# Is Washington, DC a quagmire? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 14, 2003, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153 "2003-08-14T15:30:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/1 "2003-08-14T15:30:53Z")
Yesterday’s grim news from Washington, DC was all to typical: [ **One Killed, 13 Wounded in Overnight Shootings** Five Separate Shootings Rattle District](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A56781-2003Aug14.html) Washington, DC is a quagmire. It’s obvious that we went in there without any sort of plan. The situation is hopeless. We should immediately withdraw. The only hope is to beg the United Nations to govern Washington, DC. ---
**Author:** ![zoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71c47a/32.png) [@zoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoo)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/2 "2003-08-14T15:42:33Z")
Nice baiting december, but I don’t think this dog will hunt. ---
**Author:** ![Cliffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/59ef9b/32.png) [@Cliffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cliffy)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/3 "2003-08-14T15:51:45Z")
It should be “too,” not “to.” –Cliffy ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/4 "2003-08-14T15:58:42Z")
Now this thread I **would** agree belongs in the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/5 "2003-08-14T16:02:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > It’s obvious that we went in there without any sort of plan. When did we “go in there”? We _created_ the place. The people who live there are _us_. Another limerick would have done you more good than this. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/6 "2003-08-14T16:08:21Z")
Perhaps the satiric OP needs some clarification. The intended assertion is that some people are exaggerating the problems in Iraq in order to criticize Bush and his Iraq policy. Although the problems in Iraq are serious, they are not that much greater than the problems in our nation’s capital. Iraq presents challenges we can deal with, not reasons to surrender all hope and simply look for scapegoats. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/7 "2003-08-14T16:08:51Z")
Maybe if you ask nicely, the Brits will burn the place down again and you can have a do-over? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/8 "2003-08-14T16:09:46Z")
No. Only parts of the city were [built on a swamp.](http://www.geocities.com/bobarnebeck/swamp.html) ---
**Author:** ![montag01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/51bf81/32.png) [@montag01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/montag01)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/9 "2003-08-14T16:13:07Z")
Or perhaps it’s an excellent example of why we have NO BUSINESS trying to run another nation’s metropolis, since we’re “obviously” failures at running our own capitol. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Mariachi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71c47a/32.png) [@El\_Mariachi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Mariachi)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/10 "2003-08-14T16:14:00Z")
I wasn’t aware that Washington D.C. was occupied by a foreign military force! Thanks for bringing that to my attenion december, but I think you should alert the media! However, I’m glad to say that we still have patriots this day who will stand up and defend their homeland against these invaders! ---
**Author:** ![ShoNuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f04885/32.png) [@ShoNuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShoNuff)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/11 "2003-08-14T16:16:04Z")
I agree with **John Mace** that this thread belongs in the pit. Then I could tell you what I really think. I assume that you’re trying to parallel the situation in Iraq with the normal happenings in any city. In other words, you’re arguing that the continuing deaths of American soldiers in Iraq are analogous to urban violence that occurs in D.C. and any other city. Poppycock! The U.S. occupying forces are facing opposition that is increasingly sophisticated and organized. This isn’t random, urban violence as your OP suggests. It’s war, plain and simple. **december** , make your point. Don’t be cute. Don’t be smug. We’re talking about the lives of actual people. American soldiers in an occupied country. This is serious business, and deserves serious thought. ---
**Author:** ![ShoNuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f04885/32.png) [@ShoNuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShoNuff)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/12 "2003-08-14T16:19:02Z")
I asked you to make your point, which you did while I was writing. thanks ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/13 "2003-08-14T16:27:45Z")
Yeah, franky your capital is a dump. You should make it clean and safe, like we did with our capital. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Mariachi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71c47a/32.png) [@El\_Mariachi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Mariachi)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/14 "2003-08-14T16:33:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bryan Ekers \* > \*\*Yeah, franky your capital is a dump. You should make it clean and safe, like we did with our capital. \*\* If we did that then our politicians wouldn’t have a place nearby to buy crack. ---
**Author:** ![plnnr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@plnnr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/plnnr)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/15 "2003-08-14T16:34:42Z")
I think you should venture down to Southeast DC, somewhere near the Anacostia River, and ask the residents. After they kicked the ever-living shit out of you, you’d know for sure. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/16 "2003-08-14T16:40:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > \*\*Perhaps the satiric OP needs some clarification. > > The intended assertion is that some people are exaggerating the problems in Iraq in order to criticize Bush and his Iraq policy. Although the problems in Iraq are serious, they are not that much greater than the problems in our nation’s capital. Iraq presents challenges we can deal with, not reasons to surrender all hope and simply look for scapegoats. \*\* I think everyone knew exactly what the analogy was, but it’s not a good one. We don’t have daily grenade launcher attacks in US cities directly aimed, unprovoked, at the police. The vast majority of murders are civilians against civilians, unlike the situation in Iraq. I actually agree with what you are trying to get at, but not with the analogy or the method of argument. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/17 "2003-08-14T16:42:45Z")
**El Mariachi** has his finger on it. The fighting and US death toll in Iraq is from guerrilla opposition to a foreign occupying power. Even Rummy has acknowledged that. Ordinary, random and near-random street crime exists everywhere to varying degrees. Why do you think they’re comparable? If this is the distance you need to reach to support your unconditional, unquestioning, uncitizenlike cheering for everything this administration does, is that not cause for a little reflection on your part for once? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/18 "2003-08-14T16:45:58Z")
**Bryan Ekers** , isn’t Ottawa called “The Town that Fun Forgot”? ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/19 "2003-08-14T16:46:45Z")
Tell me again why **december’s** around but **Collunsbury** got banned? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153/20 "2003-08-14T17:01:44Z")
Because he’s so _polite_. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-washington-dc-a-quagmire/195153.md?page=2)