# Isn't faith grand? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 4, 2014, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350 "2014-12-04T22:19:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2014, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/1 "2014-12-04T22:19:46Z")
Faith is quite an amazing thing, especially when combined with an unshakable belief in the literal nature of biblical scripture. Long story short: A VERY devout Christian family knew that prayers are much, much more powerful than a handful of pills from an unbeliever. So they pray that the husbands foot gets better after it becomes infected. It does not get better. In fact, it gets really bad. He stops breathing. His heart stops pumping. These inconsequential facts do not deter the faithful, however. The wife KNOWS that Jesus is all-powerful, and has in fact delivered miracles to the faithful before. After all, was Lazerus not brought back from the dead? So she continues to have faith, and to pray. For. Six . Months. While the now decomposing corpse of her former husband sat in their bedroom. Thankfully, the body was discovered after they defaulted on the mortgage and were evicted (I guess Jesus also ignored the prayers to pay the monthly payments as well) I know there is not a bright line between extreme faith and mental illness. Not sure where this family fits on the spectrum. > **[Hamilton family left corpse upstairs for six months expecting resurrection](https://www.thespec.com/news/hamilton-region/2014/12/02/hamilton-family-left-corpse-upstairs-for-six-months-expecting-resurrection.html)** > > GRAPHIC WARNING: Guilty plea in bizarre case ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2014, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/2 "2014-12-04T22:37:26Z")
I’m sure. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2014, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/3 "2014-12-04T22:51:52Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Thankfully, the body was discovered after they defaulted on the mortgage and were evicted …in fulfillment of the scriptures… ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2014, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/4 "2014-12-04T23:14:58Z")
Sounds like mental illness and not faith. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2014, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/5 "2014-12-04T23:23:00Z")
> [@sisu](#): > > Sounds like mental illness and not faith. Who are we to say though, and what would the diagnosis be? I note that this was never brought up during the subsequent court case, by the prosecution the defense, nor the judge. > [@](#): > > " Your belief that your husband would resurrect is not an issue," Superiour Court Justice Marjoh Agro said Monday. “This is not about your religious beliefs. It is about your safety, the safety of your children and the safety of the community at large.” And this was not simply a single person believing this either: > [@](#): > > "Everyone living in the home – Kaling, five of her six children age 11 to 22, and seven other adult friends – were interviewed by police. Each provided a consistent account of his death and their religious belief that he could be resurrected. " Finally, if it was a mental health issue, I doubt that the authorities would have left the children in the care of the mother: > [@](#): > > "The Children’s Aid Society was called in too but they found no concerns for the well-being of the couple’s children and the case was closed. " ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/6 "2014-12-05T01:13:39Z")
This is one of those cases that, IMO, shows that most people do not really believe in God. Mrs. Wald and her husband, their children and friends clearly believe(d) in God; everyone else involved, not so much. ---
**Author:** ![nani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/58956e/32.png) [@nani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nani)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/7 "2014-12-05T01:52:04Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > This is one of those cases that, IMO, shows that most people do not really believe in God. Mrs. Wald and her husband, their children and friends clearly believe(d) in God; everyone else involved, not so much. I think it just shows that most people who claim to believe in God do not also believe that God will do things like that. ---
**Author:** ![Lanzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/74df32/32.png) [@Lanzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lanzy)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/8 "2014-12-05T02:20:40Z")
If all faithful believed this strongly, we would soon have a lot less faithful. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/9 "2014-12-05T09:42:50Z")
**Polemic** : Who are we to say though, and what would the diagnosis be? It was a folie a deux, until about 6 months ago. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/10 "2014-12-05T11:54:06Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > This is one of those cases that, IMO, shows that most people do not really believe in God. Mrs. Wald and her husband, their children and friends clearly believe(d) in God; everyone else involved, not so much. Or, they believe that God sent the doctor and his pills. Or, they believe that God wanted to call the man home, and it was time for him to go. There are a lot of ways believers can go other than, “God will perform miracles at my request.” ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/11 "2014-12-05T15:20:14Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Or, they believe that God sent the doctor and his pills. Or, they believe that God wanted to call the man home, and it was time for him to go. > > There are a lot of ways believers can go other than, “God will perform miracles at my request.” When you believe that everything that happens is “gods will” it becomes easier. At least that’s what I’ve learned by observing my ultra-religious family and their friends. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/12 "2014-12-05T18:16:36Z")
> [@Antinor01](#): > > When you believe that everything that happens is “gods will” it becomes easier. At least that’s what I’ve learned by observing my ultra-religious family and their friends. if everything that happens is “gods will” - then prayer is useless - since whatever will happen is clearly being decided at a higher paygrade then yours. ---
