# is this unsympathetic or racist or is it just hard honesty? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 11, 2016, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405 "2016-12-11T01:15:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/21 "2016-12-12T11:23:45Z")
You know what? The hell with it. A few minutes ago I sent a general note for one of the posts in this thread. But given the context I’m walking it back. Even as mild as I tried to make the note it’s too difficult a subject to try to define. Sorry about that. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/22 "2016-12-12T11:55:07Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > If you think that government censorship is the only way speech and thought can become forbidden, I’m not sure it’s worth it to explain the rest. Do I think that the government censorship is the only way, no? Of course individual violence like the mob violence can be used. But the subject of the Freedom of expression is one that is about the It is apparent that some persons think that Free speech means they have the freedom to say anything, and no one can criticize and they should face no social opprobrium, no countering critical free speech, for using the expressions of the bigot or of the racist etc. This is only a childish hypocrisy. Of course since my original comment had not one comment on the suppression or the control of the speech or the thought, and made only the reference to 'social disadvantage (ironical expression), it is very hard to understand how this connects to understanding of the Freedom of expression : _"Extraordinary it is over the years to see the repeated obsession of the white americans, often newly joined the board, who are so troubled by their suffering from social disadvantage in not being able to use freely the very racially charged langauge, but of course they are entirely sans prejudices… "_ It is funny the one sidedness in this. If I write “Please Racey” instead of the racial langauge of the “Please Nigga” there is sure to be a different reaction. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/23 "2016-12-12T12:01:48Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > I wonder if blacks really are all that offended by it or it’s mostly non-black SJWs that are offended. > [@monstro](#): > > You funny. > > I was born in 1977, right when hip hop came into being. Though I’m not its biggest fan, hip hop music was an integral part of my childhood/adolescence. Hip hop will always have a special place in my heart just because of that. > > Yet somehow, I have managed go almost 40 years never using the word “nigga” outside of conversations like this one. > > The word is 100% escapable as long as you have a vocabulary above a 2nd grade reading level. > > Perhaps when the word “nigger” falls out of usage and my people are no longer at the socioeconomic totem pole bottom, that’s when “nigga” will stop grating my nerves. You don’t get to tell me what shouldn’t offend me. I will stand up for your right to say “nigga”, but you cannot force me to respect you for it. > > My dad’s people say “nigga” all the time. They live in small town Indiana. For them, “nigga” is akin to the British “bloke”. So it’s harmless, and we–my immediate family–recognize this when we are around them. > > The problem is that it is so engrained in their speech that they don’t always code-switch. You can get away with dropping “nigga” in every sentence in a small provincial town where all the black folks are kin to you. But saying “nigga” around a bunch of buppies in D.C or Atlanta will earn you some severe looks. Everyone I know who is about something? You will rarely hear them say “nigga” outside of singing along with a rap song. > > I’m sure a psychologist would have a field day speculating as to way this may be. > [@levdrakon](#): > > Nigga please. Ha. Ha. You had your answer from the middle class black american. Her answer is an excellent good one including on the question of the respect. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/24 "2016-12-12T12:14:26Z")
From the OP: > [@](#): > > i understand the offensiveness the term nigger was once used, but i also understand that we have been equal since 1964. that means that for 52 years we have been legally equal. We have been equal since always. We have been treated equally since never. There’s nothing magic about 1964. ---
**Author:** ![Crazy\_Canuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazy_canuck/32/5282_2.png) [@Crazy\_Canuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazy_Canuck)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/25 "2016-12-12T19:55:45Z")
> [@potatoesbruhh](#): > > is it racist to kinda feel like people who didnt personally experience slavery and segregation need to calm down and get over it slightly? Yes, yes it is. Glad we could help solve that one for you. And if you’re totally bummed about about not being able to use the n-word without everyone thinking you’re a racist tool, you just need to calm down and get over it slightly. At least you can still use the phrase, “Thanks for the warning officer.” ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/26 "2016-12-12T20:03:13Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Americans’ fascination with freedom of thought and speech continually perplexes you. Maybe you should take a field trip. Indeed, I’ve heard of someone on a message board complaining to the mods when another poster referred to their posting history. Without any “bad” words being used at all. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/27 "2016-12-12T23:51:20Z")
