# ISIS--you're going down **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 8, 2014, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073 "2014-08-08T01:00:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2014, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/321 "2014-08-14T15:53:04Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Clearly, a little ethnic cleansing is in order. Death to all Ethnics! ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2014, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/322 "2014-08-14T15:59:39Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > [Wow](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17620796&postcount=44). Just, [wow](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17620905&postcount=56). > > I think I’m actually a little worried about you. > > ETA: nope, not at all. I despise you. The SDMB would better off without you. Unless we’re looking for a village idiot, that is. Why be worried? Try thinking for a moment. I realize it will be a new and unusual experience for you, but I’m willing to help. I’ll try to keep the words simple and I’ll type r-e-a-l slow so you can follow along without moving your lips too much. Here’s what I said originally: > [@](#): > > What the \*\*\*\*\*\* militants apparently don’t realize is that they are going to fire one too many missiles at Israel and Israel is going to kill everyone in the Gaza area in order to eliminate the threat. It will be tragic, but necessary, and they will be justified in doing it because the people there are complicit and aiding Hamas in what they are doing. If the people weren’t complicit, they would be stopping Hamas. #1. Note that I redacted the supposed racial slur so that all you easily offended assholes don’t get your shorts in a knot for a second time. But stop and think (if you can) for a moment: you people would not hesitate to call me a redneck - several of you have in the past - so why all the fuss? Oh, because libs. What’s okay for you to do isn’t okay for others. But that’s typical. Moving on… #2. Let’s look at some facts and then draw an analogy. Fact 1: Palestinians have been shooting rockets at Israel since 2001. They have killed Israelis with them and disrupted daily life in Israel. Fact 2: Israel has shown tremendous restraint. They have repeatedly asked Hamas and Friends to stop. Fact 3: The people in the areas where the rockets are being launched from have not taken action to stop these attacks. The logical (and I know you libs hate that word) conclusion from this is that they support and encourage the attacks. Now, let’s do an analogy. Can you say analogy? I knew you could. Suppose that you are confronted with an individual who has repeated punched you in the face, or at least attempted to. That individual has now doubled up his fist and pulled it back yet again. Are you going to stand there with blood on your face and ask him to not do that again, or are you going to fight back? Perhaps a better analogy: You and some friends are confronted by a group of people all wearing masks wrapped around their heads. Someone in the crowd throws a rock at your group. Most times you can dodge, but the occasional rock gets through and hurts someone. You can’t tell who’s doing the throwing, but no one in the other group is making any effort to stop them. Are you going to stand there with blood on your face and ask them to not do that again, or are you going to pick up your own rocks and respond? This is the point that I made which you jackasses totally overlooked. I am predicting that in the near future, Israel is going to draw a line in the sand, so to speak, and announce that if even one more rocket is fired, they are going to saddle up and ride in. And when they ride out, nothing will be standing and nobody will be living. It will be pure self-defense on their part. Tragic but necessary. Oh, and by the way, **Knorf** …fuck off. You despise me because I think and you don’t. Deal with it. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2014, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/323 "2014-08-14T16:59:19Z")
1. Redneck is not a racial slur, the word you used is. 2. ISIS is still not operating anywhere near Gaza. > [@Clothahump](#): > > I think Not in evidence. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2014, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/324 "2014-08-14T17:52:21Z")
Carerful guys, Clothy knows karate. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2014, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/325 "2014-08-14T17:55:04Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > the Kurds are in fact \*\*most of the Sunni \*\*rites, mostly the hanbali I think, Shafi’i mostly. Hanbali is mostly associated with Arabian Wahabis, principally in Saudi Arabia. Hanafi is the most common, which may have been what you were thinking of. Of course there are plenty of Kurdish religious minorities - the aforementioned Yazidis, Ahl-e Haqq, Alevi Shi’a, more normative Ithna’ashari Shi’a, even a few Jews ( most of them in Israel these days ). ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2014, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/326 "2014-08-15T02:38:27Z")
