# Is this photo just released by Iran of a ballistic launch a Photoshop? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 9, 2016, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499 "2016-07-09T20:48:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2016, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/1 "2016-07-09T20:48:34Z")
See subject: [http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/](http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/) They’ve done it before. The outlining of the rocket and the focus of the sheen just looks weird to me. ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/2 "2016-07-10T02:08:06Z")
Wouldn’t their their face have been red if the launch had gotten tangled in those high line wires? ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/3 "2016-07-10T03:50:35Z")
You mean the wires that are much closer to the camera than the missile? ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/4 "2016-07-10T06:10:40Z")
Video of March test - [Clinton calls for sanctions on Iran after more missile tests | Reuters](http://www.reuters.com/article/us-iran-missiles-idUSKCN0WB0I9) It was released four month ago. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 8:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/5 "2016-07-10T08:51:10Z")
1. Its the Times of Israel, not exactly the most unbiased source wrt Iran. 2. Following on from that; they also say that the missile had stuff written on it in Hebrew (Israel must die) which does not seem to be in the picture. 3. Even if the picture has been retouched, its not necessarily the Iranians who did it. Might have been the paper or the wire service and that touching was done does not mean that it was necessarily for nefarious puposes, might for for clarity, the missile body has the same colour as the surrounding terrain, or to make it seem more newsworthy. Retouching is done all the time. 4. Much more interesting; one of the side stoies, an Israeli President has a _parole hearing_? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/6 "2016-07-10T13:36:25Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > 1. Much more interesting; one of the side stoies, an Israeli President has a _parole hearing_? [Moshe Katzav:](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moshe_Katsav) > [@](#): > > The end of his presidency was marked by controversy, stemming from allegations of rape of one female subordinate and sexual harassment of others. Katsav resigned the presidency in 2007 as part of a plea bargain.[2] Katsav later rejected the deal with prosecutors and vowed he would prove his innocence in court.[2] In an unprecedented case,[3][4] on 30 December 2010, Katsav was convicted of two counts of rape,[5] obstruction of justice and other charges.[3][4] On 22 March 2011, in a landmark ruling, Katsav was sentenced to seven years in prison. Katsav appealed his conviction to the Supreme Court of Israel. On 10 November 2011, the Supreme Court affirmed Katsav’s conviction and punishment. An ugly, sordid affair. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/7 "2016-07-10T13:44:31Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > See subject: [http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/](http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/) > > They’ve done it before. The outlining of the rocket and the focus of the sheen just looks weird to me. Thnx. It still looks like the rocket was chroma keyed out of another picture, though–the black outline. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/8 "2016-07-10T14:43:08Z")
Why are you thanking yourself? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/9 "2016-07-10T14:50:16Z")
> [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > You mean the wires that are much closer to the camera than the missile? My post was meant as a joke but since you brought it up, the smoke/dust from the launch is in front of the hill to the right in the foreground and the wires are obviously behind it I’d say you are mistaken. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/10 "2016-07-10T14:56:57Z")
> [@White SIFL](#): > > My post was meant as a joke but since you brought it up, the smoke/dust from the launch is in front of the hill to the right in the foreground and the wires are obviously behind it I’d say you are mistaken. The wires are in front. Follow the leftmost wire to the bottom right. You can see it most clearly running there. You can also see the middle wire and top wire. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/11 "2016-07-10T14:56:58Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Why are you thanking yourself? 😕 Narcissism. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/12 "2016-07-10T15:02:14Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The wires are in front. Follow the leftmost wire to the bottom right. You can see it most clearly running there. You can also see the middle wire and top wire. [Here’s a slightly different angle of it, with the wires on the bottom left.](http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/160309105644-iran-missile-large-169.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/13 "2016-07-10T15:32:01Z")