> [@Crazy\_Canuck](#): > > Yes, yes it is. Glad we could help solve that one for you. > > And if you’re totally bummed about about not being able to use the n-word without everyone thinking you’re a racist tool, you just need to calm down and get over it slightly. At least you can still use the phrase, “Thanks for the warning officer.” Why? What is racism and why is a particular word used continuously in a non-racist manner intrinsically racist? It seems like it’s racist to say it’s racist based merely on the color of one’s skin instead of one’s intent. People really need to put a bit of thought into context in which language either verbal or symbolic is used and stop acting like one of Pavlov’s dogs. ---
**Author:** ![coffeecat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coffeecat/32/3405_2.png) [@coffeecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coffeecat)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2016, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/28 "2016-12-13T00:48:02Z")
Yes, [George Carlin](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpQhztWgrKM) was right; intent and context are everything. That said, the joy of being able to say “nigger” or even “nigga” is really overrated, and this is not the hill I want to die on, or even break a nail on. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2016, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/29 "2016-12-13T00:58:27Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Why? What is racism and why is a particular word used continuously in a non-racist manner intrinsically racist? It seems like it’s racist to say it’s racist based merely on the color of one’s skin instead of one’s intent. People really need to put a bit of thought into context in which language either verbal or symbolic is used and stop acting like one of Pavlov’s dogs. We don’t have to call it “racism” if you don’t want to. How about “insulting.” Like “cunt” or “spic.” It seems to me that there are words that are insulting that can be easily avoided. ---
**Author:** ![RandMcnally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b782af/32.png) [@RandMcnally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandMcnally)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2016, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/30 "2016-12-13T02:23:41Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > We have been equal since always. We have been treated equally since never. There’s nothing magic about 1964. Y’know, I read and write a lot about race and its ugly history in the U.S. I’ve never thought of things that way and I am going to use it from now on. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2016, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/31 "2016-12-13T04:24:54Z")
> [@coffeecat](#): > > Yes, [George Carlin](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpQhztWgrKM) was right; intent and context are everything. That said, the joy of being able to say “nigger” or even “nigga” is really overrated, and this is not the hill I want to die on, or even break a nail on. > [@Procrustus](#): > > We don’t have to call it “racism” if you don’t want to. How about “insulting.” Like “cunt” or “spic.” It seems to me that there are words that are insulting that can be easily avoided. It depends on one’s environment. In my environment I agree. When I was growing up living in a rough urban environment for several years I would have disagreed. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2016, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/32 "2016-12-13T12:25:32Z")
Having a word that can be said by one race and not others is a ludicrous notion and such a societal demarcation cannot last long. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2016, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/33 "2016-12-13T13:10:50Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > Having a word that can be said by one race and not others is a ludicrous notion and such a societal demarcation cannot last long. I don’t think it’s about race – it’s about language and dialect. In African American Vernacular English (AAVE), the word has a different meaning than in American English. But only fluent AAVE speakers – those speaking it from birth – are likely to fully understand all the correct nuances of the use of that word. Anyone else is likely to mess it up, and the meanings in different dialects are _very_ different. It just so happens that the vast majority of native AAVE speakers are black, but there are a very small number of non-black AAVE speakers, and they might understand the usage well enough to avoid mistakes. ---
**Author:** ![Crazy\_Canuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazy_canuck/32/5282_2.png) [@Crazy\_Canuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazy_Canuck)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405/34 "2016-12-13T17:40:35Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Why? What is racism and why is a particular word used continuously in a non-racist manner intrinsically racist? It seems like it’s racist to say it’s racist based merely on the color of one’s skin instead of one’s intent. People really need to put a bit of thought into context in which language either verbal or symbolic is used and stop acting like one of Pavlov’s dogs. Maybe it’s just my lily white Canadian ass talking, but I have never ONCE heard the word used in a non-racist manner in real life, never mind “continuously in a non-racist manner.” I’ve heard it used to express hatred for black people, full stop. There is more historical hatred packed into that word than almost any other I can think of. That historical weight is what makes the word inherently hateful and racist, not just because it is used to describe black people. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-unsympathetic-or-racist-or-is-it-just-hard-honesty/774405.md?page=1)