# Israelis to build Museum of Tolerance on top of Islamic Cemetery **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 15, 2006, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829 "2006-09-15T13:50:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/1 "2006-09-15T13:50:24Z")
No, this is not an article from _The Onion_, nor the latest for the _Daily Show_. > **[News | The Scotsman](https://www.scotsman.com/news)** > > Get all of the latest news from The Scotsman. Providing a fresh perspective for online news. > [@](#): > > Seven months of arbitration between Jewish and Arab groups over the building of a museum promoting religious tolerance on the site of an old Muslim cemetery in Jerusalem have failed, officials said yesterday. > > The Los-Angeles based Simon Wiesenthal Centre, which is funded largely by American Jews, said it would now petition Israel’s Supreme Court to begin construction of the Museum of Tolerance on the site in the centre of Jerusalem. > > Two Arab groups are adamant that the $200 million (£107 million) museum should not be built on the site of the Muslim cemetery. This story is also covered by NPR in an audio report [here.](http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6080560&ft=1&f=1004) Is it surprising that Muslims hate Israel? Is the Weisenthal Center really this clueless, or are they doing it on purpose? ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/2 "2006-09-15T14:07:36Z")
They hated a long time before this. And is this even something for them to get upset about, or is it merely a diversion? The articles says nothing of that. Or when the cemetery was in use. Is it 10 years ago or 600 years ago. Are Muslim cemeteries holy ground in eternity? etc. Btw. what happened to Jewish cemeteries in Gaza? ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/3 "2006-09-15T14:07:49Z")
Piffle. It is _not possible_ to build something in the Old World & _not_ disturb Human remains, especially in such a small area as Israel/Palestine, which has been populated for a very, very long time. This area is the only land route to/from Europe, Africa & the Middle East. As such it has been desirable turf for as long as Human came out of Africa. And it has been steadily populated, often fairly densely, ever since. _No way_ can you dig up your garden in Israel without hitting stuff from at least the Crusader Era. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/4 "2006-09-15T14:13:53Z")
Did you listen to the entire story on NPR or just lift the part that suited your ignorant diatribe. Go back and listen to the entire report. You only have half the story. For others: The cemetery has not been used since 1948. The Project was in public review for years and no one objected and the Weisenthal Center was not told the public lands were an old cemetery. The primary objector is complaining that his great grandfather is buried there but it turns out Great Gramps is buried in an area that will not be disturbed. The Rabbi in charge of the project had offered to pay for all the remains to be carefully moved to an old Muslim cemetery and pay for the beautification of the cemetery. This one group is objecting to any move. This is not a one sided issue. **Fear Itself** , why do you hate Israel? 😉 Jim ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/5 "2006-09-15T14:40:58Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] It is not possible to build something in the Old World & not disturb Human remains, especially in such a small area as Israel/Palestine, which has been populated for a very, very long time. [/QUOTE] We are not talking about ancient, anonymous remains here; this is an organized cemetery used less than 60 years ago. There is a difference. [QUOTE=What Exit?] The cemetery has not been used since 1948. [/QUOTE] So what? Would Jews object if Muslims built on top of a 60 year old Jewish cemetery? > [@](#): > > The Project was in public review for years and no one objected and the Weisenthal Center was not told the public lands were an old cemetery. Well now they know. That they insist on continuing is just, well, intolerant. > [@](#): > > The primary objector is complaining that his great grandfather is buried there but it turns out Great Gramps is buried in an area that will not be disturbed. Not really relevant to the issue of building on a cemetery that is only 60 years old. I find it perfectly reasonable for him to object, on the grounds that is disrespects the whole cemetery. > [@](#): > > The Rabbi in charge of the project had offered to pay for all the remains to be carefully moved to an old Muslim cemetery and pay for the beautification of the cemetery. This one group is objecting to any move. If it were your relatives, would you find the Rabbi’s proposal reasonable? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/6 "2006-09-15T14:45:32Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] If it were your relatives, would you find the Rabbi’s proposal reasonable? [/QUOTE] It depends - are they going to eat the bodies first? I hear Jews do that sort of thing. If not, well, then I think it’s fair request - cemetaries get built over in the U.S., and bodies moved to new cemetaries all the time. The rabbi offering to pay for beautification of the new cemetary is just icing on the cake. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/7 "2006-09-15T14:53:43Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] We are not talking about ancient, anonymous remains here; this is an organized cemetery used less than 60 years ago. There is a difference.So what? Would Jews object if Muslims built on top of a 60 year old Jewish cemetery?Well now they know. That they insist on continuing is just, well, intolerant.Not really relevant to the issue of building on a cemetery that is only 60 years old. I find it perfectly reasonable for him to object, on the grounds that is disrespects the whole cemetery.If it were your relatives, would you find the Rabbi’s proposal reasonable? [/QUOTE] I would not object, but I am not Jewish, Muslim or even religious. Remains are moved all the time for development, how is it you are not aware of this basic fact of life? Why did you construct such a one side Op from a well-balanced story that presented both sides? I understand the objections made by the Muslim group; I did not understand why you chose to pit an entire country for trying to build a Museum of Tolerance.\* Jim - BTW: Didn’t I see this on a South Park Episode? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/8 "2006-09-15T14:56:29Z")
[QUOTE=John Corrado] If not, well, then I think it’s fair request - cemetaries get built over in the U.S., and bodies moved to new cemetaries all the time. [/QUOTE] Yeah, with the permission of the relatives. I would be surprised if you could produce a cite where bodies were disinterred against the wishes of living relatives. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/9 "2006-09-15T15:13:11Z")
[QUOTE=What Exit?] I understand the objections made by the Muslim group; I did not understand why you chose to pit an entire country for trying to build a Museum of Tolerance. [/QUOTE] I don’t object to building a Museum of Tolerance; let them build several, if they wish. Just not on cemeteries, against the wishes of living relatives. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/10 "2006-09-15T15:18:29Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] Yeah, with the permission of the relatives. I would be surprised if you could produce a cite where bodies were disinterred against the wishes of living relatives. [/QUOTE] [The Chicora Foundation](http://www.chicora.org/cemtery_relocation.htm), an archaeological and heritage research society based in South Carolina, pretty strongly imply that if a developer is sufficiently determined, your relatives are getting dug up whether your protest or not. At best, one can insist (though it might require kicking in a few bucks) archaeologists conduct the excavations, they being a little more subtle than a backhoe. The relevant South Carolina laws, 27-43-10 and -20 describe the various hoops a developer must jump through, but objection from the relatives is not sufficient to halt progress. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/11 "2006-09-15T15:33:42Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] I don’t object to building a Museum of Tolerance; let them build several, if they wish. Just not on cemeteries, against the wishes of living relatives. [/QUOTE] So let us see, the construction has been halted when Israeli workers found remains, not when protest where made. Therefore, the Institute has done the right thing. The Institute has been trying to negotiate for months to reach a fair solution but apparently, like opportunistic Muslim groups, you do not believe there is any solution except to not build. The site in question of course has been a parking lot for 30 years already, so it has taken the Muslim group a long time to get upset over this. Can you answer the parking lot part of the equation now also? Do you have a rational reason, or do you really hate Israel and are just looking for an excuse to bash them. Jim ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/12 "2006-09-15T15:40:01Z")
[QUOTE=Bryan Ekers] [The Chicora Foundation](http://www.chicora.org/cemtery_relocation.htm), an archaeological and heritage research society based in South Carolina, pretty strongly imply that if a developer is sufficiently determined, your relatives are getting dug up whether your protest or not. At best, one can insist (though it might require kicking in a few bucks) archaeologists conduct the excavations, they being a little more subtle than a backhoe. The relevant South Carolina laws, 27-43-10 and -20 describe the various hoops a developer must jump through, but objection from the relatives is not sufficient to halt progress. [/QUOTE] I’ve read your cite, and haven’t found an implication as strong as you described. However, your cite of S. Carolina law [turned this up](http://www.chicora.org/sc_cemetery_law.htm#Burial%20and%20Cemetery%20Laws%20in%20O): > [@](#): > > Section 27-43-20. Removal to plot agreeable to governing body **and relatives** ; board may determine suitable plot in case of disagreement. > > The plot to which the graves are removed shall be one which is mutually agreeable between the governing body of the county or municipality **and the relatives of the deceased persons**. If a suitable plot cannot be agreed upon between the parties concerned the matter shall be finally determined by a board of three members which shall be convened within fifteen days after final disagreement on the new location of the plot. The board shall be appointed as follows: One member shall be appointed by the county or municipality, one member shall be appointed by the relatives, and a third member shall be selected by the two. The decision of the board shall be final. Now, that leaves open the _possibility_ that the county representative and the mutually selected representative _could_ overrule the representative of the relatives, but it hardly implies that it happens all the time. I would still like to see a case where it happened at all. ---
