# Is Trump an Asset of Russia (Or Some Other Foreign Power)? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 7, 2019, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425 "2019-10-07T16:44:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/221 "2019-10-17T15:00:14Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > For starters, the whole [Mein Kampf](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-hitler-mein-kampf/) thing is bullshit. The cite you link to says that the claim that Donald Trump said ‘Mein Kampf’ Had a ‘Profound Effect’ on him is false. That doesn’t mean that the, “The whole Mein Kampf thing is bullshit.” Other posts in this thread show three sources confirming that Trump owned a book of Hitler speeches. One of those sources is a quote from Trump himself identifying, possibly mistakenly, the book as Mein Kampf. > [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > [Read the original article.](https://www.vanityfair.com/magazine/2015/07/donald-ivana-trump-divorce-prenup-marie-brenner) > > It’s not just Ivana. Trump himself confirms, “Actually, it was my friend Marty Davis from Paramount who gave me a copy of Mein Kampf, and he’s a Jew.” > > Marty Davis also confirms, “I did give him a book about Hitler, but it was My New Order, Hitler’s speeches, not Mein Kampf. I thought he would find it interesting. I am his friend, but I’m not Jewish.” Not that it really matters what book he owns, but the point is that debunking one claim about Hitler and Mein Kampf does not magically erase Trump’s own words on the topic. This pretty clearly illustrates what has been going on throughout this thread. **Fiddle Peghead** gives a lot more weight to posts that support his viewpoint and barely notices posts that don’t. FP: I haven’t seen any evidence that Trump is being blackmailed. A: Here’s some evidence. B: And here’s some. C: And more evidence. FP: But I haven’t seen any evidence of crimes. A: You asked about blackmail, but here’s some evidence of crimes. B: Blackmail doesn’t require crimes, but here’s some crime evidence. C: And more evidence. FP: I still haven’t seen any evidence that Trump is being blackmailed. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/222 "2019-10-17T15:27:01Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > FP: I still haven’t seen any evidence that Trump is being blackmailed. Furthermore… let’s look back to the subject of the OP. “Is Trump an Asset of Russia”? Nothing about this question requires that a blackmail arrangement exists, so it’s a bit of a [motte-and-bailey](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Motte_and_bailey) tactic to pose an argument and constantly switch to the more easily argued form of the question. Trump is behaving in the interest of himself and hostile foreign powers that he does business with, at the expense of American interests. He is absolutely an asset of these powers. There are many reasons he could be an asset - ranging from incompetence to avarice to extortion to other arrangements. There’s evidence in favor of all those reasons. The discovery process is in motion and Trump is trying his hardest to obstruct it it at every turn. So I find the blackmail scenario likely, but this whole line of inquiry “is Trump an asset” hardly turns on the blackmail question. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/223 "2019-10-17T15:32:09Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > Trying to pull the US out of NATO. The only explanation (that makes any sense) is to help Putin. To answer just one of your examples, he did not try to pull the US out of NATO. He made the claim that NATO was “obsolete”, and he complained that they weren’t paying their fair share, that the US was footing more than our share of the bill. Yes, he brought up the idea, but he didn’t do it. I see this example all the time, and I ask you: how did NOT pulling out of NATO help Putin?? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/224 "2019-10-17T15:50:39Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > To answer just one of your examples, he did not try to pull the US out of NATO. He made the claim that NATO was “obsolete”, and he complained that they weren’t paying their fair share, that the US was footing more than our share of the bill. Yes, he brought up the idea, but he didn’t do it. I see this example all the time, and I ask you: how did NOT pulling out of NATO help Putin?? Disparaging NATO allies Calling NATO obsolete Demanding NATO allies go above and beyond agreed upon defense spending Suggesting that the US might not fulfill its article five obligations etc All of these things make NATO membership less attractive. This is exactly what Putin wants. