# Isn't 10 Downing Street, the home of the British PM, kind of a dump? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [November 21, 2005, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064 "2005-11-21T10:56:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![UKsubscriber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/a88e4f/32.png) [@UKsubscriber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UKsubscriber)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2005, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/1 "2005-11-21T10:56:49Z")
Its true that the PM’s “crib” dosn’t look “all that” from the outside. But it is pretty impressive inside. See the tour on the 10 Downing Street Website at [10 Downing Street](http://www.number-10.gov.uk) . The PM also has use of a country residence called Chequers, which is an Elizabethan mansion and certainly looks more palatial from the outside. I’m also afraid that “having even and odd numbers on opposite sides of the street is an American practice” - isn’t true. The houses in Downing Street are numbered 11-12 sequentially simply because they are adjoining and no houses are opposite. That said. It is true that the British don’t like their PMs to be get too many privileges. Blair already gets a lot of stick over being too presidential. See the current furore over [Blair Force One](http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,17129-1881672,00.html) for example. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2005, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/2 "2005-11-21T11:04:05Z")
[Cecil’s column](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_433.html), and a couple of previous threads: > **[10 Downing Street](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=291)** > > I’m sure almost all of Cecil’s research on the home of the British Prime Minister is up to his usual impeccable standards. However… ‘Number 10 is one of only three remaining houses on Downing, the other two being numbers 11 and 12 (all of which... > **[Isn't 10 Downing Street a bit of a dump?](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=2278)** > > original topic : http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2\_433.html Just a quick correction/addition: The PM’s house is actually a lot bigger than it looks from the outside. The PM also has other properties in the country, and does not necessarily... And yep, you’re right on most of it, although that article is showing its age - Thatcher? Who’s she? ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2005, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/3 "2005-11-21T12:42:34Z")
> [@UKsubscriber](#): > > I’m also afraid that “having even and odd numbers on opposite sides of the street is an American practice” - isn’t true. Ditto that. I live at number 95 and my neighbours are 97 and 93. Even numbers are on the opposite side, and this is a common although by no means invariable arrangement. Sloppy work, Cecil. Ask an Englishman in future, it’s not like you need to send a courier to the planet Neptune. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2005, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/4 "2005-11-21T15:01:27Z")
The even/odd arrangement is not so much American as modern. Therefore, England, with older cities, has more old numbers that are an exception. Also, from time to time, the USPO/USPS has put its foot down on practices it regarded as confusing to mailmen, and, recently, 911 telephone support has erased further US anomalous numbering. So it’s easy to get the impression that the even/odd rule is American, but the truth is simply that there are far fewer exceptions to it in America. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2005, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/5 "2005-11-21T15:23:45Z")
> [@John W. Kennedy](#): > > The even/odd arrangement is not so much American as modern. Therefore, England, with older cities, has more old numbers that are an exception. Have you got any evidence for this assertion? I don’t know of any cases, other than odd-shaped roads such as Downing Street or isolated groups of houses, where the British have anything other than the ‘modern’ system of numbering. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/6 "2005-11-22T03:09:40Z")
I know that there were a lot of British anomalies a few decades ago, in cities large enough to have introduced numbers in the 18th-19th centuries, but perhaps there have been reforms since then. (I don’t know how much the 999 system has in common with the 911 system, but I know that some US cities have reorganized their numbers for 911 response.) Many early numbers were added in the order in which houses were built, or even at the owner’s whim. (The LordPeter mailing list went into quite a long discussion of this a while ago, when discussing _The Haunted Policeman_.) ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/7 "2005-11-22T22:42:25Z")
The 999 system doesn’t work like that - there’s necessarily far more reliance on local knowledge. And several times in cities I’ve spotted police cars being driven, with lights & sirens, directed by the guy in the passenger seat who’s working from a map. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/8 "2005-11-23T13:40:49Z")
> [@GorillaMan](#): > > Have you got any evidence for this assertion? I don’t know of any cases, other than odd-shaped roads such as Downing Street or isolated groups of houses, where the British have anything other than the ‘modern’ system of numbering. Oh, I grew up on one, and it was a 1960s development; a sort of Y-shaped arrangement where numbering started from 1 on the left as you went in and carried on sequentially until you reached 50, which was opposite 1 and hence the last on the left as you went back out. Maybe this was because it was a cul-de-sac, or maybe not. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/9 "2005-11-23T13:53:14Z")
Another example is [Mecklenburgh Square](http://www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=530652&y=182409&z=1&sv=mecklenburgh+square&st=6&tl=Mecklenburgh+Square,+London,+WC1n&searchp=newsearch.srf&mapp=newmap.srf), where I lived for a few months a long time ago. The square has buildings on three sides, and the numbering goes counter-clockwise from 1 in the southern corner to 47 in the western corner. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/10 "2005-11-23T21:48:03Z")
As someone who worked as a courier truck driver in London, I would have to say that I never noticed any consistent pattern governing whether a particular road used “odds & evens” or “ups and downs” as we used to call the two systems. Both systems were widespread. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/11 "2005-11-23T21:58:30Z")
Interesting - I’d never realised ‘ups and downs’ were at all common in London. I’m now wondering if it’s also common elsewhere in the country, and I’ve been oblivious all along. (I suppose I should point out that I live in an ‘up but not down’ arrangement myself…six houses on one side of the road, and a playing field on the other 😛 ) ---
**Author:** ![Mk\_VII](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Mk\_VII](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mk_VII)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2005, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/12 "2005-11-24T00:14:27Z")
since Cecil’s 1987 reply Number Ten has been substantially reconstructed again in an attempt to correct its subsidence problems, and, one imagines, beef up its security after a terrorist mortar attack some years ago. The private apartment which is available for the Prime Minister, which was frankly jerry-built, has been modernised and expanded. The current PM actually lives, with his family (first family to live there for many years) in apartments over Nos 11 & 12. Rumour says substantial underground works are contemplated on the site for security reasons ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2005, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/13 "2005-11-24T00:32:55Z")
> [@](#): > > Rumour says substantial underground works are contemplated on the site for security reasons These rumours are constant and have been around for decades. You know the Victoria Line was, according to some, only built to disguise cold war bunker-building around Whitehall? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2005, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-10-downing-street-the-home-of-the-british-pm-kind-of-a-dump/332064/14 "2005-11-25T15:36:38Z")
> [@Original article](#): > > (all of which adjoin–having even and odd numbers on opposite sides of the street is an American practice). [Sarcasm] Well, gee, I didn’t know Spain, Ireland, France, Portugal, Italy, Greece, Switzerland, Belgium, the Czech Republic and Germany were in America! Guess we must’a been kind’a dumb if it took us all that time to discover the place… it was right under our feet, yet we were SO totally convinced we were in Europe! [/Sarcasm] I promise Europe isn’t comprised exclusively of England. Really.