The graininess of the photo makes it difficult to assess clear signs of image manipulation, and the rocket being high enough that the launch pad or TEL is not visible makes it difficult to estimate height but the photo sure looks kind of fake to me. Knowing the length and diameter of the booster and wiht the two images of the launch from different positions, it should be possible to estimate relative positions, but I can’t give enough of a fuck about Iran to care. The plume also seems suspiciously clean burning, and it is odd that they are launching next to a rock face, or (in the Reuters article) from a deep trench because of the potential damage of reflected acoustic energy in the ground coupled acoustic field. Of course, they may need to conceal or protect their missiles and launch sites by hiding them in places that are difficult for ballistic missiles to access, but it also presents a risk. At any rate, getting a missile off the ground is a challenge, but making one that can actually be a real threat also means having sufficient guidance, control, and navigation ability to actually hit a target, and structural capability to survive ballistic reentry without coming apart like a cheap gold watch. Given Iran’s long history of bullshititude about their technical capabilities, color me unimpressed until they demonstrate the capability in view of objective observers. However, it does give Israel all the reason in the world to maintain and enhance their defense systems, and foreign military contractors justification to sell more weapon systems to Israel. So, nobody is really that motivated to call a bullshit even if it were evident. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/14 "2016-07-10T16:01:23Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > See subject: [http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/](http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/) > > They’ve done it before. The outlining of the rocket and the focus of the sheen just looks weird to me. You can get that in lossy compression or lower res, especially with the contrasty elements in this photo. I’m not saying it can’t be shopped, just that it doesn’t have to be. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/15 "2016-07-10T18:15:12Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Thnx. > > It still looks like the rocket was chroma keyed out of another picture, though–the black outline. > [@AK84](#): > > Why are you thanking yourself? 😕 The “Thnx” _should have gone__ **before** _ my self-cite, which I recalled to recall that the particular “outline” of the rocket was one of the points I saw, and which I was still itchy about, and to show that OP was still intellectually cogent and taking part in the high pressure intellectual give and take so typical of threads of this caliber… _That’s_ why. And that goes for **Panache** too. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/16 "2016-07-11T06:05:48Z")
I’m not a ballistics expert, but from my small forays into photo manipulation I would vote that the images are fake. The resolution of the missile seems lower than the wires (which are in front of it) and mountain (which is behind it), and that would be difficult to accomplish. There’s a strange outline around the missile in the first image. The missile seems about the same yellow color as your average indoor, incandescent light photo. The white line, down the center of the missile, would seem to indicate that the sun is directly behind the photographer, but from the shadows on the smoke and mountainside, the Sun is clearly on the right. On a cylindrical surface, the reflection would be more towards the center than we might expect, but not dead center. The missile doesn’t seem to be leaving any smoke trail of its own. It seems strange that the smoke from its launch is the same color as the dirt. Maybe with a truly fine sand that is very soft and deep, you could intermix that much dust with the gasses propelling the missile, but I would personally guess that someone just blew up a chunk of rock to create the smoke/dust. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/17 "2016-07-11T06:12:20Z")
Hm, well in the Reuters article, it is painted yellow and that picture looks real. It also has the same color of smoke. So, dunno. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/18 "2016-07-11T14:18:49Z")
All I can say is that some people seem to have a strange need for the images to be fake. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/19 "2016-07-11T21:39:46Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > … > At any rate, getting a missile off the ground is a challenge, but making one that can actually be a real threat also means having sufficient guidance, control, and navigation ability to actually hit a target, and structural capability to survive ballistic reentry without coming apart like a cheap gold watch. … Off topic, but since you brought it up, and as of course you know, Saddam’s famous Scuds sort of almost came apart like a POS, which–so they say–helped defeat (jury-rigged Patriot) ABMs because they didn’t play fair and follow expected, sound ballistic pathways. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499/20 "2016-07-11T21:48:32Z")
> [@](#): > > OP photo: [http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/[/ur]](http://www.timesofisrael.com/defiant-iran-says-it-will-continue-ballistic-missile-tests/%5B/ur%5D) > > > [@pulykamell](#): > > > > [Here’s a slightly different angle of it, with the wires on the bottom left.](http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/160309105644-iran-missile-large-169.jpg) Waitaminit. I just looked at this: **pulykammel** , you’re making a joke, right, and saying that it’s obviously fake? The only way to reconcile the two views is if the OP one is taken from deep below and to the left of the camera in your shot, facing the rightmost hill, so the wires would optically appear to overlap it. Neither distances nor foreshortening reflect this. FTR: OP just cited OP again… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-photo-just-released-by-iran-of-a-ballistic-launch-a-photoshop/759499.md?page=2)