# Israel invades Gaza Strip?! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 28, 2006, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434 "2006-06-28T02:13:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2006, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/241 "2006-07-07T18:21:30Z")
Update: Now Israel is hinting at a [prisoner exchange](http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150885942583&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull) for Shalit. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/242 "2006-07-12T13:36:13Z")
[Major Update](http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/12/mideast/index.html): Israel has entered Lebanon, following the abduction of two Israeli soldiers by Hezbollah. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/243 "2006-07-12T14:35:08Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Which is indicative of the degree of ambiguity in both the legalities and the situation on the ground in Gaza and the West Bank. Ah yes, ambiguity. So on the one hand, the Palestinians may be right , yet on the other hand the Israelis may be wrong? Fuck it. I’m sitting here, waiting to see if my reserve unit is called up, and I’m supposed to care about some stupid thread on the SDMB? It’s all bullshit anyway. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/244 "2006-07-12T14:40:33Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I’m sitting here, waiting to see if my reserve unit is called up For whatever it’s worth, my thoughts are with you and Israel. ---
**Author:** ![Noone\_Special](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noone_special/32/2863_2.png) [@Noone\_Special](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noone_Special)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/245 "2006-07-12T14:50:30Z")
> [@Loopydude](#): > > [Major Update](http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/12/mideast/index.html): Israel has entered Lebanon, following the abduction of two Israeli soldiers by Hezbollah. OK – so now we have an overt act of war, from a UN-recognized country, with a UN-recognized frontier with Israel ,and a (sort of) functioning central government. So how long after Israel reacts to an act of war like it is fighting a war will it take for the Europeans to start “urging restraint?” (only on the israelis of course!) Like **Alessan** , I’m waiting to see if I’m called up (and I am _far_ to old for his shit.) I know this in not in the Pit, but fuck World Opinion on our behavior when we are attacked with a five-speed chain saw. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/246 "2006-07-12T14:57:53Z")
> [@Noone Special](#): > > OK – so now we have an overt act of war, from a UN-recognized country, with a UN-recognized frontier with Israel ,and a (sort of) functioning central government. No, sir, not **from** that country, except in a geographic sense. Lebanon != Hezbollah. Israel has no more right to cross that border over this than Pershing had to cross the Mexican border in pursuit of Pancho Villa. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/247 "2006-07-12T15:00:34Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No, sir, not **from** that country, except in a geographic sense. Lebanon != Hezbollah. Israel has no more right to cross that border over this than Pershing had to cross the Mexican border in pursuit of Pancho Villa. Lebanon is responsible for Hizballa. If it can’t controll it, it has no right to call itself a sovereign nation. In which case, our troops are entering a no-man’s land. And Pershing was well within his rights. ---
**Author:** ![Noone\_Special](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noone_special/32/2863_2.png) [@Noone\_Special](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noone_Special)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/248 "2006-07-12T15:15:26Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No, sir, not **from** that country, except in a geographic sense. Lebanon != Hezbollah. Israel has no more right to cross that border over this than Pershing had to cross the Mexican border in pursuit of Pancho Villa. Um… either Lebanon exists, or it doesn’t. If it does, it is responsible for policing its borders, and any act of war against its neighbors, carried out through said border, must be laid at its feet. So it is a clear _Casus Belli_. If not, what we have to our North is complete anarchy, so it is our right and duty to police that area to the extent required to ensure that soverign Israeli territory is not attacked from it. Either was I don’t see how our reaction can be anything but justified except by somebody with an I-don’t-give-a-damn-about-the-facts-I-hate-Israel agenda. Oh, and about what I posted minutes ago? > [@Me](#): > > So how long after Israel reacts to an act of war