# Is what's happening to Putin "cancel culture"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion\ **Created:** [March 5, 2022, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527 "2022-03-05T17:26:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/21 "2022-03-06T06:22:03Z")
The answer to the OP is “No.” The principle–namely that refusing to support or reward unacceptable behavior–may be the same across the board, but that doesn’t mean that all uses of that principle are equivalent… ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/22 "2022-03-06T06:23:11Z")
To answer the OP: Not at all. Cancel culture is more like, canceling someone when they haven’t done something actually wrong, but rather, something the listener simply doesn’t agree with. ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_That](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roger_that/32/8505_2.png) [@Roger\_That](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_That)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/23 "2022-03-06T10:03:47Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > canceling someone when they haven’t done something actually wrong, but rather, something the listener simply doesn’t agree with. And who distinguishes one from the other? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/24 "2022-03-06T11:16:14Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Cancel culture isn’t a new thing. It’s also never been the exclusive province of the social-justice left, despite the crocodile-tears whining from the Perpetually Aggrieved Punditocracy on the Right. Remember when Sinead O’Connor tore up the photo of the Pope on SNL? Her career was in the fringiest margin the next day. Not to mention Kaepernick sitting on the sidelines while vastly less talented but more cooperative QBs bounce around their various pockets. It’s weird to lump the fierce ostracism of Putin and his minions into the same “cancel culture” bucket. Yes, it’s similar except as a matter of significant degree, but I would cock an eyebrow at the unspoken agenda of someone who tries to blur them together. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/25 "2022-03-06T11:29:14Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > At the end of the day, if someone is misbehaving, either you beat into compliance, tell them to get lost, remove them from the world, or use some form of extortion (e.g. hostages). Maybe in the future, we’ll start giving people pills or brain surgery to forcibly correct them (see also: chemical castration) but that’s pretty much the list at the moment. You forgot the other option. Let them continue to misbehave. IMHO this is the option favored by those who complain about cancel culture. Not because they oppose canceling someone who is misbehaving, but because they believe that many of the current targets are in fact not misbehaving. > [@Velocity](#): > > To answer the OP: Not at all. > > Cancel culture is more like, canceling someone when they haven’t done something actually wrong, but rather, something the listener simply doesn’t agree with. This. Fundamentally the argument isn’t about whether canceling someone is wrong. It’s about who’s being cancelled and why. The conservative authoritarian bigots were previously on the side of doing the canceling, and they had no problems with that. Now that they’re the ones being cancelled, they’re making a big stink. ETA. Same thing with Putin. He’s fine with literally canceling Ukraine, but heaven forbid anyone try to cancel him or his country. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/26 "2022-03-06T12:02:31Z")
I have to admit that I though Putin is being canceled, so yes I think it’s applicable. > [@eschereal](#): > > That would be because there is no difference. The cancel-whiners are people who think they have the absolute right to be assholes and no one else has the right to respond to their assholery. … I disagree with this. The conservative complainers were the former people committing cancel culture activities. Thing like making laws about homosexuality, and having societal norms that only were the ones conforming to their liking of how society should be. The issue is conservatism is losing and getting to the point that they have lost the ability to enforce their version of cancel culture and now are the whiners when it is employed against them. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/27 "2022-03-06T12:25:40Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > It’s not. I’ve seen a few leftist YouTubers discussing the negative side of cancel culture in recent months. And I’ve got to admit, I have a hard time discerning the difference between “cancel culture” and someone simply suffering the consequences of their actions. Gina Carano wasn’t a victim of cancel culture in my mind whereas James Gunn was. Both were fired for people taking offense at social media postings, unrelated to their actual work. In my mind, they are both “cancel culture” and the only difference is that liberals embrace James Gunn and his work more than they do Gina Carano. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/28 "2022-03-06T12:50:26Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Both were fired for people taking offense at social media postings, unrelated to their actual work. In my mind, they are both “cancel culture” and the only difference is that liberals embrace James Gunn and his work more than they do Gina Carano. Right. Shunning only works when a critical mass of people get behind it. The problem the authoritarians have is that they no longer have that critical mass. Due to that, they are now sometimes resorting to illegal methods or outright violence when they want to cancel someone or prevent themselves from being cancelled. Putin is demonstrating this quite well. ETA. In case it isn’t obvious, my preferred solution to their (the authoritarians) problem is for them to stop being assholes and join the rest of civilized society. Obviously some of them, Putin being the biggest offender, feel that lawlessness and violence is a better option. