# It’s a win for Amazon!
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [April 9, 2021, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684 "2021-04-09T15:34:19Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/21 "2021-04-09T17:13:41Z")
Do they work at that specific warehouse? Because I can’t see any reason to be nervous for their job otherwise. Of course, it also wouldn’t surprise me if Amazon was spread anti-union propaganda to all of their employees.
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### Author:  [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/22 "2021-04-09T17:15:34Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#):
>
> Do they work at that specific warehouse?
Nope. They’re just afraid things will progress and effect them negatively.
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### Author:  [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/23 "2021-04-09T17:29:32Z")
> [@DeadTreasSecretaries](#):
>
> I do wonder if Sanders visiting the site may have been a negative. Unions always straddle between beibg political and having a more narrow focus but i wonder if Sanders may have made it feel too political/national.
Consider that if we’re talking about Alabama, most of the workers there are probably going to be politically conservative anyway. Workers there have long embraced a “Life is hard, suck it up” mentality. I don’t know whether Sanders’ visit was the death knell but it probably didn’t help.
Still, it was worth the effort. If nothing else, it puts some heat on Amazon and their labor practices. Sometimes, just making noise about an issue helps, as evidenced by the fact that the fight for $15 likely at least had some influence on Amazon and Walmart’s recent pay increases. They probably also did so to take some of the steam out of progressives’ attempts to raise the minimum wage. Regardless, pressure works, even if the union vote falls short.
What unionization would do better is to protect the jobs of those who make the most noise. As it is now, it’s easier for companies like Amazon to wear down those who speak out
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### Author:  [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/24 "2021-04-09T17:30:40Z")
I’m not anti-Amazon. I’m anti bad working conditions. What I want is for Amazon to have to shape up.
I also note that, even having grown up in a red state in the 1990s, and being culturally Republican, it was still pretty taboo to scab when the manufacturing place went on strike. Unions aren’t a progressive thing. They’re a “power to the people” thing.
It really sucks that what now passes as the left in the US is so anti-union, when even people on the right used to be okay with them. It’s just so obviously working against your own self interest. Sure, give the millionaires and billionaires all the power. That’s always worked out well!
I think what I’ve said makes sense, though I did just get my first COVID-19 shot, and I’m getting tired. I apologize, but I’m not going to proofread or edit my post this time.
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### Author:  [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/25 "2021-04-09T17:32:28Z")
The union that lost the Amazon vote in Alabama has a questionable history when it comes to job promotion. The RWDSU was part of the coalition whose opposition led Amazon to abandon a plan for a corporate headquarters in Queens that forecast 25,000 jobs (and was supported by construction and property service unions).
> [@Tamerlane](#):
>
> Conservatives really need to drop the ‘unions are evil’ furor. Because it’s nonsense.
And counter-productive. At least, you’d think that having a strong middle class partly supported by well-paid union jobs would buy more stuff, boosting the economy and corporate profits, something conservatives should logically applaud.
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### Author:  [@BrickBat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrickBat)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/26 "2021-04-09T17:48:59Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#):
>
> And counter-productive. At least, you’d think that having a strong middle class partly supported by well-paid union jobs would buy more stuff, boosting the economy and corporate profits, something conservatives should logically applaud.
Oh I agree, but you see that demand-side economic model is a complete anathema to the GOP who worship supply-side economics with a religious like fervor. Plus, it would empower a class of people they are currently hellbent on marginalizing. Well compensated and secure employees have too much time and resources to counter the race-to-the bottom economic model, and is generally not the most fertile ground for the makings of a fearful and desperate class of people that are happy with the crumbs of just surviving.
I’ll be charitable, but from the times I’ve read the OP posters opinion on the public policy, said poster comes across to me as a sneering uber centrist of the typical “economically conservative but socially liberal” vein, albeit very conservative, but then steps it up further to include an apparent visceral dislike of the working class ( no doubt based on what he believes their views on social issues are as a bloc ) and a proud member of the meritocratic “left”, such as there is one. It seemed purpose-designed to tweak or taunt.
Turning it around hypothetically, it would be as if someone came and made a flamebaiting post about espousing an aggressive “new deal” economic policy, replete with progressive economic policy, yet espousing the the most regressive social issue policies possible.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/27 "2021-04-09T17:51:34Z")
> [@jsc1953](#):
>
> The phrase is “death knell”.
I was wondering what he meant, thanks.
Dalej42, do you by any chance work in management?