like it is fighting a war will it take for the Europeans to start “urging restraint?” Well, it’s taking shorter than we thought… > [@Kofi Annan](#): > > (from [yahoo!](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060712/ap_on_re_mi_ea/lebanon_israel_clash;_ylt=AuqRKBU5F16Oi72agh1aXlGs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA2Z2szazkxBHNlYwN0bQ--)) > U.N. Secretary-General > Kofi Annan called for the immediate release of kidnapped Israeli soldiers **and condemned Israel’s retaliation in southern Lebanon**. Fuck this… we have a war waged on us on two fronts, and all the world can tell us is to keep quiet? :mad: :mad: :mad: No wonder we won’t be listening to everybody’s oh-so-helpful “advice” in the near future! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/249 "2006-07-12T15:18:23Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No, sir, not **from** that country, except in a geographic sense. Lebanon != Hezbollah. Israel has no more right to cross that border over this than Pershing had to cross the Mexican border in pursuit of Pancho Villa. Are Lebanese troops making strong efforts to restrain and repress Hezbollah? If they are either incapable of or unwilling to do so, then they are either engaging in acts of war by proxy or they do not in point of fact have sovreignty over the area. In such cases, Israel is perfectly justified in invading. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/250 "2006-07-12T15:42:46Z")
> [@Noone Special](#): > > Um… either Lebanon exists, or it doesn’t. If it does, it is responsible for policing its borders, and any act of war against its neighbors, carried out through said border, must be laid at its feet. So it is a clear _Casus Belli_. > If not, what we have to our North is complete anarchy, so it is our right and duty to police that area to the extent required to ensure that soverign Israeli territory is not attacked from it. > Either was I don’t see how our reaction can be anything but justified except by somebody with an I-don’t-give-a-damn-about-the-facts-I-hate-Israel agenda. > > Oh, and about what I posted minutes ago? > Well, it’s taking shorter than we thought… > Fuck this… we have a war waged on us on two fronts, and all the world can tell us is to keep quiet? :mad: :mad: :mad: > No wonder we won’t be listening to everybody’s oh-so-helpful “advice” in the near future! :rolleyes: Well, it is typical. The attempt in the manner described to portray oneself as “even handed”, “fair”, “balanced” and “neutral” _inevitably_ is for the benefit of aggressors, terrorists and the like. It has to be. Because it treats aggression and self-defence as morally equivalent. ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/251 "2006-07-12T16:02:02Z")
Or could it be the fact that Some wish to prevent further destabilzation in the region? With Israeli forces in Lebanon it is likely Lebanon will respond and likely bring Syria into it. What does that give us ? Another war, another occupation more resentment, terrorism and the whole region circling down the perverbial drain. Al we need now is for some Egyptian radicals to try to capture a few soldiers to create friction between those two. I have no idea how to resolve this but if a national boarder gets crossed that is pretty hard for others to ignore. Still what does Israel do? Sitting back and acting with restraint doesn’t work, and acting out doesn’t do anything but grow another generateion of suicide bombers and terror groups, besides I doubt Isreal can occupy the entire region, so what do they do? I honestly don’t know. But I don’t think the latest actions will make this situation better. I’m just greatful to live in a country that doesn’t have that kind of tension around it. ---
**Author:** ![gum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bbe5ce/32.png) [@gum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gum)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/252 "2006-07-12T20:02:50Z")
I’m so embarrassed being European right now. Thank og the Netherlands did something right. [http://www.adl.org/PresRele/UnitedNations\_94/4847\_94.htm](http://www.adl.org/PresRele/UnitedNations_94/4847_94.htm) _[I’m going to hug right here, in Great Debates. Sue me.]_ \*\*(((((Alessan))))) (((((Noone))))) & (((((Israël))))) \*\* Please stay safe. . ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/253 "2006-07-12T20:06:03Z")
> [@gum](#): > > _[I’m going to hug right here, in Great Debates. Sue me.]_ > \*\*(((((Alessan))))) (((((Noone))))) & (((((Israël))))) \*\* Please stay safe. > > . Hug seconded! Stay safe! ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2006, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/254 "2006-07-12T22:11:10Z")