**Author:** ![raspberry\_hunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@raspberry\_hunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raspberry_hunter)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/13 "2014-12-05T18:34:20Z")
There are a heck of a lot of people in the Bible who die and don’t get resurrected. Good people! In fact, I’d venture to say that the vast majority of faithful people in the Bible who die don’t get resurrected, especially if Jesus doesn’t happen to be around in bodily form. So… aren’t you _not_ believing in literal scripture if you think that it’s _certain_ that your random family member will be resurrected? ---
**Author:** ![Lanzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/74df32/32.png) [@Lanzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lanzy)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/14 "2014-12-05T19:35:01Z")
Maybe they never heard that sometimes the answer is NO!. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/15 "2014-12-05T21:34:05Z")
> [@Lanzy](#): > > Maybe they never heard that sometimes the answer is NO!. hmmmm - [QUOTE=JESUS@John 14] 12Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 **You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.** [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/16 "2014-12-06T03:40:58Z")
> [@simster](#): > > if everything that happens is “gods will” - then prayer is useless - since whatever will happen is clearly being decided at a higher paygrade then yours. Good thing I don’t believe such crap. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/17 "2014-12-06T05:18:51Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > This is one of those cases that, IMO, shows that most people do not really believe in God. Mrs. Wald and her husband, their children and friends clearly believe(d) in God; everyone else involved, not so much. Verify I say unto you, that the words of the prophecy have been fulfilled [as (well, figuratively) it was written > [@](#): > > A terrible storm came into a town and local officials sent out an emergency warning that the riverbanks would soon overflow and flood the nearby homes. They ordered everyone in the town to evacuate immediately. > > A faithful Christian man heard the warning and decided to stay, saying to himself, “I will trust God and if I am in danger, then God will send a divine miracle to save me.” > > The neighbors came by his house and said to him, “We’re leaving and there is room for you in our car, please come with us!” But the man declined. “I have faith that God will save me.” > > As the man stood on his porch watching the water rise up the steps, a man in a canoe paddled by and called to him, “Hurry and come into my canoe, the waters are rising quickly!” But the man again said, “No thanks, God will save me.” > > The floodwaters rose higher pouring water into his living room and the man had to retreat to the second floor. A police motorboat came by and saw him at the window. “We will come up and rescue you!” they shouted. But the man refused, waving them off saying, “Use your time to save someone else! I have faith that God will save me!” > > The flood waters rose higher and higher and the man had to climb up to his rooftop. > > A helicopter spotted him and dropped a rope ladder. A rescue officer came down the ladder and pleaded with the man, “Grab my hand and I will pull you up!” But the man STILL refused, folding his arms tightly to his body. “No thank you! God will save me!” > > Shortly after, the house broke up and the floodwaters swept the man away and he drowned. > > When in Heaven, the man stood before God and asked, “I put all of my faith in You. Why didn’t You come and save me?” > > And God said, “Son, I sent you a warning. I sent you a car. I sent you a canoe. I sent you a motorboat. I sent you a helicopter. What more were you looking for?” ]([God Will Save Me](http://epistle.us/inspiration/godwillsaveme.html)) ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/18 "2014-12-06T14:21:53Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > … What more where you looking for? A clue maybe? I’ve always enjoyed that joke. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/19 "2014-12-06T14:33:18Z")
> [@simster](#): > > if everything that happens is “gods will” - then prayer is useless - since whatever will happen is clearly being decided at a higher paygrade then yours. Faith presumes that everything happens according to god’s will, and prayer can cause the most powerful being in the universe to _change his will._ Believers are nothing if not cheeky. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350/20 "2014-12-06T14:48:49Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Faith presumes that everything happens according to god’s will, and prayer can cause the most powerful being in the universe to _change his will._ Believers are nothing if not cheeky. Hey god - if it be your will, could you please do X and help Y? and if its not your will, thats ok too - just thought I’d like ask and all - no biggie - k bye. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/isnt-faith-grand/706350.md?page=2)