**Author:** ![fraglimit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ebca7d/32.png) [@fraglimit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fraglimit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/13 "2006-09-15T15:43:23Z")
I\*\* don’t object to building a Museum of Tolerance; let them build several, if they wish. Just not on cemeteries, against the wishes of living relatives.\*\* Israel wants to do some stuff in their country. Yup its gotta piss someone off. But why the hell do you care ?? [serious question, not a snark]. Muslim rulers in history, have razed quite a few places of worship to the ground, to build mosques, forts etc. Some of them include places of worship important to my … well… religion that i was born into. I dont care about it. Nor do i think its a mortal insult to my religion. I accept it as a fact of life. Might is right sometimes. ---
**Author:** ![fraglimit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ebca7d/32.png) [@fraglimit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fraglimit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/14 "2006-09-15T15:45:36Z")
and oh yes … its funny its called Museum of Tolerance, and its found itself in a diliemma of this sort. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/15 "2006-09-15T15:45:57Z")
Fear Itself, you’re a dick. You heard that story, and your only thought was, “Man those Israelis are assholes”? You didn’t hear the part about how construction has stopped while they try to negotiate a solution? You didn’t hear the part about how they offered to move the graves? You didn’t hear the part about how the site has been a parking lot for 30 years and no one complained? Dick. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/16 "2006-09-15T15:54:12Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] I would still like to see a case where it happened at all. [/QUOTE] [Despite First-Amendment based protest, expansion of Chicago’s O’Hare airport over former churchgrounds and cemetery approved by federal appeals court.](http://news.findlaw.com/andrews/pl/avi/20060815/20060815_bensenville_.html) It may yet go to SCOTUS, I admit, but I’m betting on the airport. ---
**Author:** ![Lama\_Pacos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Lama\_Pacos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lama_Pacos)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/17 "2006-09-15T16:18:52Z")
> [@](#): > > You heard that story, and your only thought was, “Man those Israelis are assholes”? There’s this word I’m looking for that I’m having trouble remembering…hay person? Shit, no. Reed dude? Scarecrow? It’ll come to me eventually. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/18 "2006-09-15T16:26:56Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] It is _not possible_ to build something in the Old World & _not_ disturb Human remains, especially in such a small area as Israel/Palestine, which has been populated for a very, very long time. [/QUOTE] That’s actually pretty cool. If anyone over there’s doing any remodeling or having a pool installed or something, could you mail me a few skulls? What with Halloween coming up and all… ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/19 "2006-09-15T16:40:13Z")
[QUOTE=Lama Pacos] There’s this word I’m looking for that I’m having trouble remembering…hay person? Shit, no. Reed dude? Scarecrow? It’ll come to me eventually. [/QUOTE] I’m sorry, can you please clarify? What is the straw man you are referring to? I cannot determine what you meant. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2006, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829/20 "2006-09-15T17:01:06Z")
[QUOTE=Lama Pacos] There’s this word I’m looking for that I’m having trouble remembering…hay person? Shit, no. Reed dude? Scarecrow? It’ll come to me eventually. [/QUOTE] Dude, did you read the OP? The exact quote that I interpreted as “Israelis are assholes” was this: > [@Fear Itself](#): > > Is it surprising that Muslims hate Israel? Is the Weisenthal Center really this clueless, or are they doing it on purpose? How would you interpret this statement other than that Muslim hate for Israel isn’t surprising given assholish Israeli actions like this…that either the Weisenthal center was so insensitive that they didn’t realize bulldozing a muslim cemetary would be a problem, or they deliberately chose the site of a muslim cemetary to stick it to the Palestinians. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/israelis-to-build-museum-of-tolerance-on-top-of-islamic-cemetery/372829.md?page=2)