# Israel 60 years: A very improper celebration indeed **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 8, 2008, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622 "2008-05-08T23:04:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/101 "2008-05-09T13:48:00Z")
[QUOTE=FinnAgain] Life in the Wildfireverse: [/QUOTE] Aren’t Arabs descended from, or are, semetic people? What did this clown (the Grand Mufti) think would happen if Germany and Hitler were victorious and had control of the ME? Welcome them as brothers? Yeah, right. I think he would more likely see a use for all those recently empty ovens. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/102 "2008-05-09T13:49:58Z")
Jesus Christ on a pogo stick you’re a fucking moron, **Wildfire**. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/103 "2008-05-09T13:51:40Z")
[QUOTE=Noone Special] **Happy Birthday, Israel!** 🙂 [/QUOTE] I just came in to repeat that. 🙂 The OP neither deserves nor requires any other response. ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/104 "2008-05-09T13:58:58Z")
[QUOTE=brazil84] STEAK BURRITOS 2 lb. steak, all fat trimmed & cubed 1 sm. diced onion 1 diced tomato 1 sm. can tomato sauce 1 sm. jar taco salsa 1 pkg. taco seasoning 8 burrito shells Sliced cheese Brown steak in fry pan with little oil. Add onion and tomato. Add tomato sauce, taco salsa and seasoning. Bring to light boil. Add flour to thicken into gravy. After thickened turn to simmer. Warm burritos in a pan. Then put a slice of cheese and then meat. Roll to eat. [/QUOTE] That sounds pretty damn good, actually. Sadly, a chance to munch on them while seeing if Sampras can actually win on clay is lacking in this day and age. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/105 "2008-05-09T14:29:12Z")
[QUOTE=Wildfire\*\*MM] Then you agree that the origin of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict was and is the jewish immigration to that area and their nationalistict aspiration to create a jewish nation? [/QUOTE] No, moron, that was not the point of my post at all. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/106 "2008-05-09T14:43:30Z")
[QUOTE=Uzi] Aren’t Arabs descended from, or are, semetic people? What did this clown (the Grand Mufti) think would happen if Germany and Hitler were victorious and had control of the ME? Welcome them as brothers? Yeah, right. I think he would more likely see a use for all those recently empty ovens. [/QUOTE] Well, yes, Arabs are Semitic people. And not to get too deep into the history, but for competing factions of the early Arab Nationalism movement, rendering the land Judenrein wasn’t necessarily primary. The time period was undoubtedly [highly complex.](http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,484510,00.html) World War I had brought about the end of roughly 400 years of Ottoman dominance in the region, many nations were essentially created out of whole cloth during this time, with Colonialist policies still in place for a good twenty years or so in most cases. In many former Ottoman provinces, rising sentiments of nationalism also met rising levels of anti-Semitism. It was a very, very strange marriage of convenience. Or as the Spiegel article puts it: > [@](#): > > Separately, recently published research by two Stuttgart-based historians, Klaus-Michael Mallmann and Martin Cüppers, claims that Hitler had worked out plans to extend the Holocaust to the Middle East, and that the Nazis had forged an alliance with Arab nationalists who wanted to drive the Jewish refugees out of Palestine – a murderous version of German-Arab friendship founded on common hatred of Jews. Jews living in the Middle East were petrified by Rommel’s victories. After seizing the British fortress of Tobruk in Libya in June 1942 he set his sights on the Suez Canal, on Palestine and the oil fields of the Middle East. > > “Those fighting Jewry can always rely on the sympathy of the Arab population,” the German army general staff wrote in an information booklet to prepare troops for the conquest of Palestine. > […] > Hitler was celebrated in large parts of the Arab world, and some newspapers even likened him to the Prophet. The Desert Fox was almost as popular as Hitler. “Heil Rommel” was a common greeting in Arab countries. > > Many Arabs thought the Germans would free them from the rule of the old colonial powers France and Britain. Hitler had shown how to burst the shackles of the Treaty of Versailles. After Germany defeated France in 1940, chants against the French and British echoed around the streets of Damascus: “No more Monsieur, no more Mister, Allah’s in Heaven and Hitler’s on earth.” > > Adolf Hitler assured the exiled Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, Muhammad Amin al-Husseini, at a meeting in Berlin in November 1941 that his goal was the “destruction of Jewry living in Arabia.” The Führer had racist objections to Arabs as well, though. He declined to shake the Mufti’s hand and refused to drink coffee with him. > > Hitler nevertheless provided the Mufti, who later sponsored Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, with a budget of 750,000 Reichsmark per month to foment Jihad in Palestine. In an example of ideological flexibility, the SS even recruited Muslim volunteers and declared that the Muslims living in the Balkans belonged to the “racially valuable” peoples of Europe. What would have happened over time had the Nazis won is anybody’s guess. That the Holocaust would have been brought to the ME is beyond question. That the Arab nations would have been granted (at least temporary) autonomy from Britain and France is, likewise, pretty much a certainty. What Germany would have done once its primary scapegoat was eradicated from the planet? That’s probably the kind of stuff that Turtledove should deal with, but it’s a pretty safe bet that it would not have turned out at all well for the Arabs. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/107 "2008-05-09T14:43:32Z")
[QUOTE=Wildfire\*\*MM] You don’t know me and the accusations you come with here are far over the limit [/QUOTE] Strictly from a Moderating standpoint, they’re not over the limit in this forum at all. You may find them personally objectionable, but as you can see, many people find your viewpoints objectionable, so fair is fair. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/108 "2008-05-09T15:09:12Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] Strictly from a Moderating standpoint, they’re not over the limit in this forum at all. You may find them personally objectionable, but as you can see, many people find your viewpoints objectionable, so fair is fair. [/QUOTE] Typical Jew. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/109 "2008-05-09T15:13:33Z")
[QUOTE=Wildfire\*\*MM] and what the fuck does any american know about Israel and the jews americans have a mindset that they still live in the 1950s. Nationalistic pygmies with a duel personality, so fucking high moral in public, but at the same time have their own homes filled with perverse porn. Redneck evangelical christians, perverted hillbilly’s in the deep south and necons that wants to rule the world. Thats America! Most american can’t stand the fact that most humans actually don’t want to be american (Usanians) [/QUOTE] Hmmm. Since I actually live here (in the U.S.), I think I’ll trust my own direct observations instead. But thanks for your input! ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/110 "2008-05-09T15:16:51Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] Typical Jew. 😉 [/QUOTE] [Maybe not so much.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9775999&postcount=127) 😉 But I _am_ in the mood for a knosh, so I may go out for a nice bagel. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/111 "2008-05-09T15:33:23Z")
[QUOTE=Wildfire\*\*MM] americans have a mindset that they still live in the 1950s. Nationalistic pygmies with a duel personality, so fucking high moral in public, but at the same time have their own homes filled with perverse porn. Redneck evangelical christians, perverted hillbilly’s in the deep south and necons that wants to rule the world. Thats America! Most american can’t stand the fact that most humans actually don’t want to be american (Usanians) [/QUOTE] It’s not full. Yet. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![koeeoaddi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/koeeoaddi/32/408_2.png) [@koeeoaddi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/koeeoaddi)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/112 "2008-05-09T15:48:49Z")
[QUOTE=Noone Special] **Happy Birthday, Israel!** 🙂 [/QUOTE] …and many happy returns! :throws some nice kosher confetti: [This may be the the most idiotic OP I’ve read in my 5 years on the Dope.] ---
**Author:** ![Omegaman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e480ec/32.png) [@Omegaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omegaman)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/113 "2008-05-09T16:09:50Z")
[QUOTE=FinnAgain] Report me to a mod then, you lying genocidal freak. P.S. Your post advocating genocide is _in this thread_. Why deny it, scum? Are you drunk? Stupid? Drunk and stupid? I’m curious. [/QUOTE] Oh **Finn** , don’t be so harsh. You don’t want to go offending someones tender sensibilties even if they live in world far, far away from this fine planet us people call home. 😉 And **Wildfire** , if you don’t want your feelings hurt please don’t judge people in such large groups. You’re starting to remind me of some one that has garnered my dislike through his horiible actions. I’m sure you’ve heard that raving hate mongerer I’m refering to, a Mr. Adolf Hitler. Oh, and by the way, so you don’t start judging me, I am circumcised however I consider myself to be one of Jesus’s flock. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/114 "2008-05-09T16:33:47Z")
[QUOTE=koeeoaddi] …and many happy returns! :throws some nice kosher confetti: [This may be the the most idiotic OP I’ve read in my 5 years on the Dope.] [/QUOTE] I guess you missed the one about taxing fat people? The OP itself is idiotic, but this thread might look quite different if someone with half a brain had written it [the OP]. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/115 "2008-05-09T16:35:37Z")