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/225 "2019-10-17T15:50:43Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > To answer just one of your examples, he did not try to pull the US out of NATO. [Julian Barnes and Helene Cooper at the New York Times reported on Tuesday (15 January) that in 2018, Trump said several times that he wanted to remove the US from the North Atlantic Treaty Organization…](https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/1/15/18183759/trump-pull-out-of-nato-nyt-mattis) The fact that he did not only shows that somebody managed to talk him out of it. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/226 "2019-10-17T15:51:14Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > To answer just one of your examples, he did not try to pull the US out of NATO. He made the claim that NATO was “obsolete”, and he complained that they weren’t paying their fair share, that the US was footing more than our share of the bill. > [@](#): > > Yes, he brought up the idea, but he didn’t do it. “He didn’t do it” is a nonsequitur to the assertion “he tried to pull the US out of NATO”. If you want to rephrase what he actually did, he made statements that seriously call into question the US commitment to NATO. Russia does not require NATO to be disbanded; they also benefit richly from NATO members being uncertain about whether the US will meet its treaty obligations. If individual members drop out, that also helps Russia. Literally yesterday Trump threatened to “destroy the economy” of Turkey, a NATO ally. The US military [would now like to remove 50 nuclear weaopns from Turkey](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/turkey-syria-us-nuclear-weapons-bombs-trump-war-isis-kurds-a9158416.html), but cannot do so because it would confirm the deterioration of the US relationship with a NATO-allied country. Trump has acted in furtherance of Russia’s interests with regard to NATO, to the detriment of US interests. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/227 "2019-10-17T16:03:14Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > But I was asking in general, and the Ukraine debacle is just the most recent and possible most egregious example. But there are also his sharing of Israeli intel with Russians, having foreign interests rent out suits of his properties and never stay in them, appointing people based on their loyalty to him, rather than their qualifications, even having the SS pay his properties in order to secure him as the president. The list goes on about things that he has done that benefit him at the expense of the country. Ah, I just thought you were being coy, and I apologize for interpreting it as specific to Ukraine. But my answer about Ukraine still stands. Now you bring up other specifics. If I haven’t made it clear, I fully acknowledge that Trump is capable of looking out for himself over the country at times. > [@](#): > > What cases could you imagine him selling out the country, and where do you think that line is? What I said about being loathe to try and read his mind stands. No offense, but I have no desire to get into that. > [@](#): > > Even in your best case scenario there, he is still using funds that are not his to use in order to get personal benefit. He is still extorting another country in order to get them to interfere in the election. I agree completely. I clearly said I think he would withhold funds in order to harm Biden. 😕 > [@](#): > > Your defense is that he is too stupid to realize that doing such a thing may have consequences to national security and global stability. And I do not agree that he would put keeping us out of a war over getting re-elected. Maybe, just maybe he may avoid total global thermal nuclear war over losing the election, but I wouldn’t count on it. A minor nitpick, but I am not defending Trump. I’m telling you what I \*think \*he would do. I made no claim to absolutely know Trump is that stupid. If I’m wrong, I would fully accept that. As for nuclear war, I don’t know you so I’m merely giving you my honest first impression, but when you say that, you sound a bit like a lunatic. Again, no offense. But really? > [@](#): > > I’m not sure which claims you are refuting there, but the claims that have been made in this thread about Trump’s reading habits are backed by your cite. Drad Dog said Trump kept Mein Kampf by his bedside. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/228 "2019-10-17T16:03:50Z")
> [@Ale](#): > > I’m sorry because you must have spent a while writing that wall of text, but again, that’s CT bread and butter _I don’t understand something, therefore conspiracy_ A conspiracy theory is using bad evidence to say that I have proven something. I have no evidence and I have proved jack doodle. It is entirely possible that there are behind-the-scene reasons for Trump’s unexplainable actions which we would accept as reasonable if we knew about them. I am not saying nor declaring otherwise. I’m saying that if someone has a gun pointed at your face, is ranting their head off, and their eyes are all bloodshot, you are stupid to decide that they will probably not shoot. You are betting the future and security of our nation on this man. Do you have any reason to think that he’s trustworthy? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/229 "2019-10-17T16:17:08Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > Ah, I just thought you were being coy, and I apologize for interpreting it as specific to Ukraine. But my answer about Ukraine still stands. Now you bring up other specifics. If I haven’t made it clear, I fully acknowledge that Trump is capable of looking out for himself over the country at times. Right, and that is what I am concerned about. > [@](#): > > What I said about being loathe to try and read his mind stands. No offense, but I have no desire to get into that. It wold take mind reading to tell exactly where that line is. It does not need to be pinned down that thoroughly, mere observation can how that he’s already crossed the line that most of us find acceptable. > [@](#): > > I agree completely. I clearly said I think he would withhold funds in order to harm Biden. 😕 And that, IMHO, is a direct abuse of power. > [@](#): > > A minor nitpick, but I am not defending Trump. I’m telling you what I \*think \*he would do. I made no claim to absolutely know Trump is that stupid. If I’m wrong, I would fully accept that. Well, it is not you that needs to accept the consequences so much as other people who are currently being slaughtered because of his actions. But it is good that you are willing to say that you would admit it if you were wrong about how stupid Trump is. > [@](#): > > As for nuclear war, I don’t know you so I’m merely giving you my honest first impression, but when you say that, you sound a bit like a lunatic. Again, no offense. But really? I specifically said that he might not go that far. And I’m not saying that he’ll launch nukes because someone offers him a payment for it. But I am saying that he will do things in his selfish and shortsighted fashion that will increase the chances of a nuclear exchange breaking out. > [@](#): > > Drad Dog said Trump kept Mein Kampf by his bedside. Yeah, and that has been litigated and cited in this thread as to exactly where that information came from, and how much credence it should have. To try to call it a conspiracy theory is either a complete misunderstanding of the exchange in the thread, or a different use of the term than is typical. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/230 "2019-10-17T16:34:46Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > A conspiracy theory is using bad evidence to say that I have proven something. I have no evidence and I have proved jack doodle. Conspiracy theories are a specific kind of circular reasoning. i.e. “They’re covering up XYZ conspiracy. Here’s a piece of evidence” “But this other piece of evidence contradicts your evidence.” “Aha! It’s bigger than we thought!” The Trump blackmail theory does not take the disproof of other evidence as evidence of the coverup. It is rather a case of accumulating circumstantial evidence (not least of which is Trump’s very public efforts to obstruct access to possibly exculpatory evidence). Contrary to what Matlock may have told us, circumstantial evidence is valid if there is enough of it and it agrees. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/231 "2019-10-17T16:54:39Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > Thanks for explaining. > > This letter is one instance. What supports the “6 years or more”, of I assume, direct communication between them? By that I mean, the implication seems to me that they have been _regularly_ communicating, not just a few time over 6+ years. And if you don’t mind, stop with the snarks. I’m not ignoring anything. Not snark, I think posters here might feel ignored on some points. But OK. Given that it would be a delicate matter for the russian pres to exercise control over an asset if he’s the US pres, why would you expect there would be a lot of paper, or E stuff, or a trail at all, after vlad gave him the “diplomatic pouch”? It could have had a disc, drive, or even just a phone number. After that if you want to give dt a security clearance (!?) you’re going to be out there on your own hoping for the best for your country. Good luck with that. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/232 "2019-10-17T16:55:51Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > The cite you link to says that the claim that Donald Trump said ‘Mein Kampf’ Had a ‘Profound Effect’ on him is false. That doesn’t mean that the, “The whole Mein Kampf thing is bullshit.” I agree. For convenience, drad dog said this: > [@](#): > > This is a third way for this: That dt has had an ambition towards populist power, has read the books on it, esp Mein Kampf, which he has on his bedside table, and is going to follow the path of power by his understanding. That’s basically fascism. So he is in a room with vlad and he knows they are brothers in “power.” But when the press is there he is obsequious. This leaves too much unexplained to be satisfying. I