**Clothy** - You are not entirely without a point, but it is worth noting that women and especially children who are hiding in a school when it gets blown to smithereens can’t especially be considered supporters of Hamas who are either 1) responsible for stopping Hamas’ actions or else 2) deserving death. Yes, they brainwash even some of their children with the Death to Israel bullshit, but they are still basically helpless children repeating what they’re told. Also, even if Israel gets completely fed up and decides to do something (more) drastic, I don’t think it will be so black-and-white as killing every person in Gaza, if for no other reason than that the desired effect would be achieved long before it comes to that. Plus, such an action is going to stir up the hornet’s nest around Israel even more than it is already- they can’t really get away with such a move, and I don’t personally think they are stupid enough to try. +1 to the point that ISIS is not operating in Gaza AFAIK. Now, please stop referring to people as ‘ragheads’, here or elsewhere. It only makes a tragic and volatile situation worse, it is dehumanizing, and in conjunction with your seeming support for genocide, carries an uncomfortably Final Solution vibe. Be a little more sensitive. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2014, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/327 "2014-08-15T02:41:35Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Also, even if Israel gets completely fed up and decides to do something (more) drastic, I don’t think it will be so black-and-white as killing every person in Gaza, if for no other reason than that the desired effect would be achieved long before it comes to that. You can see [some inklings](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=731098)of the “desired effect” already. ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2014, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/328 "2014-08-15T19:48:28Z")
Getting back to Iraq, the IS is rumoured to be preparing an attack on Kirkuk. Maliki has stepped down. The IS have had some small skirmishes with resentful local sunnis. In Syria IS are quickly approaching Aleppo, where Assad’s forces and the other rebel groups are bickering with each other. They claim other rebel groups have raped some of their women, so when IS inevitably defeat the small and scattered forces ranged against them expect slaughter. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2014, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/329 "2014-08-15T20:48:10Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Why be worried? If I cared about you more than, say, how much I care about infected cysts on the ass of diseased yak, I’d be worried about your alarming disassociation with reality. You _did_, in fact, without apology make use of an ethnic slur, just as an example. Your warning was deserved. > [@](#): > > You despise me because I think and you don’t. Deal with it. There’s another word you apparently don’t know the meaning of, “think.” You’ve not demonstrated any particular ability as far as that word is concerned: on the contrary, a disturbing lack thereof. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2014, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/330 "2014-08-15T23:22:18Z")
> [@blindboyard](#): > > Getting back to Iraq, the IS is rumoured to be preparing an attack on Kirkuk. Maliki has stepped down. The IS have had some small skirmishes with resentful local sunnis. In Syria IS are quickly approaching Aleppo, where Assad’s forces and the other rebel groups are bickering with each other. They claim other rebel groups have raped some of their women, so when IS inevitably defeat the small and scattered forces ranged against them expect slaughter. Them taking Kirkuk can’t happen, and I expect, won’t happen. We have the power to eradicate ISIS whenever they try to rear their heads as a conventional army. That’s the limitation of insurgency or guerilla warfare: you can only take friendly ground. Kirkuk is not friendly ground for ISIS, so they have to mount a conventional offensive to take it. Such an offensive will not be allowed to succeed. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/331 "2014-08-16T16:46:18Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Them taking Kirkuk can’t happen, and I expect, won’t happen. We have the power to eradicate ISIS whenever they try to rear their heads as a conventional army. That’s the limitation of insurgency or guerilla warfare: you can only take friendly ground. Kirkuk is not friendly ground for ISIS, so they have to mount a conventional offensive to take it. Such an offensive will not be allowed to succeed. I take it you’ve never heard of [Hue](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Hu%E1%BA%BF)? [Dien Bien Phu](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dien_Bien_Phu)? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/332 "2014-08-16T18:53:42Z")
> [@GrandWino](#): > > Carerful guys, Clothy knows karate. Oh, yeah?! Well I know kung fu, tae kwon do, and 17 other dangerous words! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/333 "2014-08-16T20:08:29Z")
Not nearly as deadly as “Gee. honey, your sister sure is hot!” ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2014, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/334 "2014-08-17T03:18:12Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > I take it you’ve never heard of [Hue](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Hu%E1%BA%BF)? [Dien Bien Phu](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dien_Bien_Phu)? Vietnamese taking over Vietnam isn’t the same as an Arab militia trying to take a diverse, hostile city conventionally with no air cover and a hostile air force bombing them out in the open. