# Israel ! stay the hell away from EU **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 29, 2002, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508 "2002-12-29T15:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/61 "2002-12-29T20:40:00Z")
**Coldfire** , your analyses here are basically accurate and thoughtful. My two cents is also that you should cease referring to “the Jewish lobby” when you mean “the pro-Israel lobby” (which as noted includes many individuals of other religions and even some of no particular religious persuasion at all). I mean, you wouldn’t want to unnecessarily draw attention to that sinister cabal in the U.S. that seeks to manipulate the price of lox, compel makers of canned foods to code their products with secret rabbinical symbols, force NBA teams to draft Jewish players etc. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Naxox\_dec.2002](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/13edae/32.png) [@Naxox\_dec.2002](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Naxox_dec.2002)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/62 "2002-12-29T20:47:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\ ***Suasponte said:** > This sounds like an analysis by someone who doesn’t have a clue about the evangelical Christian movement. > > I grew up in that environment. I sat on my grandfather’s knee while he told me about Israel. I have sat through many sermons about Israel. I have NEVER, EVER heard anyone talk about supporting Israel in terms of the rapture or second coming. There is a subset of people called ‘apocalyptics’ that may put more emphasis on this. You should have seen a documentary on 60 minuttes some months ago. Bush got over a million emails from this group when he told Israel to withdraw from a place they hadde occupied ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/63 "2002-12-29T20:47:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MEBuckner \* > \*\*And I’m afraid I have to disagree with my esteemed colleague from the Netherlands; per the _Britannica_ the Sinai is “Usually regarded as being geographically part of Asia”. Like I said, continental boundaries are pretty arbitrary things. \*\* Hey, don’t sweat it, you’re not disagreeing with me, but with your esteemed Central Intelligence Agency, from whom I got my information that Egypt was in “Northern Africa, bordering the Mediterranean Sea, between ibya and the Gaza Strip”. 🙂 Alrighty, **Naxox** , we’re getting somewhere. You’re mad because Nethaniahu (I’m sure I fucked that up) wants Israel to be part of the EU. OK. First off, Bibi does probably not speak for all Israelis, or even the Israeli government when he says this. Secondly, the EU decides which member states it will allow, and given Israel’s current politic climate, there is no way in HELL they would be admitted. No American pressure (fictional or real) can change that. As far as the European Union not expanding beyond the European continent, well: as stated, continental borders are arbitrary to an extent. Who would have thought, ten years ago, that the Baltic states would become member states? Yet they will join in a few years time. We used to call that part “the East Block”, yet a decade later, we welcome them as brothers. It could be argues that Israel is more European than Middle-Eastern, culturally. At least, when looking at the _Israelite_ population of the country. However, reality is a little more complex than that. Israel will certainly not join the EU in the foreseeable future, and their geographic location is the least important reason why not. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/64 "2002-12-29T20:49:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Naxox\_dec.2002 \* > \*\*as I have known all the time. They are wating for God to do soething, he dosn’t, so they do it them selves. Because they know deep inside that there are no god. > > It’s politic all the way boys > > The question is, what shall we do about such people \*\* Are you framing this as, um, The Jewish Question? ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/65 "2002-12-29T20:50:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jackmannii \* > \*\*My two cents is also that you should cease referring to “the Jewish lobby” when you mean “the pro-Israel lobby” (which as noted includes many individuals of other religions and even some of no particular religious persuasion at all). \*\* Duly noted. That is exactly the sort of term I was looking for. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/66 "2002-12-29T20:52:38Z")
> [@](#): > > Hey, don’t sweat it, you’re not disagreeing with me, but with your esteemed Central Intelligence Agency, from whom I got my information… Do the words “Bay of Pigs” mean anything to you? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/67 "2002-12-29T21:03:31Z")
Yeah. That bay is in Central America, but according to some definitions is part of the USSR as well. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![mogiaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mogiaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mogiaw)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/68 "2002-12-29T21:06:39Z")
I don’t remember it being called the Pedantic European Union. For crikey’s sake if other nations want to get in on it what is the big problem? French Guyana, Martinique, Guadeloupe and La Réunion are all parts of the EU (they are overseas departments of France) and they are nowhere near the geographic parameters of Europe. I know they are not separate nationstates but i believe if we can accommodate them why not other nations that are not blessed with being part of Continental Europe. Mogiaw btw Morocco’s been in the Eurovision before as well. (cite [http://members.fortunecity.com/mcdeil69/xtmor.htm](http://members.fortunecity.com/mcdeil69/xtmor.htm)) ---