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/29 "2022-03-06T16:12:31Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > Fundamentally the argument isn’t about whether canceling someone is wrong. It’s about who’s being cancelled and why. The conservative authoritarian bigots were previously on the side of doing the canceling, and they had no problems with that. Now that they’re the ones being cancelled, they’re making a big stink. Exactly this. It’s anger about, and attempted resistance against, a shift in power. It could not be more pedestrian and petty. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/30 "2022-03-06T18:32:24Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > {…} It’s weird to lump the fierce ostracism of Putin and his minions into the same “cancel culture” bucket. {…} Not weird if it’s your Russian handlers wanting to push the opinions of American ‘’‘conservatives’‘’ to ‘Putin is the real victim of Putin’s invasion of Ukraine!’ ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_That](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roger_that/32/8505_2.png) [@Roger\_That](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_That)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/31 "2022-03-06T18:41:53Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > It’s weird to lump the fierce ostracism of Putin and his minions into the same “cancel culture” bucket Same exact principle, taken to a logical extreme: “Hey, ya can’t take someone whose ideas you disagree with and then cause that person harm by boycotting his business and encouraging others to do so, so yuz all make him change his ways…” Sure, I can. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/32 "2022-03-06T18:52:05Z")
> [@Roger\_That](#): > > How it is it different? Only in degree, not in kind. The term “cancel culture” (on the rare occasions when it’s a valid criticism) is that it’s a severe _over_reaction to some minor _faux pas_. It really does not fit the meaning of the expression to apply it to sanctions against someone who has started an actual fucking _war_. Or are you suggesting that economic sanctions are a huge overreaction to the minor _faux pas_ of invading a country and killing people? ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_That](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roger_that/32/8505_2.png) [@Roger\_That](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_That)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/33 "2022-03-06T19:07:19Z")
He says it’s not a war, it’s a minor issue within Greater Russia caused by some illegitimate Ukrainian fascists committing genocide against ethnic Russians which his brave peacekeeping forces are taking steps to contravene. Everyone else should mind their own business. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/34 "2022-03-06T19:15:02Z")
> [@Roger\_That](#): > > He says it’s not a war Your point being what, exactly? Do you believe him? ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/35 "2022-03-06T19:15:10Z")
> [@Roger\_That](#): > > He says it’s not a war, it’s a minor issue within Greater Russia caused by some illegitimate Ukrainian fascists committing genocide against ethnic Russians which his brave peacekeeping forces are taking steps to contravene. Everyone else should mind their own business. Here we have a thread where Godwinizing it is actually appropriate. Hitler made the same arguments when he invaded the Sudetenland. Putin seems like he has similar ambitions. IMHO those arguing that we shouldn’t cancel Putin are basically arguing that Hitler shouldn’t have been cancelled back in his day, that we should have just let him do whatever he wanted to do. Which we did for some time, with disastrous results. I don’t see the difference, other than that Putin is being cancelled at an earlier point in time in his attempt at empire building than HItler was in his attempt. ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_That](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roger_that/32/8505_2.png) [@Roger\_That](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_That)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/36 "2022-03-06T19:44:58Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Your point being what It’s that hard to figure out? Everyone who is “canceled” says the same thing. “It’s unfair!!! I’m the poor put-upon victim here!” It’s all bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/37 "2022-03-06T19:59:23Z")
So your claim is that because sanctions against Russia are justified, therefore nothing that fits the definition of “cancel culture” exists? I agree that most claims of “cancel culture” are bullshit, but it depends on the facts of the specific situation, and your leap of logic from the Putin situation is indeed hard to figure out. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/38 "2022-03-06T20:01:41Z")
Sure it’s “cancel culture”, and that’s a good thing. “Cancel culture” is simply shorthand for “if you act like an asshole, you’ll be shut out of civilized society”. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/39 "2022-03-06T20:24:18Z")
An excellent way of putting it. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2022, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527/40 "2022-03-06T20:29:07Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > Sure it’s “cancel culture”, and that’s a good thing. Well, no it’s not. The term “cancel culture” does not just mean stigmatization. It means an _over_reaction, generally against disparaged _speech_, with the implication that freedom of expression is being systematically and inappropriately suppressed. The sanctions against Russia really have nothing to do with the supposed phenomenon of “cancel culture”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-whats-happening-to-putin-cancel-culture/960527.md?page=3)