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/335 "2014-08-18T10:17:05Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Them taking Kirkuk can’t happen, and I expect, won’t happen. We have the power to eradicate ISIS whenever they try to rear their heads as a conventional army. That’s the limitation of insurgency or guerilla warfare: you can only take friendly ground. Kirkuk is not friendly ground for ISIS, so they have to mount a conventional offensive to take it. Such an offensive will not be allowed to succeed. Their main base and theatre of operation is in Syria. The Kurds won’t go after them there and us attacking them will be implicitly siding with Assad. And yeah - we could bomb flat any city they occupy and send the Kurds in to retake it. Unfortunately that is precisely what they want us to do. Prove that we and the Kurds are the monstrous enemies of the Sunni. Meanwhile the rest of Iraq is complaining we’re doing nothing about ISIS assaults on Baghdad or giving the Iraqi ‘Army’ more stuff to abandon at the first sign of trouble. How about the bloody Saudi’s doing something? It’s not like they haven’t got a very large and extremely well equipped army and air force. About time they used it if they’re so concerned about things. They can’t all be tied up protecting civilisation from women drivers. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/336 "2014-08-18T13:51:44Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > How about the bloody Saudi’s doing something? For which side? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/337 "2014-08-18T15:35:34Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > For which side? Indeed, but as they appear to be all shocked at ISIS they can go after them. I know their whole military is just a recycling petro-dollars kind of thing but it’d be nice if they’d pull their weight every now and then. They could start by [cutting this kind of shit out.](http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/iraq-crisis-how-saudi-arabia-helped-isis-take-over-the-north-of-the-country-9602312.html) > [@](#): > > How far is Saudi Arabia complicit in the Isis takeover of much of northern Iraq, and is it stoking an escalating Sunni-Shia conflict across the Islamic world? Some time before 9/11, Prince Bandar bin Sultan, once the powerful Saudi ambassador in Washington and head of Saudi intelligence until a few months ago, had a revealing and ominous conversation with the head of the British Secret Intelligence Service, MI6, Sir Richard Dearlove. Prince Bandar told him: “The time is not far off in the Middle East, Richard, when it will be literally ‘God help the Shia’. More than a billion Sunnis have simply had enough of them.” > [@](#): > > There is no doubt about the accuracy of the quote by Prince Bandar, secretary-general of the Saudi National Security Council from 2005 and head of General Intelligence between 2012 and 2014, the crucial two years when al-Qa’ida-type jihadis took over the Sunni-armed opposition in Iraq and Syria. Speaking at the Royal United Services Institute last week, Dearlove, who headed MI6 from 1999 to 2004, emphasised the significance of Prince Bandar’s words, saying that they constituted “a chilling comment that I remember very well indeed”. > > He does not doubt that substantial and sustained funding from private donors in Saudi Arabia and Qatar, to which the authorities may have turned a blind eye, has played a central role in the Isis surge into Sunni areas of Iraq. He said: “Such things simply do not happen spontaneously.” This sounds realistic since the tribal and communal leadership in Sunni majority provinces is much beholden to Saudi and Gulf paymasters, and would be unlikely to cooperate with Isis without their consent. As usual the Saudi’s are playing us like a fiddle. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/338 "2014-08-18T16:21:30Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Vietnamese taking over Vietnam isn’t the same as an Arab militia trying to take a diverse, hostile city conventionally with no air cover and a hostile air force bombing them out in the open. _Ahem_ I see. So Vietnamese insurgents successfully taking over diverse, hostile cities and defeating first world armies in open combat conventionally with no air cover and a hostile air force bombing them out in the open does nothing to undermine your absurd notion that “[t]hat’s the limitation of insurgency or guerilla warfare: you can only take friendly ground”. And since it would require a conventional battle, magical thinking that “[s]uch an offensive will not be allowed to succeed” will miracle it to be so. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/339 "2014-08-18T16:29:02Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > TProve that we and the Kurds are the monstrous enemies of the Sunni. The Kurds _ **are** _ in fact mostly\*\* Sunni\*\*. It is bad journalism that keeps talking of the sunni versus the shia versus the Kurds. The difference is the arabism. The DAISH are arab supramacist in their takfiri salafism. The kurds dislike principally the arabism. ---
**Author:** ![Bouncer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9d8465/32.png) [@Bouncer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bouncer)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073/340 "2014-08-18T17:43:09Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > The Kurds _ **are** _ in fact mostly\*\* Sunni\*\*. It is bad journalism that keeps talking of the sunni versus the shia versus the Kurds. The difference is the arabism. The DAISH are arab supramacist in their takfiri salafism. The kurds dislike principally the arabism. Yes, but the Kurds are also more secular. FFS you can buy beer and liquor in some of the grocery stores in Irbil and no one bats an eye. You’re not doing that in Baghdad or the rest of Iraq, because the store would get blown up or machine-gunned. /shrug Regards, -Bouncer- [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isis-youre-going-down/695073.md?page=18)