The guy is racist, but probably not that more than many in his generation. He’s probably in the camp that would compliment a black person for “speaking so well” rather than the camp who would string him up for being uppity.
When I hear someone use the word “negro” who isn’t old, I wonder what their deal is. Racist or no, that person is seriously lacking cool points.
And you expect him… Not to call them silly?
I don’t think Negro is a racist term, it’s just an antiquated term. If he called every black person silly, then, yeah, he’s a racist. But you have no evidence of that. And frankly, the people he was referring to were being silly.
“Speaking so well?” I thought the correct term for a person of sub-Saharan African ancestry who doesn’t talk like Mushmouth is “articulate.”
I interpreted it the same as Gadfly did. Since wearing your pants like that looks silly, and especially dumb in that particular situation, I would have thought that was what he was commenting on.
I use “blonde” to describe thoughtless or stupid moments, i.e. Oh,you just said Tuesday, asking when is mighty blonde of me. Does that mean I’m prejudiced against all fair-haired persons, or just a product of growing up with 1000 too many dumb blonde jokes?
Then why didn’t he just say “poor silly people”?
There was no need to refer to their race. I would like to think that if someone saw me drop my briefcase, they wouldn’t immediately think, “Poor, hapless negress” like I’m a poster child for the Poor Hapless Negroes of America[sup]]TM[/sup].
Monstro, okay, but it’s not like he said that black people were all poor, silly people. He was referring to them. They were being silly. Using the word negro was probably unecessary, sure, but it was a tiny comment. Don’t brand someone a racist for a tiny comment.
If it is racist someone should tell the United Negro College Fund.
Perhaps this is me…or maybe lots of black people do this…but I tend to approach older white people with caution. They grew up being taught blacks were inferior. Racism was the norm back in their day. Even if they know racism is bad, they may still subconsciously believe it.
Don’t get me wrong: old people deserve to be given the benefit of the doubt too. But let’s just say I don’t have high expectations when it comes to race and old folks.*
Does his comment indicate that he has a problem with black people? Not on its face, no.
But knowing what we know about race relations in this country…and knowing that statistically older people are more likely to be more “old-fashioned”…and knowing that “old-fashioned” and “racial equality” don’t really go hand-in-hand–I don’t think it’s unreasonable for us to conclude that this dude is probably prejudiced against black people. Like I said before, he’s probably polite with his racism. But it’s still racism nonetheless.
[sub]*I guess you can say I’m prejudiced against old folks.[/sub]
Has anyone ever watched the movie Men at Work ? Sheen and Esteves are in it . Dumb movie , but i find it entertaining for some reason I can’t figure out. They, along with their supervisor who is black, find a dead guy stuffed in a drum. The black guy( wish i could remember his name cuz he’s a cool actor) looks in the drum and says " Aw, somebody threw away a perfectly good white boy" Now, my question is :
Is the writer of that movie racist because he included ‘white’ in that line? I thought it was kinda funny. I’d be willing to bet that if it was the other way around and a white actor said “Aw, somebody threw away a perfectly good black boy” , Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson would flip out. Racism can and does go both ways, but only the old white guy saying negro is going to catch flack. The old black guy saying honky or cracker will get a pass every time.
When it comes down to it, though, I hafta say that in this day and age where race relations are at the best they’ve been, most complaints can be traced to people being just to damned sensitive. A white guy says negro … big fuckin deal. I heard a black kid in the store the other day say whitey … big fuckin deal. The whole PC thing is way outta control. Pretty soon you won’t be able to say dickhead anymore because it may offend all the men trapped in women’s bodies who want a dickhead of their own. What a soft, spineless, pussy society we’re becoming. Its like that kid from kindergarten who was always gonna tell the teacher on you is now in charge. UGH
Monstro, please tell me your last post was supposed to be ironic.
My mother’s parents are 83 years old now, so their notions on race are a little antiquated. It’s not surprising. I doubt they ran into many when they were growing up - it was New York, I know, but the Bronx … I think it was the Bronx… wasn’t the same place in 1930 or 1940 that it is today. They’re wealthy, and for many years now, they’ve lived in a private community in Great Neck. I’m sure it has no rules against black homeowners, but I doubt you’ll find any in there either. And occasionally, they’ll say something about black people that’s just dumb.
The most recent one I can think of was about a month ago. My middle brother was preparing to return to college, and he got an e-mail from his roommate that left us… well, puzzled. It sounded like it had been written by a dunce and used a lot of slangy 'net abbreviations, which contributed to the stupid sound. The roomy’s first name is Derrickson. Maybe this had something to do with my grandmother’s question upon having the contents of the e-mail read to her: “Is he black?”
She never explained - and we asked repeatedly - what in the world had drawn her to that conclusion. But it certainly appears that the unintelligent content of the e-mail, with no other evidence, lead her to assume that the author was black. What does my family (my mother included) do at moments like these? Laugh and tell them how stupid they sound. Mind you, MOST of the time, I don’t lay into my grandparents like I would someone closer to my age. But it’s a dumb comment, and even if their upbringing is largely responsible and it’s too late for them to change :dubious:, they don’t deserve a free pass in my book. Being old doesn’t lend credibility to one’s ignorance. I don’t expect them to change, but no one who knows me would expect me to let that kind of crap go.
An entertaining toss-up story for us to debate the implications of: As a budding tennis fan in fifth grade, I wrote a report on Arthur Ashe. In it, I referred to him as a Negro a couple of times. My teacher explained to me that that’s not an acceptable term these days - something I’d had no way of knowing, as there was nowhere I would’ve ever encountered the word before. Hell, I’d hardly ever encountered any black PEOPLE, so there wasn’t much need to worry about terms. 
