# Is this rude? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 11, 2012, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426 "2012-09-11T20:03:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2012, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/41 "2012-09-12T19:09:09Z")
> [@Kaio](#): > > Get _what_ in writing? Salary? Title? Hours? I’ll continue my guessing game and purport the OP misinterpreted something said during the interview, probably due to naivete or simple stupidity. Then after coming to work, the petulant brat perceived some personal wrong done to him that existed only in his own mind, nowhere else. As msmith noted: Who’s in charge here, anyway? I’m still amazed anyone including the OP does not get this. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2012, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/42 "2012-09-12T19:25:22Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > I donno. We’re only hearing from one side, on the day he walked out. So much of it depends on what was exactly said, what tone of voice, etc., that I don’t think we can really tell. > > I have had real shits for employees and have watched people truly test their bosses. Depending on what John did and say, if Jill blew up once, then it just means she’s human. > > If it were an ongoing thing, then yes, that’s another issue. If someone quits without notice because they don’t want to work on a Sunday and this is a expectation that it will occasionally be required, yes, I’d say they were acting like a brat. > > As I said, there’s no way to tell here what’s happening. If an employee is not doing his job, trust me, their coworkers know. It is for the boss to come down on them appropriately. It’s not appropriate for the boss to discuss their work performance with us as gossip (it’s one thing for me to approach her with concerns and then have her address them). It is not appropriate for me to know that my boss _personally_ does not like one of my coworkers . ---
**Author:** ![Kaio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@Kaio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaio)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2012, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/43 "2012-09-12T19:57:58Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > I’ll continue my guessing game and purport the OP misinterpreted something said during the interview, probably due to naivete or simple stupidity. Then after coming to work, the petulant brat perceived some personal wrong done to him that existed only in his own mind, nowhere else. I’d say this is where you go awry. You can guess whatever you want, doesn’t make it true. All the information we have is Jill’s behavior, not John’s. The point is, _regardless of how John behaved,_ Jill behaved in a breathtakingly unprofessional manner. Nor is the fact that John played hardball during job offer negotiations somehow a poor reflection on him. That’s how it works. The company will negotiate the best deal they can for themselves; so can, and should, the candidate. If Jill was unhappy with how the negotiations turned out, she could have not hired him; but hiring him and then acting like a passive-aggressive child because he successfully negotiated more out of her than she wanted is _her_ problem. Sure he asked for it, but _she_ was the one who gave it to him. And, regardless of her motivations, gossiping about your employee’s work performance to the janitor is unprofessional and childish. So is obliquely scolding him in front of the entire department. Passive-aggressiveness has no place in the land of adults. She can handle the problem directly with him, and leave his co-workers out of it. ---
**Author:** ![kwimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@kwimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kwimby)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2012, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/44 "2012-09-12T20:49:19Z")
> [@Kaio](#): > > All the information we have is Jill’s behavior, not John’s. As told by John. With suspiciously dubious attempts at clarification and elaboration WRT his part later in the thread. You sure do give a big benefit of the doubt. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/45 "2012-09-13T01:11:43Z")
The problem is that we don’t know enough about the situation, and the OP is deliberately giving slanted information to make his “case.” If you look at his question > [@](#): > > John calmly leaves Jill’s office, and says have a good day to Jill. Jill hears, but ignores John. > > Is this rude? For chrissake, if one ever wanted to write a misleading question, here is one. Where is the fact that he had just refused to come in to work because he didn’t feel like it? Or apparently quit on the spot? The other day, my four-year-old was bugging her younger brother. He finally got mad and hit her, so she comes running to me, “Didi hit me.” Well, yes. He did. That’s what you get when you take a toddler’s toys. If someone quits on the stop, ignoring them on the way out is not out of line. Writing pissy OPs trying to justify yourself by selectively doling out facts out of context doesn’t lead to confidence that any of the story is unbiased. ---
**Author:** ![Cub\_Mistress](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea666f/32.png) [@Cub\_Mistress](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cub_Mistress)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/46 "2012-09-13T01:46:43Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Exactly. > > I’ve been in meetings where the boss scolded all of us because of the behavior of unnamed but “known” individual. Those kind of meetings are inherently awful. But if the behavior is awful enough, maybe that’s just how it has to be. I don’t know. Or worse, when the boss does this when the one person to whom the scolding applies IS NOT THERE in the meeting. And she goes on and on and on and on… Calling someone a “brat” in the workplace sounds unprofessional to me, but I work for a spoiled brat of my own so,who knows, maybe one day I will snap and call her a brat. ---
**Author:** ![Kaio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@Kaio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaio)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/47 "2012-09-13T04:21:01Z")
> [@kwimby](#): > > As told by John. With suspiciously dubious attempts at clarification and elaboration WRT his part later in the thread. > > You sure do give a big benefit of the doubt. No, I just go with the information we have, rather than making up information we don’t have. Sure, he’s biased. That doesn’t make Jill’s behavior, as presented, professional. Hell, maybe there is no John, Jill, or job. Maybe it’s entirely fiction. The question was, is this kind of behavior rude/unprofessional, and it is. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/48 "2012-09-13T06:13:50Z")
