jews was very high, and the guards did favor German prisoners, even criminals, and there aren’t Jews around to tell those stories, but it seems like I knew a pretty wide sample of people who were in different camps. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 10:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/11 "2016-03-17T10:31:30Z")
And guards were [punished for mistreating inmate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georg_Konrad_Morgen#Indicted)s. The Germans were genocidal maniacs, but they were procedure following genocidal maniacs. ---
**Author:** ![tafowler87](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f07891/32.png) [@tafowler87](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tafowler87)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/12 "2016-03-17T11:15:54Z")
It was in fact the gays who betrayed the Jews. Biblically it made since for them to walk through the fire first. When Sir Flamen Doogen Adolpho Hitler realized the disorder the Ritual of Revelation had been carried out he immediately halted the mASSES. The strife was too great… he randomly chose a twink in hopes she was licensed to do nails. Evan future must be secured (secretly she bares the bloodline of EnochKnock - the jester foretold to raise the Antichrist). After this he hung himself. The gays dispersed, flooding all the surrounding foreign territories and reeking havoc in Islam. After half a century 12 elite gays finally settled in America just south of Massachusetts. After repopulating their dying species in a small rural town they dispersed again… Only… the spring equinox set into motion a reverse in order and darkening the brighter souls. Now to liberate all the past generation’s inconveniences the FAIRES (fags affirming international resistance of the equality for straight people) have banned together with a secret plan the US Government is diligently investigating. So you see they weren’t trafficked. They escaped and the question becomes “do straight people like pleather?” - cause the leather seating they really wanted for the gas chambers weren’t affordable… Horrible story I know, but your post was brilliant. I couldn’t miss my chance to redeem some good (sick maybe, but good) humor. ---
**Author:** ![tafowler87](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f07891/32.png) [@tafowler87](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tafowler87)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/13 "2016-03-17T11:17:35Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Is Cracked’s claim that Gay concentration camp (inmates) weren’t liberated at the end of WWII? TRUE? > > I know Cracked isn’t always the most accurate source. But their historical articles are often intended to be true. > > This claim about the treatment of Gays at the end of WWII is pretty surprising. I’ve never heard anything about it and I read a lot of material about that era. Those pink badges were obviously photoshopped. > [http://i.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/photoshop/4/3/6/516436\_v1.jpg](http://i.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/photoshop/4/3/6/516436_v1.jpg) > > from this long photoplasty article > [26 Side By Side Comparisons That Fix Our Image Of History | Cracked.com](http://www.cracked.com/photoplasty_1994_how-you-picture-history-vs-reality-side-by-side/) > > Can this claim be verified? > > It’s my understanding that the Germans sorted people as they were off loaded from the trains. Many were killed immediately and some kept alive for labor at the camp. I wonder if accused Gays were even spared death and sent into the camp for labor duties? Those that didn’t escape this tragedy were burned by curling irons. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/14 "2016-03-17T11:21:23Z")
WTF, Tafowler? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/15 "2016-03-17T11:54:02Z")
So if you were a gay Jew, what symbol did you get? A pink Star of David? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/16 "2016-03-17T12:14:13Z")
NM. This is Holocaust Humor. I was looking for Dead Baby Jokes. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/17 "2016-03-17T12:29:50Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > WTF, Tafowler? Seconded. ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/18 "2016-03-17T14:48:10Z")
**Moderator Note** > [@tafowler87](#): > > It was in fact the gays who betrayed the Jews. Biblically it made since for them to walk through the fire first. When Sir Flamen Doogen Adolpho Hitler realized the disorder the Ritual of Revelation had been carried out he immediately halted the mASSES. The strife was too great… he randomly chose a twink in hopes she was licensed to do nails. Evan future must be secured (secretly she bares the bloodline of EnochKnock - the jester foretold to raise the Antichrist). After this he hung himself. > The gays dispersed, flooding all the surrounding foreign territories and reeking havoc in Islam. After half a century 12 elite gays finally settled in America just south of Massachusetts. After repopulating their dying species in a small rural town they dispersed again… Only… the spring equinox set into motion a reverse in order and darkening the brighter souls. Now to liberate all the past generation’s inconveniences the FAIRES (fags affirming international resistance of the equality for straight people) have banned together with a secret plan the US Government is diligently investigating. > > So you see they weren’t trafficked. They escaped and the question becomes “do straight people like pleather?” - cause the leather seating they really wanted for the gas chambers weren’t affordable… > > Horrible story I know, but your post was brilliant. I couldn’t miss my chance to redeem some good (sick maybe, but good) humor. > [@tafowler87](#): > > Those that didn’t escape this tragedy were burned by curling irons. These are your idea of a joke, eh? I don’t think you have a future in comedy. We do allow a certain amount of joking in GQ, after the question has been factually addressed, but this type of “humor” is not appropriate here. Since I don’t recall you having a pattern of this sort of behavior in GQ I am going to give you a mod note here instead of a warning, but don’t do this in GQ again. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/19 "2016-03-17T16:06:02Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > So if you were a gay Jew, what symbol did you get? A pink Star of David? A pink triangle superimposed on a Star of David. [Like this.](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9c/Pink_triangle_jew.svg/120px-Pink_triangle_jew.svg.png) ---
**Author:** ![tafowler87](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f07891/32.png) [@tafowler87](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tafowler87)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2016, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229/20 "2016-03-17T16:36:24Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > WTF, Tafowler? HAHAHAHAHA… I thought it was funny. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-claim-that-gay-concentration-camp-werent-liberated-at-the-end-of-wwii-true/749229.md?page=2)