**Author:** ![Naxox\_dec.2002](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/13edae/32.png) [@Naxox\_dec.2002](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Naxox_dec.2002)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/69 "2002-12-29T21:06:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by xcheopis \* > \*\*Egypt is, in fact, located on the African continent, all of which is on the African plate. Why would you think otherwise? \*\* again, you are wrong Egypt is situated in Africa. It lies at the junction of Africa and Asia. It is a part of the Great Sahara Desert which occupies nearly half the northern part of Africa. A fraction of Egypt lies in Asia also. ---
**Author:** ![mogiaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mogiaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mogiaw)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/70 "2002-12-29T21:09:46Z")
Naxox, how is xcheopis wrong? You just stated almost the same thing… 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapioca_Dextrin)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/71 "2002-12-29T21:12:10Z")
Geologically, **Coldfire** is right. The major fault boundary sails up the Red Sea, but hangs a right to follow the Gulf of Aden and goes up through the Dead Sea The fault is marked as _ **DSF** _ on [this map](http://monitoring.llnl.gov/regionalization/tect_map.html). Politically and culturally, I’m not touching that one with a ten foot barge pole. ---
**Author:** ![Naxox\_dec.2002](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/13edae/32.png) [@Naxox\_dec.2002](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Naxox_dec.2002)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/72 "2002-12-29T21:16:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by mogiaw \* > \*\*Naxox, how is xcheopis wrong? You just stated almost the same thing… 😕 \*\* i don’t see the point in arguing about this anylonger, but you are wrong ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/73 "2002-12-29T21:19:55Z")
What a waste it is to lose one’s mind. Or not to have a mind is being very wasteful. How true that is. ---
**Author:** ![Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapioca_Dextrin)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/74 "2002-12-29T21:21:47Z")
Oh, I meant Aqaba not Aden :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Naxox\_dec.2002](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/13edae/32.png) [@Naxox\_dec.2002](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Naxox_dec.2002)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/75 "2002-12-29T21:30:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kyla \* > \*\* > > As for being in the EU, I think Israel would love it, but we can see from the problems Turkey is having being admitted that Israel would have a great deal more trouble. Both countries have issues with human rights violations, and Israel has the extra problem of, you know, not being in Europe in the first place. I don’t think their presence in Eurovision would provide much of a basis for anything. \*\* another thing is that the arab and muslim world might see such a membership as if EU are expands it’s border outside Europe in into their territory. I can see that they might fear this and they might see it as a modern crusade. ---
**Author:** ![Blackeyes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f6c823/32.png) [@Blackeyes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackeyes)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/76 "2002-12-29T21:45:42Z")
**Naxox\_dec.2002** , you’re just a brain dead, stupid, uncircumcised schmuck. Now go back to your remedial geography and mp3s you’ve stolen away on your harddrive and shut the hell up. :wally ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/77 "2002-12-29T21:45:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Naxox\_dec.2002 \* > \*\*Heard later that Israel might put some preassure on USA to achieve this. \*\* What on Earth are you talking about? Do you really think that the US can put pressure on the EU to admit a new country? C’mon, kid, you can do better than that. Haj ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/78 "2002-12-29T22:18:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by **Coldfire** \* > Yeah. That bay is in Central America Not according to what I was taught in school. Cuba is part of the Caribbean (West Indies for some) not Central America. Apparently each country has taken it on itself to divide America in a different way. And BTW, are you sure that the **I** in C **I** A stands for “intelligence”. I have my doubts. 😉 I have noticed that while you guys are discussing about geography, geology and whatnot the OP’er is going in a different direction. He seems rather clueless. Are you all talking about the same thing? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/79 "2002-12-29T22:20:50Z")
Hang on, guys. Would someone provide a cite that says Israel wants to join the EU? I can’t imagine that A) Israel would want to, and B) That the EU would even consider it. My understanding is that Israel has been invited to join the "Western Europe and Others Group’ (WEOG) in the United Nations. Technically, Israel is supposed to be part of the ‘Asian Regional Group’, but the Arab nations have blocked Israel from joining - the only country of its stature in the world that doesn’t have UN representation. Israel doesn’t have to be in Europe to join the WEOG. Canada, for example, in in the WEOG. Frankly, I think it’s shameful that a country like Israel, which is a stable Democracy with significant economic and military power, is being isolated from the U.N. while other countries like Libya are not only in the U.N., but sit on prestigious councils like the Human Rights Commission and the Security Council. This of course is because the U.N. is biased against Israel. There is no rational justification for keeping Israel out of the U.N., other than that its racist neighbors are stopping it. Thus, the end-around to the WEOG. But of course, a bunch of countries in the EU are trying to block this as well, because the EU is also biased against Israel. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2002, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508/80 "2002-12-29T22:25:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\*Israel … - the only country of its stature in the world that doesn’t have UN representation. > > …/snip… > > There is no rational justification for keeping Israel out of the U.N., \*\* Israel has been a member of the U.N. [since 1949](http://www.un.org/Overview/unmember.html). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israel-stay-the-hell-away-from-eu/145508.md?page=5)