**Allesan** and **No one** , best of luck. Keep your heads down and your aim true if it comes to that. > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No, sir, not **from** that country, except in a geographic sense. No… do you honestly require cites for the real relationship? You do know that they’re really very closely linked and you’re just trying to quibble? Or like RTF, are you engaging in a discussion where you have no idea what the actual facts are? > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Lebanon != Hezbollah. And the ‘contractors’ we have working in Iraq now on our behalf also have nothing to do with us. Nopers… and if we hired, trained, and equipped them to invade a country, and they launched their assault from bases in the US, it still wouldn’t have anything to do with us. > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Israel has no more right to cross that border over this than Pershing had to cross the Mexican border in pursuit of Pancho Villa. You’ve also stated that no matter what provocation, no matter what, any defensive reaction is magically an aggressive reaction. Seeing as you’ve already denied a sovereign nation the right of self defense, why should your further judgements matter, and why should they be posted? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2006, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/255 "2006-07-13T04:03:49Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > You’ve also stated that no matter what provocation, no matter what, any defensive reaction is magically an aggressive reaction. No, sir, I have never stated that, and shame on you. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2006, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/256 "2006-07-13T04:35:50Z")
Shame? Should I be ashamed for showing you your own words? Is that how shame is supposed to work? Should I be ashamed, sir, because _you_ have forgotten, or don’t want to own up to what you wrote? [ > [@](#): > > No matter what provocation has gone before, if the Israelis were to drop actual bombs on the president’s palace, they would not be defending themselves, they would be striking the first blow, initiating the first actual military action, and the world would justly view Israel as the aggressor in that instance. That’s how it works, and you know it. Aggression is sometimes justified (e.g., U.S. vs. Taliban Afghanistan), but aggression it remains. ]([http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7536703&postcount=126](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7536703&postcount=126)) So yes, you did indeed state just that. No matter what provocation Syria gives through its proxy, mercenary, or terrorist forces, defense is offense on Israel’s part. Why should we assume that you’ll say any different about Hezbollah and Lebanon, especially when your post relied upon a fallacious dismissal of their state sponsorship? (A claim I see you’ve seen fit to ignore rather than back up.) You deliberately ignored that the relationship between Hamas and Syria was hardly hands off, and you ignored that the ‘military wing’ and ‘political wing’ of Hamas are not as seperate as they pretend. And now, miracle of miracles, Hezbollah attacks Israel and you are baffled, just baffled as to why ever Israel might just have a valid issue with Hezbollah’s state sponsor. Which, of course, you disingenously spin into some absurd talking point about Hezbollah simply sharing geography with Lebanon. :rolleyes: Which gets back to the questions in my post you ignored to order to pretend to be filled with righteous indignation over my correctly quoting your own words back at you. Do you honestly not know about Lebanon’s relationship to Hezbollah, making you wrong but out of ignorance… or are you pretending in order to score rhetorical points? In the teeth of all the facts, will you try to contend that all they share is a coincidence of geography? Honestly? And that, of course, brings us back to the question which you claim I should be ashamed about. As you’ve already stated that no matter what provocation comes down the pipeline, any defensive reaction is always going to be an act of aggression… as you’ve already stated that, how can you possibly argue a position in a debate, as it’ll always be “Sit there and take it.” **Sam Stone** call you out on this, but your only response was an evasion, pointing to a post in which you called for a neverending series of terrorist attacks upon Israel which would go without reprisal, and permanent embargo with the terrorist state next door. Then when he hounded you down and asked what, in specific, Israel would be allowed to do to respond to attacks like it’s already weathering, you evaded any real answer. Waffled about ‘provocation’, when you’d already said that no provocation justifies retaliation, and that even when Hamas takes clear military actions against Israel, it can’t respond. So when you play word games with terms that have actual definitions in order to make your political spiel, when you need to ignore or have not read current events, when you need to stack the deck and declare that any defense is actually aggression… what point is there to a debate? If you need to create an alternate world with a different language in order to make your case, and then say people should be ashamed for pointing it out… isn’t that a suggestion as to the coherence of your views? Or you can just keep telling me I should be ashamed to remember the thread. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2006, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/257 "2006-07-13T04:52:40Z")