> [@Kaio](#): > > No, I just go with the information we have, rather than making up information we don’t have. Sure, he’s biased. That doesn’t make Jill’s behavior, as presented, professional. > > Hell, maybe there is no John, Jill, or job. Maybe it’s entirely fiction. The question was, is this kind of behavior rude/unprofessional, and it is. However, there is a point where the information is so obviously biased that it’s meaningless to speculate. The question concerning Jill not saying goodbye when John walks out of the office is exactly that, and it’s an indication there is far more to the rest of the story. It sounds like Jill could also be acting unprofessional, but really who knows what happened. If you feel you can make a judgment concerning Jill, fine. Knock yourself out. ---
**Author:** ![Kaio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@Kaio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaio)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/49 "2012-09-13T16:19:39Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > However, there is a point where the information is so obviously biased that it’s meaningless to speculate. The question concerning Jill not saying goodbye when John walks out of the office is exactly that, and it’s an indication there is far more to the rest of the story. It sounds like Jill could also be acting unprofessional, but really who knows what happened. > > If you feel you can make a judgment concerning Jill, fine. Knock yourself out. Well, I haven’t addressed that specific behavior for that reason. Although in truth, I’d say it’s technically rude, even if (and we can only speculate) it was justified. I am not, however, one to say that a person must avoid being rude at all times and at all costs – if someone is rude to me, I will not be inclined to knock myself out being polite to them, unless some greater good than not hurting the rude person’s feelings would be served. However, the behavior I _did_ address, namely the gossiping and oblique scolding in the presence of disinterested third parties, is unprofessional no matter _what_ John did. John could have been a total asshole, but as a manager (or, seriously, any professional worker) it is still incumbent on her to hold herself to a higher standard than that. Really, all she accomplished was demonstrating to the entire office that John quite easily managed to push her buttons. That’s not a trait I want to see in a a manager – part of their _job_ is grace under pressure when handling difficult situations. The “greater good” served here is that working in an office with someone that passive-aggressive, especially one who has power over you, is an absolute hell environment to work in for everyone else who works there. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2012, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/50 "2012-09-13T18:26:18Z")
John does sound kind of like a brat. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2012, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/51 "2012-09-18T04:56:46Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > However, there is a point where the information is so obviously biased that it’s meaningless to speculate. The question concerning Jill not saying goodbye when John walks out of the office is exactly that, and it’s an indication there is far more to the rest of the story. It sounds like Jill could also be acting unprofessional, but really who knows what happened. > > If you feel you can make a judgment concerning Jill, fine. Knock yourself out. No, there isn’t. We have information. We use it. When more information comes in, we change our opinion based on that. Saying you can’t make a decision because you think you might not have all the information is just lazy. That’s something you do when there are consequences to being wrong, which there are none here. And why do you do that? Because it’s rude as hell to call someone a liar. I don’t get you guys who think who think it even matters. The behavior as given is rude, no matter what happened. And standing up for what you believe in is not childish, it’s something adults do. Adults do something about the problem, rather than just whine about it. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2012, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426/52 "2012-09-18T11:10:21Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I don’t get you guys who think who think it even matters. The behavior as given is rude, no matter what happened. There’s levels of rude, like mildly rude and then there’s holy-shit-WTF-provoked-that rude. It all depends on how it was handled and what sparked it. Talking in private about someone else’s actions? I don’t know an office where that doesn’t happen for **tons** of reasons, both professional and unprofessional ones. A meeting in which “someone’s” behavior is discussed and everyone knows who it was? That happens. Probably not the best management style but it’s common. Call someone a “brat” to their face? I’ve done that jokingly with coworkers I like. A better choice in this case? It could have been saying nothing, **or** perhaps Jill would have been better calling him “insubordinate,” depending on John’s behavior. (In that case, “brat” probably would have been better from John’s POV.) In this case, since this “John” left immediately after being called a “brat” I can’t say I’m surprised “Jill” said nothing in response to “have a good day.” I’d assume she thought the phrase was sarcastic and didn’t merit an in-kind response. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-rude/634426.md?page=2)