[QUOTE=Omegaman] Oh **Finn** , don’t be so harsh. You don’t want to go offending someones tender sensibilties even if they live in world far, far away from this fine planet us people call home. [/quote] This thread is kind of a Perfect Storm type situation. Posters who are stupid are annoying, but can be ignored pretty easily. Posters who are stupid and ignorant are more annoying, but mockery generally suffices. Posters who are stupid, ignorant and big-mouthed are frustrating and debating against them can be a chore, as they don’t even generally realize when you’ve proven them wrong. Posters who are stupid, ignorant, big-mouthed and dishonest are very, very frustrating and debating against them is almost always a lost cause, as they either don’t generally realize when you prove them wrong, or they simply don’t care and just go back to spouting shit that sounds good to them. Posters who are stupid, ignorant, big-mouthed, dishonest and call for genocide would qualify as one of my pet peeves 😉 That and, to be honest, I’ve been more than a bit annoyed with some of the idiots who frequent (and crap on) GD threads about the ME. And since Wildfire’s thread was already in the Pit… 😃 [QUOTE=Omegaman] I am circumcised however I consider myself to be one of Jesus’s flock. [/QUOTE] Pssst… don’t let **Hal Briston** know. ---
**Author:** ![Omegaman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e480ec/32.png) [@Omegaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omegaman)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/116 "2008-05-09T17:52:44Z")
**Finn** , I just don’t know how it is I’ve missed your posts in the past. I’ve certainly grown up some over the past few years so I guess I could see how it happened. Not to get all off track or anything but you sound to me like one of the few, the proud, Men. If you get my meaning. ---
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/117 "2008-05-09T18:13:45Z")
[QUOTE=FinnAgain] No, I doubt that. Most of them at the very least know a tiny bit about the history of the region. And not many of them would be happy with the destruction of the country. Although, of course, I suppose we can try to parse ignorance based hatred of a nation from ignorance based hatred of a people. I don’t much feel the need, myself. [/QUOTE] Doubt away. [64% of Israelis favor direct talks with Hamas](http://www.newsweek.com/id/119881). Only 28% oppose them. Riiiiight. Everyone who opposes Israel’s policies is anti-Jew. That’s very big this year. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/118 "2008-05-09T18:34:24Z")
[QUOTE=Tristan] That sounds pretty damn good, actually. [/QUOTE] A couple of days ago, I made myself an Italian-style meat loaf. It was delicious. Here’s the basics: Cut the crusts off two pieces of bread, tear them into small chunks, and stir with two tablespoons of whole milk until you’ve made a thick, grainy paste. Dice a large shallot and caramelize half of it in a small pan; mix the cooked and uncooked shallot together. Dice a quarter-pound of pancetta. Mince two cloves garlic. Grate a quarter cup of fresh Parmigiano. Separate two eggs, retaining the yolks. Mix all of the foregoing with a pound of ground Jew meat, along with two teaspoons of kosher salt and three-quarters of a teaspoon of fresh black pepper. Form the meat into a loaf and roll in bread crumbs until coated. Heat two tablespoons of olive oil over medium-high heat in a heavy skillet with a lid until shimmering, then brown the meat loaf on all sides, about a minute per side. Reduce heat to low, add a half cup of white wine to the skillet, and cover. Cook 30 minutes or until center temperature reaches 165 degrees. When done, remove from heat and let rest at least 15 minutes before slicing. During that period, you can make a lovely pan sauce by deglazing with a small amount of stock, then adding wine, reconstituted dried mushrooms along with their soaking liquid, and a small can of crushed tomatoes. Cook over medium for ten minutes, then raise to high and boil until reduced by half. Slice meat loaf and pour sauce over. I’d also recommend making polenta as an excellent complementary starch. I didn’t have Jew meat, so I used ground elk. It was still pretty good. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/119 "2008-05-09T19:09:29Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] I’d also recommend making polenta as an excellent complementary starch. [/QUOTE] Or okra fritters. I’ll see if I can convince Mrs. J. to share her recipe. ---
**Author:** ![Cluricaun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bb73d2/32.png) [@Cluricaun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cluricaun)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622/120 "2008-05-09T20:10:02Z")
[QUOTE=Q.E.D.] This story sounds so familiar. I think there’s another country with exactly this same history, right down to the bulldozing of a well-established native people, and they’ll also be celebrating this achievement in a few months. Starts with a “U” and I think it might be south of Canada. I’m sure I’ll think of it in a moment. [/QUOTE] Ulster? 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-60-years-a-very-improper-celebration-indeed/448622.md?page=7)