# Is this the nastiest, meanest Presidential campaign of modern times? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 19, 2008, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605 "2008-10-19T03:03:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/121 "2008-10-23T14:07:58Z")
> [@Maeglin](#): > > Speaking as a white male, it is by no means clear that I am gaining any significant advantages from a white majority. My interests are aligned much better with nonwhites who share my geography and socio-economic status than they are with whites in general. Don’t be a race traitor! Remember the [Fourteen Words!](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_words) ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/122 "2008-10-23T14:09:18Z")
> [@Maeglin](#): > > Speaking as a white male, it is by no means clear that I am gaining any significant advantages from a white majority. My interests are aligned much better with nonwhites who share my geography and socio-economic status than they are with whites in general. Well, that’s funny, because lefties are all the time telling me I shouldn’t resent affirmative action because I have “white privilege.” It’s rather odd to tell me that I have a major advantage just from being white, but it’s somehow in my own best interest to give up my racial identity. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/123 "2008-10-23T14:11:00Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > That’s all that’s required. Yes, I’ve noticed that lefties seem to think that being nasty is all they need to refute someone else. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/124 "2008-10-23T14:15:33Z")
> [@Captain\_Carrot](#): > > What does that have to do with how well known he is? > > Regards, > Captain Carrot Very little. We were talking about terrorists. Why did you bring him up? What did Liddy have to do with how well known Ayers is? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/125 "2008-10-23T14:17:34Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > No, it hasn’t. The current rate of immigration dwarfs previous waves. The census bureau projects that we will add a hundred million people to our population over the next four decades, almost all of them through immigration. Leaving aside the racial and ethnic aspect, there is simply no way we can provide the infrastructure necessary to add that many people to our population and still maintain a decent quality of life for the average American. If you still think there is no danger here, perhaps you could tell me how many people are too many if 400 million aren’t. 500 million? 800 million? A billion? > > How many more can come here before they swamp the boat? If all that’s so damned obvious, how do you account for [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=488237)? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/126 "2008-10-23T14:20:03Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > Yes, I’ve noticed that lefties seem to think that being nasty is all they need to refute someone else. Yes yes, the lefties are calling you names just because you’re afraid of the incoming Mexican horde. Most arguments deserve factual rebuttals, some don’t rise to that standard. This is one of them. But like someone else said, the U.S. managed to do okay in spite of waves of immigration by the Irish, the Italians, the Slavs and Jews, and the Asians, although most of those were also met with cries of “Doom, Doom!” I think that’s rebuttal enough. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/127 "2008-10-23T14:41:58Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > Well, that’s funny, because lefties are all the time telling me I shouldn’t resent affirmative action because I have “white privilege.” It’s rather odd to tell me that I have a major advantage just from being white, but it’s somehow in my own best interest to give up my racial identity. I don’t hold you responsible for idiotic arguments made by unknown interlocutors, so I would ask that you constrain your remarks to what we are actually talking about here. I am kind of curious what it means to have a “white identiy”? What is it and where can I get one? I am quite confident that my family history and experiences have absolutely nothing in common with yours save a lack of melanin. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/128 "2008-10-23T14:54:29Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > If all that’s so damned obvious, how do you account for [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=488237)? By the fact that both parties believe they have something to gain. The Democrats hope to build a power base among the new immigrants, and the Republicans want cheap labor. Both parties are afraid of alienating Hispanic voters. The current financial problems probably draw a lot of attention away from immigration as well. Long term problems tend to be ignored when there’s a short term crisis. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/129 "2008-10-23T14:57:34Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > But like someone else said, the U.S. managed to do okay in spite of waves of immigration by the Irish, the Italians, the Slavs and Jews, and the Asians, although most of those were also met with cries of “Doom, Doom!” I think that’s rebuttal enough. No, it isn’t. I’ve pointed out that the current wave of immigration is unlike previous waves because of the sheer numbers. We simply can’t provide the infrastructure needed to prevent a drastic loss in the quality of life for most Americans if we add a hundred million people in forty years, as the census bureau projects. This problem deserves more than a sneer and a hasty dismissal. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/130 "2008-10-23T14:59:19Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > By the fact that both parties believe they have something to gain. The Democrats hope to build a power base among the new immigrants, and the Republicans want cheap labor. Both parties are afraid of alienating Hispanic voters. The current financial problems probably draw a lot of attention away from immigration as well. Long term problems tend to be ignored when there’s a short term crisis. Well, if you want a party that really considers immigration a top-priority problem, your only option is Pat Buchanan’s [America First Party.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America_First_Party_(2002)) And they’re not even running anybody for president this year; members are being encouraged to choose between Bob Barr (Libertarian) and Chuck Baldwin (Constitution). The [Constitution Party](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_Party_(United_States)) shares America First’s policy on immigration, but their priorities are really more social-religious. And the [Libertarian Party](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_Party_(United_States)) seems to be split on the issue, many Libs regarding open borders as a form of “liberty.” ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/131 "2008-10-23T20:03:23Z")
Congrats to the McCain campaign: [a new low](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=489227). (Hint: keywords _Hawaii_ and _grandmother_) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2008, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/132 "2008-10-24T16:46:22Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > No, it hasn’t. The current rate of immigration dwarfs previous waves. The census bureau projects that we will add a hundred million people to our population over the next four decades, almost all of them through immigration. Leaving aside the racial and ethnic aspect, there is simply no way we can provide the infrastructure necessary to add that many people to our population and still maintain a decent quality of life for the average American. If you still think there is no danger here, perhaps you could tell me how many people are too many if 400 million aren’t. 500 million? 800 million? A billion? > > How many more can come here before they swamp the boat? I’ve started a [separate thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=489382) to address that question. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/133 "2008-10-25T01:39:54Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > No, it hasn’t. The current rate of immigration dwarfs previous waves. That is indisputably false. Immigration rates were quite a bit higher prior to World War One as a percentage of the population. In 1910, 15% of all Americans had been born in another country; today that number is 10%. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 10:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/134 "2009-05-02T10:31:42Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > I really don’t care whether or not it’s “racist” in your eyes. And the issue isn’t terrorism, the issue is the radical transformation of our society. Radically altering the nation’s racial and ethnic demographics with mass immigration can’t possibly lead to anything good. Can’t POSSIBLY? Does that mean all national migrations at all times were for the worse? Then, as peoples have been migrating somewhere since time immemorial, the world must have been almost continually decaying into madness for all time. (Except for those moments of local stability where a tiny bit of civilization was clawed back from the chaos, but it could never be the same, no never never!) Oh, I forgot, you’re a Journalist. You don’t do history. Or logic. Or English. > [@](#): > > And why is “racist” for whites to consider their own best interests? What possible benefit can whites derive from giving up their status as the dominant majority? If it’s just you as a private citizen, it’s not racist in a Spike Lee sense. It’s definitely racist in a Spike Lee sense if it’s through use of political power; that’s his definition. For any normal usage, however, it’s absolutely racialist at the least, & as a societal program can fairly be called racist. That’s an objective assessment, not a prejudicial one. Semantically, being a racist isn’t necessarily a bad thing. Your point is not that you’re not a racist; it’s that you are a racist & you think that’s a good thing. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-the-nastiest-meanest-presidential-campaign-of-modern-times/468605/135 "2009-05-02T11:17:51Z")
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