# Is this instance of the word 'girls' hate speech? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 4, 2020, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239 "2020-12-04T22:36:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/61 "2020-12-05T13:27:29Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Weird, because my internal rule on that is “ _never_ call a black man a ‘boy’ unless you want to get beat up”. My internal rule is never call a black man a “boy” unless you want to be hurtful and working in a long tradition of violent white supremacy, and also want to earn a justified stink-eye and possibly a telling-off. There’s a stereotype that black men are prone to violence, and when people say things like what you said, I think that stereotype is unconsciously at work. If black men were beating up every white person who said something racist, there’d be no room in the hospitals for COVID patients. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/62 "2020-12-05T14:03:47Z")
To sum up: There are some situations where it’s reasonable and appropriate to refer to adults as “boys” or “girls”. Those situations where it is actually appropriate are roughly symmetric between the genders. However, a large number of people mistakenly believe that there is an asymmetry, and will therefore refer to adult women as “girls” in contexts where they would never dream of referring to adult men as “boys”. This is demeaning towards women and highly inappropriate. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/63 "2020-12-05T18:00:03Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Hate speech is abusive or threatening speech against a group of marginalized people. This is casual sexism at worst. Yes, please can we keep ‘hate speech’ for the serious stuff, otherwise we’ll have no term left for that. And similarly can we keep ‘violence’ for beating people up and not insulting or abusive speech? ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/64 "2020-12-05T18:04:41Z")
> [@Bootb](#): > > Conversely, to a sufficiently old person, many younger adults seem almost children. Various comics and humor writers have touched on this; for example, claiming to think that their local police force is now hiring high school students. At work we jokingly call the tech support agency staff the ‘IT children’ because they look so damn young. And we’re not even that old… ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/65 "2020-12-05T18:26:57Z")
I just picked up a new pair of glasses 10 minutes ago. Nothing but girls working there today, three of them. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/66 "2020-12-05T18:58:39Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > I just picked up a new pair of glasses 10 minutes ago. Nothing but girls working there today, three of them Under eighteen years old? ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/67 "2020-12-05T19:02:36Z")
All were more than 18 years younger than me. So if I am old enough to be their father then I generally refer them girls. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/68 "2020-12-05T19:04:25Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > All were more than 18 years younger than me. So if I am old enough to be their father then I generally refer them girls And do you do the same for boys/men? ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/69 "2020-12-05T19:05:43Z")
Sometimes yes. Before Covid I hung out with the boys on a regular basis. Sometimes with old farts. Depends on the situation. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/70 "2020-12-05T19:07:17Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Sometimes yes. Before Covid I hung out with the boys on a regular basis Not the same usage. If you see guys working in a store, do you refer to them as “boys” if they’re more than 18 years younger than you? ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/71 "2020-12-05T19:09:15Z")
Like in “How are you boys doing today?”. Yes I have no issue with it and neither to people I associate with. ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/72 "2020-12-05T19:21:46Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > They are young, attractive, and there to draw people in I assume you mean drawing in ‘male people’. Who do you see placed there to draw in female people who need glasses fitted, dispensed ot fixed? I can assure you that their being ‘attractive and young’ is not what draws me in. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > would not be shocked if a large portion of them are still in their high “teens”. So what if they are? I suspect this is because then their employers can profit from paying them lower relative wages because of their youth and it being an entry level position. As long as they can do the advising, fitting and adjusting, their age and ‘attractiveness’ is immaterial. ---
**Author:** ![TheCuse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thecuse/32/2854_2.png) [@TheCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheCuse)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/73 "2020-12-05T19:24:32Z")
I say guys for men, and ladies for women. Though, I do sometimes say the “girls in the front office” when referring to them in the third person. I try not to, but it’s habit that is hard to break. ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/74 "2020-12-05T19:33:41Z")
> [@TheCuse](#): > > I try not to, but it’s habit that is hard to break. As long as you’re trying, that is what counts. I agree, unconscious, ingrained speech patterns can be the devil to change, I am a ‘girl’ and very motivated but I still slip up occasionally. I pick myself up, dust myself off and commit myself to do better. It’s incremental. ---
**Author:** ![TheCuse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thecuse/32/2854_2.png) [@TheCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheCuse)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/75 "2020-12-05T19:35:29Z")
^^thanks ---
**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/76 "2020-12-05T20:30:28Z")
I’ve heard guys refer to a middle aged women as a girl, unfamiliar women old enough to be their mother. I’ve never heard grown men call other unfamiliar grown men as “boy”. Just not a common use. Men you don’t get a free pass to call women, Young, middle aged or old, girls just because one might remind you of your daughter. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/77 "2020-12-05T21:18:35Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > All were more than 18 years younger than me. So if I am old enough to be their father then I generally refer them girls They are grown women entitled to respect. Your age relative to them has nothing to do with the matter. You don’t get a pass to disrespect people just because you got older. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/78 "2020-12-05T22:28:53Z")
And yet no females have ever expressed that I was being disrespectful to them when I have called them girl. So I will continue on as I have been. ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/79 "2020-12-05T22:33:11Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > So I will continue on as I have been. And I will continue on telling you what I think of that carrying on as you have been. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239/80 "2020-12-05T22:38:22Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > no females have ever expressed that I was being disrespectful to them when I have called them girl. Did you ever have to hold down a job in which being polite to the customers, even when they were being rude to you, was a requirement if you didn’t want to be fired? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-instance-of-the-word-girls-hate-speech/927239.md?page=5)