# Is THIS The End of GM? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 14, 2006, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743 "2006-06-14T23:16:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2006, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/1 "2006-06-14T23:16:41Z")
Just saw the ad on TV-something called chevysurplus.com-apparently, GM is now bypassing their dealers to sell direct to the public. Aside from pissing of their dealers, this isn’t likely to generate a lot of money for GM-I guess its a last ditch attempt to clear their inventory out. Anyboy see the ad? I can’t imagine that their marketing has gotten so bad. Is this the pre-funeral sale? Or will they be able to pull it off and re-energze their sales. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/2 "2006-06-15T04:27:45Z")
Don’t know anything about it. Bypassing the dealers is a very big no-no. Courts have ruled the dealers have the manufacturers in a headlock legally. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/3 "2006-06-15T06:21:12Z")
Checked out the website. Apparently it requires you to enter your zip code and if no one is in your area then it wont talk to you. However, I entered the zip codes for houste, detroit, La, and all of them are without dealers. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/4 "2006-06-15T07:10:01Z")
> [@Paul in Saudi](#): > > Don’t know anything about it. Bypassing the dealers is a very big no-no. Courts have ruled the dealers have the manufacturers in a headlock legally. How does that work/how did that happen? Everything else I know of you can buy direct from the factory (not that I really **know** for most things.) ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/5 "2006-06-15T07:22:46Z")
I seem to recall that my Dad may have purchased a GM vehicle through USAA in the 1970s. My memory is hazy though. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 10:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/6 "2006-06-15T10:40:03Z")
Many people will tell you they bought directly from the factory, but in truth a dealer must deliver the car. They do some minor paperwork and take a bit of the profit. Western Maryland also has no dealers participating. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/7 "2006-06-15T11:15:36Z")
I have a customer who supplies to the auto industry; obviously I can’t say who (though you likely haven’t heard of them) but this is a major international supplier. Thier 5-year plan assumes the death of either GM, Ford, or both. They’re quite certain of it. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Clam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3bc359/32.png) [@Happy\_Clam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Clam)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/8 "2006-06-15T11:26:20Z")
I opened this thread expecting a debate on the virtues of GM _food_. ---
**Author:** ![ColonelDax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@ColonelDax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ColonelDax)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/9 "2006-06-15T11:44:04Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > apparently, GM is now bypassing their dealers to sell direct to the public. At the bottom of the [chevysurplus.com](http://chevysurplus.com) website: This site is not affiliated with Chevrolet Motor Division, General Motors Corporation, or General Motors Acceptance Corporation. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/10 "2006-06-15T14:20:26Z")
Maybe the surplus division is a dummy corporation, set up to buy and resell GM cars? this would insulate GM from being sued by their dealers. As I say, maybe GM is trying to raise cash quickly-and selling their cars at a big discount might be the way to go. of course, if they go banrupt, the company can do whatever it wants-and the dealer contracts will be worthless! I once read that given GM’s accumulated debt ($300 BILLION), that there is no way they can be profitable. maybe this is the pre-bankruptcy agreement? ---
**Author:** ![ColonelDax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@ColonelDax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ColonelDax)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/11 "2006-06-15T14:44:16Z")
Much more important for GM’s future, IMHO, will be the resumption on Aug. 11 of court hearings that will determine whether former GM unit Delphi can void its labor contracts and impose pay cuts of up to 55%. The UAW has threatened to strike if the contracts are voided, and a strike at Delphi could shut down GM’s operations. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/12 "2006-06-15T15:10:40Z")
This has nothing to do with GM, and everything to do with “Killer Marketing Systems, LLC” Check out [Surplus Hyundai](http://www.surplushyundai.com/) They also handle “ToyotaRepos”, “GMRepos”, “KiaRepos”, etc. I think this website has the [background](http://www.myautoleads.com/) you need. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/13 "2006-06-15T16:26:58Z")
> [@Measure for Measure](#): > > I seem to recall that my Dad may have purchased a GM vehicle through USAA in the 1970s. My memory is hazy though. Perhaps he just got financing through USAA. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/14 "2006-06-15T16:43:50Z")
IIRC, USAA has to deliver through a dealer. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/15 "2006-06-15T16:50:32Z")
I’m someone else who’s very curious about the illegalities of manufactuers selling directly to customers. Why would that be illegal? ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/16 "2006-06-15T17:08:05Z")
Some sort of contractual thing I understand. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/17 "2006-06-15T22:54:00Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I have a customer who supplies to the auto industry; obviously I can’t say who (though you likely haven’t heard of them) but this is a major international supplier. > > Thier 5-year plan assumes the death of either GM, Ford, or both. They’re quite certain of it. I just don’t see it happening. I’ve never been a fan of GM automobiles, and GM almost _deserves_ to go under, just because of how poorly it has been ran for so many years. I’m not actually sure I **want** to see GM collapse, just because that could have very bad effects on the U.S. economy as a whole. But, I certainly wouldn’t say that GM didn’t have it coming. Ford I’m more ambivalent towards, I’ve liked some of Ford’s products in the past and there are some out now that interest me enough that I don’t want to see Ford disappear from the market. Personally it’s my opinion that both companies are too big and too important to fail, I think some companies become so large that they can never truly die. ---
**Author:** ![spazattak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8e8cbc/32.png) [@spazattak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spazattak)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/18 "2006-06-15T23:52:28Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > I just don’t see it happening. > > I’ve never been a fan of GM automobiles, and GM almost _deserves_ to go under, just because of how poorly it has been ran for so many years. > > I’m not actually sure I **want** to see GM collapse, just because that could have very bad effects on the U.S. economy as a whole. But, I certainly wouldn’t say that GM didn’t have it coming. > > Ford I’m more ambivalent towards, I’ve liked some of Ford’s products in the past and there are some out now that interest me enough that I don’t want to see Ford disappear from the market. > > Personally it’s my opinion that both companies are too big and too important to fail, I think some companies become so large that they can never truly die. Or is it that the government (through corporate welfare) doesn’t allow them to die? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2006, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/19 "2006-06-16T02:58:40Z")
> [@Paul in Saudi](#): > > IIRC, USAA has to deliver through a dealer. That sounds plausible. It could have been a “no haggle” type of arrangement. Again, the car in question was purchased in the mid 1970s. * * * As for GM/Ford, a national health care plan that took a chunk of their pension benefit liabilities off of their books would obviously do a lot for the bottom line. And there’s always chapter 11. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2006, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743/20 "2006-06-16T07:26:21Z")
When GM goes under, I swear it will be one of the happiest days of my life. I’ll throw a party, tap a keg or three, possibly desecrate/burn the junked body of a Chevy HHR in the yard - it will give me more joy than I can possibly describe. I am convinced that GM is deliberately trying to push automotive design in the shittiest direction possible. The Chevy HHR is the ugliest car on the American bricks. Its uneven lines, obscenely huge fenders, chunky door handles, ugly lights - it disgusts and repulses me. The new Suburban/Tahoe/Escalade body is too ugly for words with its feminine rounded edges. The new Impala looks like absolute shit. The Avalanche/Escalade EXT - _what were they thinking?_ The truck/SUV division of GM started going downhill as soon as they stopped making what was definitely their coolest model, the 2-door [Yukon GT.](http://i10.ebayimg.com/05/i/07/6b/01/63_12.JPG) As of now, they have hit rock bottom. They will burn in hell. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-end-of-gm/360743.md?page=2)