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### Author:  [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/28 "2021-04-09T18:50:35Z")
> [@BigT](#):
>
> It really sucks that what now passes as the left in the US is so anti-union,
Did you read the same OP I did? I thought it was “the left” that considers Amazon to be evil and was hoping for the union vote to succeed.
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### Author:  [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/29 "2021-04-09T22:10:16Z")
NM. Got ninja’d.
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### Author:  [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/30 "2021-04-09T22:10:41Z")
> [@jsc1953](#):
>
> > [@dalej42](#):
> >
> > organizing drive was a death nail
>
> The phrase is “death knell”.
I thought he was perhaps making a portmanteau of “death knell” and “nail in the coffin.”
On the topic of the thread, I too have mixed feelings about unions, having worked as both union and management in one company, and as an employee in a non-union company that had gone through a bitter union-busting strike well before I got there. Unions are not always necessary, but they often do good work.
But in this case, the power differential is just too large in favor of management. Amazon is making huge amounts of money on the backs of low wage jobs and automation. I can’t celebrate the defeat of a union in this case, and I have little doubt that Amazon would not have hesitated to use fear and intimidation tactics on their employees to ensure this outcome. With a lawsuit, nothing will change for the workers at least until it is over, but it will presumably bring out the facts.
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### Author:  [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)
#### Post date: [April 9, 2021, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/31 "2021-04-09T23:46:10Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#):
>
> I can’t celebrate the defeat of a union in this case, and I have little doubt that Amazon would not have hesitated to use fear and intimidation tactics on their employees to ensure this outcome. With a lawsuit, nothing will change for the workers at least until it is over, but it will presumably bring out the facts.
👍🏻 👍🏻
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### Author:  [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/32 "2021-04-10T00:40:14Z")
From the NPR reporting I heard ahead of the vote quite a few workers thought conditions were just fine and for good pay and didn’t see the sense of paying union dues for what they thought was little value to be added.
The things some complained about greatly others thought were no issue.
It sure seems like more thought the latter.
That report also had one analyst who stated that big actions like this usually fail in the South and they expected this one to fail but that smaller union actions are still doing well there.
It also seems that bringing in outside big guns minimally does not help
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### Author:  [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/33 "2021-04-10T01:36:18Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#):
>
> I too have mixed feelings about unions…
Lord help me. Even though I’ve read the entire thread, when I got to this line I first parsed it as _mixed feelings about unicorns._
mmm
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### Author:  [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/34 "2021-04-10T02:33:42Z")
Your friends sound like exactly the kind of workers that Amazon is looking for.
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### Author:  [@omenran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/omenran)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/35 "2021-04-10T02:38:01Z")
I have a friend who worked at a warehouse who has gotten injured while working and has been dealing with getting treatment and rehab. They also had Covid while at this job.
I haven’t been a fan of Amazon for a while now, but I haven’t encouraged or discouraged my friend either way about working there. They were unemployed as the pandemic started and it was one of the few places still hiring.
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### Author:  [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/36 "2021-04-10T03:13:28Z")
It would be great if unions could pick and choose their fights better. I’ve worked in union shops and speak from experience.
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### Author:  [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/37 "2021-04-10T10:25:37Z")
> [@dalej42](#):
>
> The workers made their own decision, they’re already making excellent money for low skilled labor.
Who are you to judge the difficulty of the labor and what the proper wage is for work that you don’t do, for a company you don’t work for? Why is it your business and why are you so interested?
> [@](#):
>
> And, I doubt they appreciated being political pawns of Brooklyn progressives who have an unhealthy hatred of Bezos
Did you talk to someone to arrive at this conclusion, or are you imagining Amazon workers to be your own foot-soldiers in owning the libs?
This really seems to be about you gloating over lib’rul tears and toadying up to shareholders (for whatever reason).
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### Author:  [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/38 "2021-04-10T11:58:58Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#):
>
> Your friends sound like exactly the kind of workers that Amazon is looking for
Old dudes who otherwise can’t find work and look at their strenuous, demanding job as a challenge and a way to keep in shape. Oh, and they both don’t “have to” work.
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### Author:  [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/39 "2021-04-10T14:18:07Z")
From my point of view inside a progressive bubble, and not following the story in any depth: it felt like the downtrodden workers, forced into 19th century sweat-shop conditions, were finally about to rise up against their union-busting overseers. So I expected the union to win in a landslide.
The fact that it didn’t happen may mean that there is more to the story than I thought.
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### Author:  [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2021, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-a-win-for-amazon/939684/40 "2021-04-10T14:47:32Z")
More details only confirm that they seem to be exactly the kind of employees that Amazon is looking for.
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