said this was a conspiracy theory. He asked why I thought so, so I linked to snopes to show that Trump did not in fact keep MK by his beside. That is all I wanted to say. I did not in any way mean to say that everything that has ever been brought up about Trump and Hitler and all the rest is bullshit. I repeat, Trump keeping MK by his bedside is bullshit. I hastily included a quote, but I should not have, because it had nothing to do with what I wanted to say to drad dog. I see how you would have interpreted this as you did though. I should have quoted this from snopes: > [@](#): > > As the evidence stands, no strong case exists for the claim that Trump read or admired Hitler’s Mein Kampf. A quote attributed to him in which he supposedly lauded Mein Kampf and its author was clearly fabricated. It appears, on the other hand, that Trump did (and perhaps still does) own a collection of Hitler’s speeches that a friend presented to him as a gift. According to Vanity Fair, Ivana Trump told her lawyer that her husband kept the book near his bedside and occasionally read from it. Also according to Vanity Fair, however, Trump insisted he had never read it, nor would he. > [@](#): > > This pretty clearly illustrates what has been going on throughout this thread. **Fiddle Peghead** gives a lot more weight to posts that support his viewpoint and barely notices posts that don’t. You are wrong about me not noticing posts that don’t support my viewpoint. A while ago I missed drad dog’s link about the Putin letter. I’ve probably missed a few others, but for the most part I have tried to read every link and every response, and I have responded to numerous posts. I read them all and actually, yes that’s right, actually think about what they say and what they do or do not support. I constantly try to look at both sides of issues discussed here. Just because I haven’t reached the same conclusions as you or others does not mean I don’t give arguments equal weight. The fact that I am a progressive/liberal through and through might at least lend some weight to what I’ve just said. I don’t just jump in on the liberal side and support it. On occasion, I’ll take the other side’s viewpoint and argue it, if I think it has merit. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/233 "2019-10-17T16:57:28Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > For starters, the whole [Mein Kampf](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-hitler-mein-kampf/) thing is bullshit. Hm. SO what do you take out of that cite? You don’t believe he had either book? I don’t read it that way. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/234 "2019-10-17T17:00:17Z")
> [@Ale](#): > > Yes I can, so why did you put words in my mouth? > Max S was right and you were wrong, the Dossier only proves that Trumps opponents used foreign agents to dig (and make up) dirt on Trump to affect the 2016 election; which is what Trump gets accused of doing and toes in to my first post in this thread. > > I think Ulfreida has it right: > > There’s plenty of material to work with there, but for some reason, and again I’ll point out my first post in this thread as possibility, there has been an extreme fixation on the notion that Trump is a puppet of Russia. > > :rolleyes: > > _**And that is why, in part, you don’t seem to understand what makes a Conspiracy Theory. ISTM that you think that line of argumentation has validity, it doesn’t, you are displaying significant flaws in logic when you say things like that. > IMO, it’s no wonder you don’t recognize a conspiracy theory if you are operating under such parameters.**_ > > I’ll bring up Obama again to see if it helps you understand, what evidence is there that he isn’t a secret Muslim working for, I don’t know, the Nation of Islam? > Would you be satisfied with someone using that absence of evidence to support a CT about Obama? > > I don’t know if you like Obama or not, substitute for whoever you like. > > The important thing about this is that, I presume, you would not accept a _“there’s no evidence insert-person-you-like-here isn’t evil”_ as an argument against the character of that person, so what that would boil down to is that you accept such flawed arguments against Trump on the basis that you don’t like the guy and if you are going to pin your arguments on something like that you will never convince someone who likes Trump of anything you accuse him of. > > If people don’t buy what you are peddling you need to look into whether you are presenting arguments in an unconvincing manner or that perhaps your understanding of the situation is wrong. OK so you are unable to articulate what a CT is, nor what about my post might be one. (Hint: A CT has got to have more than one sentence in it for starters) And your explanation is just more “You don’t know what I know” stuff? ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/235 "2019-10-17T17:02:46Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > Disparaging NATO allies > Calling NATO obsolete > Demanding NATO allies go above and beyond agreed upon defense spending > Suggesting that the US might not fulfill its article five obligations > etc > > All of these things make NATO membership less attractive. This is exactly what Putin wants. Of course. Good God. You should not have even needed to say this. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/236 "2019-10-17T17:09:26Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > Ah, I just thought you were being coy, and I apologize for interpreting it as specific to Ukraine. But my answer about Ukraine still stands. Now you bring up other specifics. If I haven’t made it clear, I fully acknowledge that Trump is capable of looking out for himself over the country at times. > > \*\*\*What I said about being loathe to try and read his mind stands. No offense, but I have no desire to get into that. > > * * * > > I agree completely. I clearly said I think he would withhold funds in order to harm Biden. 😕 > > A minor nitpick, but I am not defending Trump. I’m telling you what I \*think \*he would do. I made no claim to absolutely know Trump is that stupid. If I’m wrong, I would fully accept that. As for nuclear war, I don’t know you so I’m merely giving you my honest first impression, but when you say that, you sound a bit like a lunatic. Again, no offense. But really? > > _ **Drad Dog said Trump kept Mein Kampf by his bedside.** _ In RE: dts state of mind. That is the subject of your thread: if you are speaking of crimes, which being an asset would be. State of mind is part of any criminal investigation or charge. Participating in a blackmail is also a crime. If you refuse to address his state of mind I think people might be upset with you here, and rightly so. In RE: Mein Kampf: So why not say that drad dog is wrong? dt seems to have read hitler and, well, he sems to be the problematic populist president we have right now. Nothing to see? ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/237 "2019-10-17T17:15:35Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > …tactic… I don’t use “tactics”. :rolleyes: I make my argument and try to support it. > [@](#): > > Trump is behaving in the interest of himself and hostile foreign powers that he does business with, at the expense of American interests. He is absolutely an asset of these powers. There are many reasons he could be an asset - ranging from incompetence to avarice to extortion to other arrangements. There’s evidence in favor of all those reasons. The discovery process is in motion and Trump is trying his hardest to obstruct it it at every turn. > > So I find the blackmail scenario likely, but this whole line of inquiry “is Trump an asset” hardly turns on the blackmail question. I started the thread concentrating on blackmail, sure. But it is no doubt true that Trump has done things to benefit other countries that go against the interests of the US. And no, it doesn’t require blackmail for him to have done these things. I myself in this very thread have said as much. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/238 "2019-10-17T17:20:05Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > Disparaging NATO allies > Calling NATO obsolete > Demanding NATO allies go above and beyond agreed upon defense spending > Suggesting that the US might not fulfill its article five obligations > etc > > All of these things make NATO membership less attractive. This is exactly what Putin wants. Fine, I’ll accept this as something Putin would want. I was going for something way more substantial though. I mean, using this type of low standard, you could take anything Trump says or does and come up with _something_, some way to tie it to Putin. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/239 "2019-10-17T17:23:01Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > In RE: dts state of mind. That is the subject of your thread: if you are speaking of crimes, which being an asset would be. State of mind is part of any criminal investigation or charge. Participating in a blackmail is also a crime. If you refuse to address his state of mind I think people might be upset with you here, and rightly so. Not rightly so, and I don’t care if anyone is upset with me. But to address this specifically, I agree with this. Sure. But I’m talking about reading his mind in order to decide what he would actually do, in real life. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425/240 "2019-10-17T17:28:17Z")
“Is Trump an asset of Russia?” is a question being debated contemporaneously with the US bombing its own military bases to deny Russia military secrets as the Russians overrun those same bases. But, yeah, this is ALLLLLLLL coincidence! We need proof greater than military movements and taken-over bases to even consider the question. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-trump-an-asset-of-russia-or-some-other-foreign-power/841425.md?page=13)