I told her I used ‘Negro’ because I thought it sounded nicer than ‘black’ - at 11, I didn’t know that the words mean the same thing anyway, so my ‘aesthetic’ difference was fictional. It was probably only a little later the same year - or maybe the next year - that I would see the word over and over as I did a report on Malcolm X. That report probably gave me more knowledge of black history and civil rights than the rest of my honky-ass school combined. 
Well, Amarinth, no offense intended (though I doubt you’d believe that). I’m about as far from racist as anyone you’ll ever meet. I was speaking in terms of apples and apples. If you’re using terms in a discussion about things specific to race as opposed to culture, i.e., negro and caucasian, I don’t know what other term would be appropriate. What term would you use? I believe it is the only “anthropological” (I think that’s the right word) term available to me.
When I was a kid (1950’s), “negro” was the accepted polite term. “Colored” was also still used, and while it wasn’t generally considered derogatory, it seemed somewhat crass compared to the more academic-sounding “negro,” and eventually was deemed contemptuous. “Black” was considered insulting, and I was taught to never say “nigger.”
In the 60’s, with the civil rights movement, Black Power, and songs like “I’m Black and I’m Proud,” “black” became an accepted and then preferred term. Black folks I knew in the early 70’s used “negro” derogatorily to indicate someone they considered Uncle Tom-ish. For a white person to say “negro” wasn’t necessarily deemed an insult, but in informal situations it indicated at least a lack of currency and perhaps a reluctance to use the more favored word.
In the situation described in the OP, it’s not so much the choice of “negro” over other terms, but the coupling of a racial identifier with the “poor, silly” comment. Substitute “stupid” for “silly,” which isn’t much of a stretch, and it underscores the point. Would the speaker have said “poor, silly white boys” if he’d seen them doing the same thing? I doubt it. The need to point out the ethnicity of those doing something silly, stupid, or whatever suggests at least a subconscious association between that ethnicity and the unlaudable behavior.
My evaluation of the OP is that the speaker is racist, not in the “lynch 'em if they get uppity” way, but in the “we’re better than they are” way.
What if I say “negro” in spanish?
Do we hispanophones have to find a new word for black in spanish then? No, mang!
Ummm… you realize a lot of racists say the EXACT same thing. I’m not just talking “old-fashioned” racists…but modern 25-35 year old “redneck” style racists. (not that all 'necks are racist, but as one who associates with a few, I can tell you, it’s not uncommon)
They’ll say “Oh not all black folks are like that, and you gotta give them a chance…but when I meet one, I just expect that he’ll be …(insert horrible stereotype here).”
Most of them just don’t have high expectations of black people, either. It’s the worst kind of racism, IMHO, because you wrap it in this “facade of tolerance.” Like you can ACCEPT that some black people are “OK”, but you never EXPECT it. No offense, but not at all enlightened, on EITHER side of the divide.
Steve
Spram, hispanics have discovered that blacks have begun to recognize the word “negro” when they say it in spanish and realize that the hispanics are talking about them. Now they sat “morenitos”
I’m ratting them out because my suggestion that talking about blacks in front of them just because they can use another language is rude and they should stop it was taken with an enormous eye roll.
So yeah, they have come up with a new word.
My response here doesn’t necessarily have any bearing on the situation described in the OP, but your “rule of Life” is not necessarily a good rule. If a statement by an individual might be an indicator of this individual’s potential behavior in a realistic situation, the statement might well be worth at least wondering about.
I am. This fact was indirectly indicated in one of my previous posts on this thread. As to whether I find the word “Negro” offensive, it’s a matter of context. While I would find it considerably more odd to hear the term from a 47-year-old than a septuagenarian, I wouldn’t necessarily be offended unless some other part of that person’s statement indicated that “Negro” was being used as a term of hostility or condescension. I would generally chalk it up to a common condition I would call “uninformedness”.
I’m curious as to what your definition of “racist” is. While it’s true that Ms. Goldberg’s comedy act often includes crude ethnic stereotyping (a tactic also sometimes employed by her friend Robin Williams), what I know about the larger context of her life wouldn’t indicate to me that she is either hostile to people who are not black, nor that she considers them her inferiors (she has had three white husbands, IIRC).
[quote[And when someone under a certain age chooses to use a word that, while it isn’t absolutely, undeniably offensive, has obviously fallen out of favor, is no longer in common usage and hasn’t been for 30 years, and has been borderline for nearly as long - I’m going to take negative notice.
It’s roughly analgous to the kid holding her hand two inches in front of her brother’s face whining “but I’m not touching him. See, there’s space, I’m not touching.” It’s knowingly pushing a boundary.[/quote]
I obviously don’t know anything about this guy individually, but I can state categorically that this is not true.
You have to realize that there are plenty of older people who have essentially dropped out of popular society. They couldn’t name you one pop hit in the past 20 years, they haven’t had a real conversation with anyone under 40 in the same 20 years, and they are a little put out that things are changing from the way they knew them. They may be startlingly ignorant, but you impugned their character en mass.
My friend’s grandpa lived on the same farm in Kansas that he’d been literally born on. It was the same house (probably 4 major remodels later). He was 93, only thought about the farm, and listened to some preachers on the radio. Other than that, he didn’t care. He used words older and more out of date than “Negro”, but he really honestly didn’t get that things had changed around him.
Don’t go making exactly the kind of mass judgemental statements you say you’re attacking.