Okay, so short of annihilating the other side, there will be permanent conflict forever?
If I could answer for myself for a second, supposing that the surveys were valid, so what? I believe Europe, and especially France, has a very nation-centric mindset. In America, you’re taught that you can be Mexican-American, Chinese-American, African-American, but in France, you are taught that you should be French first and everything else second. They don’t merely expect you to be part of the melting pot, they expect you to supplant your old loyalties with French loyalties. In this way, any outside ethnic or religious group would be seen as keeping too much of their identity. Its not anti-Semitism, its simply anti-foreigner. The Jews aren’t special in this case.
For the second question, people have been thinking the Jews have a lot of power for a long time. Its just a stereotype now. I’m sure if the same question was asked in America, you’d get a statistical bump for them too
Same thing with France, so what if the British think that? Its not anti-Semitism, its just some underlying prejudice. Its a problem, but lets not call it anti-Semitism as if we’re comparing it to real anti-Semitism like they suffered in past decades and centuries.
So it’s an anti-Semitic trope going back millenia. And your obfuscation is ridiculous, the idea that Jews who’ve been living in a country in an unbroken lineage for centuries are “foreigners” is something right out of Nazi ontology. To say nothing of the fact that your claim seems more than a bit like special pleading. Can you, for instance, provide any evidence of polls which show that Europeans think any other religious group, at all, is more loyal to “global [their religion]” than their own homes?
Prove you’re not just handwaving away facts with obfuscation. Prove that, for instance, the French have anywhere near the antipathy to French Catholics they have for French Jews. Something tells me you can’t. Just as your insinuation is that somehow being a French Jew is not “supplant[ing] your old loyalties with French loyalties.”
… yes, many racist tropes have a long history and are stereotypes. Why you think that naming them as such makes them any less racist is baffling. “Yeah, but it’s a stereotype that blacks are drug addled criminals. What’s the big deal, people have believed that for a while?”
Give 50% of settlement housing to Palestinian families. (every other house). Allow teenagers to fall in love and intermarry. Problem solved in two generations.
Plenty of Israeli cities have mixed Arab and Jewish populations. The teenagers do not fall in love and intermarry. The problem hasn’t been solved in the past 5 generations.
Yog, you’re completely ignoring the history of anti-Semitism.
The “dual-loyalty” myth is one of the oldest myths around.
Additionally, France is vastly more multicultural than you seem to realize. There are huge numbers of Frenchmen who are descended from Spaniards, Portuguese and others, yet Frenchmen with the last name Martinez don’t face similar levels of distrust.
It’s also interesting that you’re arguing that viewing French Jews who’ve lived there for centuries as “foreigners” isn’t anti-Semitic.
Using your logic, suspecting Muslim Americans, Japanese Americans and German Americans shouldn’t be seen as anti-Muslim, anti-Japanese, or anti-German bigotry.
They can’t intermarry in Israel.
The State won’t even recognize marriages between Muslim boys and Jewish girls even though Islam allows interfaith marriages(so long as the male is Muslim).
The only way interfaith marriages happen is to fly to Cyprus.
Complete defeat does not require annihilation. For example the South after the American Civil War or Germany after World War II.
The thing is, at the moment, Israel has the military strength to defeat the Arabs but lacks the manpower and the will for the sort of occupation necessary to bring the Arabs to their knees. The Arabs have the manpower and the will, but not the military strength. So the conflict will continue until one side has all three.
Is dual loyalty a myth though? It seems pretty natural and common for people to hold some loyalty to their ancestral country/homeland etc. You also see it in terms of religion with UK troops from Afghanistan/Iraq getting abused by UK muslims upon their return. It’s human nature.
An offensive, untrue myth with millenia of baggage. Yeah.
Really? How many cites can you find of, say, non-bigoted, non-racist mainstream American commentators/pundits/politicians who worry about whether or not WASPS can be trusted when it comes to NATO? Do you think it’s more or fewer than those who wonder if American Jews can be trusted when it comes to Israel?
Yes, it’s racist bullshit.
I assume you’d agree that it was racist for a liberal group in Kentucky to claim Senator Mitch McConnell couldn’t be trusted because his wife, Elaine Chao, is Chinese-American.
Obviously there are many bigots who think that Chinese-Americans or French Jews can’t be trusted but that doesn’t we should treat them with anything but contempt.
Obviously YogSosoth thinks we shouldn’t get upset with people thinking French Jews are untrustworthy traitors and presumably he thinks the same of people who think Chinese Americans are untrustworthy, but most of us feel differently, and I’m sure if he really thought about it, he’d change his mind.
Nitpick: The European Union has 13 million Muslims, as per your cite - Europe, however, has 44 million Muslims (excluding Turkey).
(Sez Wikipedia, anyways.)
Tolerance 101. Move the Hill People and the Valley People into adjoining tenements, let the girls show some ankle, and let nature take its course. Everybody over 40 goes insane screaming it’s the end of the world. Then they die, and the hate dies with them.
Not a bad plan.
Not to anyone remotely familiar with the situation.
For that matter, it’s a really stupid idea to anyone familiar with history or basic human nature.
It didn’t work in the Jim Crow South, didn’t work in Lebanon, didn’t work in Northern Ireland, it didn’t work in Yugoslavia, and it hasn’t worked in Israel over 65 years.
Why would anyone possibly think it would work now when it has so consistently failed elsewhere.
Besides, these are Jews you’re talking about. In the past 2,000 years we’ve had plenty of opportunities, and much stronger incentives, to do what you’re suggesting. Why on earth would we do in now when we’re finally ahead of the game?
Well, that’s the Israeli intention, or it’s at least something Israel can very comfortably live with and benefit from.
The fundamental of all fundamental issues is, and will always be, national security: Israel can never allow an autonomous Palestinian State. Far, far better the low-level managed conflict we have now.
There was no way the Jordanians were going to allow a Palestinian state in the West Bank. You’re not doing your argument any service when you conflate the Jordanians and the Palestinians into generic “Arabs”.
Let’s assume that’s true. Let me ask you this: Was there a serious push among Arabs anywhere to create a Palestinian state in (what used to be known as) Judea and Samaria? What about the Palestinian Arabs themselves? Did they seriously push for an independent Palestinian state between 1948 and 1967 with its capital in Jerusalem? Or were most of their energies directed against Jewish Israel?
Assuming that the big push for Palestinian statehood came as a result of Jewish occupation, why should it make a difference to the Palestinian Arabs (and their supporters) whether their proposed country is occupied by Israelis or Jordanians?
I disagree, since people (both Arabs and non-Arabs) have a strong tendency to subconsciously think in these terms. “Palestinian” is an artificial distinction created and used primarily for purposes of undermining Zionism.
Let me illustrate this: Did you know that hundreds of “Palestinians” have been slaughtered by the Assad regime in Syria over the past few months? Did you know that the Syrian government has shelled “Palestinian” refugee camps?
Why do you suppose it is that organizations which claim to support “Palestinians” have been so quiet about these issues?
In any event, the creation of an autonomous Palestinian state would not end the conflict. It would exacerbate the conflict.
Ah, point taken.
Revised figures: 739 million people, 44 million Muslims.