I am getting confused here **FinnAgain** , then why Israel is not invading Syria? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2006, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/258 "2006-07-13T08:26:32Z")
I’d wager that it’s for any number of reasons, including not wanting to fight a war on many fronts. What, exactly, confuses you? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2006, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/259 "2006-07-13T10:06:45Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > I’d wager that it’s for any number of reasons, including not wanting to fight a war on many fronts. > > What, exactly, confuses you? If Syria is responsible, attacking Lebanon is similar to the US attacking Iraq when Iran was in reality the bigger issue. Before continuing, I have to say that I am more in favor of Israel and I did not complain until now for what Israel was doing in Gaza, the problem is that IMHO Israel does not know when to stop, I do think **BrainGlutton** ’s example of Pancho Villa is valid, particularly when the President in 2005 pointed at Lebanon (and Palestine, I know, Bush deserves a :rolleyes: ) as countries were democracy was on the march because of the preemptive action in Iraq. What I am getting to here is that Israel is now making a mockery of what Bush said, and while I could point at yet another example of Bush’s incompetency, I’m afraid that in practice what Israel is doing is harming the US right now. (Yeah I know, one could turn this around and say the US action of invading Iraq set the conditions that we are seeing right now in Lebanon and Palestine) Israel is now doing more than burning bridges in Lebanon, Israel could be burning the support of the US if the actions of Israel turn to cause more unrest in Iraq. My position is that if Syria is the party to blame it is the country that needs to be dealt with. And if Iraq was not an issue right now, I would not have minded helping Israel even more. Heck, I do think the issue was just about timing, seems to me a better approach would have been to demand formally to Lebanon and give them an ultimatum to return the soldiers and control the border, it is disturbing IMHO that virtually no time was allowed in this case, and if the time line and facts of this report are correct: > **[The Times & The Sunday Times](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/)** > > News and opinion from The Times & The Sunday Times > [@](#): > > The Lebanese front was reopened in an echo of Gaza’s hostage crisis 160km (100 miles) south, where events began yesterday. At 2.30am Israeli aircraft dropped a 250kg (550lb) bomb on a house in Gaza in an attempt to assassinate Mohammed Deif, the leader of Hamas’s military wing. The raid killed a Hamas activist, Nabil al-Salmiah, his wife and seven of his children, who were aged four to fifteen. > > Mr Deif, for more than a decade Israel’s most wanted man, was seriously injured and underwent four hours of spinal surgery. Palestinians feared that he might be paralysed. > > The Israel Defence Forces (IDF) said that they hit the house after a tip about a meeting of senior Hamas leaders. The assassination attempt drew Hamas threats of revenge and provoked outrage. Akram Shanti, a neighbour, said that he was confronted by the headless body of a small girl when he rushed to help. “I was speechless by what I saw,” Mr Shanti said. “It was utterly shocking. This will not stop the violence, just make people even more angry towards Israel.” > > Within hours the focus shifted to Lebanon where, as in Gaza, Israeli commanders ordered troops back into hostile territory that they had evacuated only recently, to recover abducted colleagues. > > According to the Israeli version, a Hezbollah raiding party had sneaked across the border early in the morning and planted landmines on a road used by Israeli Humvees, killing three of the reconnaissance patrol and capturing two near the border town of Shtula. > > “They placed explosive devices on the road, the Humvees drove on to them and then they fired an anti-tank missile,” an IDF spokeswoman said. > > Simultaneously, Katyusha rockets were fired at Israeli villages and army posts in the area, injuring five civilians in what appears to have been a diversionary ploy. I think Israel is blowing away the chance to get more support when one can see the collateral damage that “justified” the Hezballah raid that then caused Israel to attack Lebanon, I could understand why Hezballah did it, I don’t approve it, and I would not mind killing the Hezbollah attackers, but Israel getting involved once again in Lebanon was IMO what Hezbollah wanted Israel to do. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2006, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434/260 "2006-07-13T10:29:12Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > If Syria is responsible, attacking Lebanon is similar to the US attacking Iraq when Iran was in reality the bigger issue. Syria is primarily responsible for Hamas. Lebanon is primarily responsible for Hezbollah. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > Before continuing, I have to say that I am more in favor of Israel and I did not complain until now for what Israel was doing in Gaza, the problem is that IMHO Israel does not know when to stop, I do think **BrainGlutton** ’s example of Pancho Villa is valid, particularly when the President in 2005 pointed at Lebanon (and Palestine, I know, Bush deserves a :rolleyes: ) as countries were democracy was on the march because of the preemptive action in Iraq. Instead of an analogy, why not deal with the concrete reality of state sponsorship of terror, and its ramifications in terms of casus belli? > [@GIGObuster](#): > > What I am getting to here is that Israel is now making a mockery of what Bush said, and while I could point at yet another example of Bush’s incompetency, I’m afraid that in practice what Israel is doing is harming the US right now. Eeeeeh… I think it’s more like reality is making a mockery of Bush’s soundbytes. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > (Yeah I know, one could turn this around and say the US action of invading Iraq set the conditions that we are seeing right now in Lebanon and Palestine) I don’t agree. We’ve seen similar situations there for quite some time. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > Israel is now doing more than burning bridges in Lebanon, Israel could be burning the support of the US if the actions of Israel turn to cause more unrest in Iraq. I doubt that the US will cease to support Israel but I suppose we’ll see. As we don’t even want to admit that the Iraq war is going poorly, at all, it’ll be hard to start a diplomatic shoving match if we can’t even have a complaint without tarnishing the rosy image of Iraq. 😉 > [@GIGObuster](#): > > My position is that if Syria is the party to blame it is the country that needs to be dealt with. That’s what is being dealt with. Hamas’ stronghold of Gaza is under seige, the Syrians were warned that military action might include them as well, and then the Lebanese backed Hezbollah terrorist organization executed another attack upon Israel. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > And if Iraq was not an issue right now, I would not have minded helping Israel even more. Heck, I do think the issue was just about timing, seems to me a better approach would have been to demand formally to Lebanon and give them an ultimatum to return the soldiers and control the border, it is disturbing IMHO that virtually no time was allowed in this case, and if the time line and facts of this report are correct: Personally, I don’t think that Iraq will become much more of an issue. It’s already in a state of civil war, having Israel do some stuff won’t, IMO, change things all that much. As for demanding anything of Lebanon… eh. State sponsors of terror have, as this thread has shown, more than their fair share of apologists. All Lebanon would have to do is say “Oh… those terrorists? Who we train, lodge, finance, equip, and help direct? Never seen 'em before.” And you know there’d be a thread up on the Dope in record time condemning the acts of ‘aggression’ and ‘civilian targeted violence’ that Israel would take in response. Not to mention the actions over at the UN. I’m also not sure what ammount of time should be taken once one country essentially starts a war with another. Let alone when the third does it. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > I think Israel is blowing away the chance to get more support when one can see the collateral damage that “justified” the Hezballah raid that then caused Israel to attack Lebanon, I could understand why Hezballah did it, I don’t approve it, and I would not mind killing the Hezbollah attackers, but Israel getting involved once again in Lebanon was IMO what Hezbollah wanted Israel to do. Perhaps… but to a degree if that’s what Hezbollah wanted, that’s what Lebanon wanted. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-invades-gaza-strip/362434.md?page=14)