# It’s Irish not Oirish you stereo-typing bastards. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 19, 2000, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897 "2000-06-19T20:34:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SwimmingRiddles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SwimmingRiddles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SwimmingRiddles)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2000, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/21 "2000-06-20T15:01:26Z")
While I don’t watch Voyager, I can honestly say that as an American of Irish decent (really, I’m not a Paddy-wanna-be) the Irish Spring Soap commercials were simply amazing. Villagers with accents straight out of Lucky Charms forming a BUCKET Brigade to get water from the local spring, while tossing thier red, curley hair and dancing about in their tweed ankle-length skirts. And FWIW, my improv group watched The Snapper when we had some down time and were stuck in the middle of no where. Now, every once and a while, we will scream “I’ll batter you!” at each other during a show, which has lead to the comment cards reading “What’s with the random Irish characters?” Wasn’t there another movie in that trilogy? (Snapper, Commitments and something else?) ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2000, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/22 "2000-06-20T16:04:10Z")
the Van. not as good as the other 2. my favourite being the Snapper. Colm Gleeson is brilliant in it. As for Gays and Lesbian characters improving, the thing is, Irish characters havent. We’re still Dancing at Crossroads and getting drunk!!! (we’re only like that at the weekends… ) ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2000, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/23 "2000-06-20T17:01:04Z")
JohnLarrigan said : > [@](#): > > Flatley, you are to blame I’m with Denis Leary on this one . Nail the prick up . SwimmingRiddles did I read in another post somewhere that your from Burlington, Vermont ? I was there about 3years ago with about 100 other Irish guys/gals , had an absolute ball . The only thing pit-worthy I could say about it is that it was too fucking hot . 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Crusoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/49beb7/32.png) [@Crusoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crusoe)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2000, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/24 "2000-06-20T17:35:07Z")
JohnLarrigan, I’m thinking you mean Colm Meaney. ---
**Author:** ![Lor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ea666f/32.png) [@Lor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lor)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/25 "2000-06-21T00:55:39Z")
You should check out the movie “Do The Right Thing”. Interesting study of how other ethnic groups stereotype each other, not just the Irish. Unfortunately, books like “Angela’s Ashes” do tend to reinforce Irish stereotypes. By the way, I was curious…what do you think of Irish-Americans like Conan O’Brien and Denis Leary? Are they doing their part to dispel the stereotypes, or are they considered to be just a couple of Americans, not Irish? ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/26 "2000-06-21T01:45:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > mattk: It’s the O’Bollocks-style chain pubs that infest both of these places that are as much to blame as anything else for the “Oirish” stereotypes. > \*\* Just a small aside that I couldn’t resist. There’s an Irish-style pub near where I work called _The Dog’s Bollix_ after the resident band. Damn good band too… ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/27 "2000-06-21T01:55:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > > SwimmingRiddles did I read in another post somewhere that your from Burlington, Vermont ? > I was there about 3years ago with about 100 other Irish guys/gals , had an absolute ball . The only thing pit-worthy > I could say about it is that it was too fucking hot . 🙂 > > \*\* _Vermont_ was too hot? Lawsamussy, yojimbo, never try Alabama in the summer–or Chicago in the winter _or_ summer! You must be spoiled by that mild Irish climate. –\>assume a winking smilie here\<– Oh, I dunno; sterotypes are such useful substitutes for reality or thought. Must be, because so many people use them. One tiny sidenote: if Irish-Americans are off base, it doesn’t mean they aren’t sincere. Hey, I suffered through Oktoberfest celebrations with the German side of my family. The contents of the pot haven’t so much melted as melded into a fantastic gumbo. _None_ of the original flavors remain unaffected. Even very traditonal backgrounds such as Japanese make distinctions for the generations away from the homeland. They carry quite genuine familial and cultural loyalties, but time and distance take a toll. Irish emigrated in such incredible numbers that in a way it’s not suprising that the influence is so widespread, no matter how distorted. (Old joke from the _other_ side of the family: “Have you ever known anyone who _didn’t_ claim to be part Irish?” “Fella in Bangkok; didn’t want to brag.”) This isn’t excusing the cinematic idiocies, mind. Veb ---
**Author:** ![neuro-trash\_grrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/3ab097/32.png) [@neuro-trash\_grrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neuro-trash_grrrl)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/28 "2000-06-21T01:56:36Z")
I understand and sympathize with your complaints, yojimbo, but you’re complaining about Voyager not getting Ireland right? Voyager can’t even get _Star Trek_ right, f’Chrissakes! Signed, your English-Irish-Scottish-Welsh-German-French-Dutch-Native American friend, neuro-trash grrrl ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/29 "2000-06-21T03:12:06Z")
**yojimbo** wrote: > [@](#): > > The latest episode of “Voyager” is the straw that broke this camels back. It’s called “Fair Haven” and is set in a rural Irish village (holodeck programme ) . > > As per usual with these things it’s full of twee Irish bullshit . Full of boyo’s that are hard drinking / fighting men who have a roguish glint in their eye . A priest ( off-course ) who dishes out hail mary’s like there’s no tomorrow. There’s also a Barry Fitzgerald look alike who like’s to wet his whistle and charm the women . The actors off-course have an Irish accent that is as good as Dick van Dikes’s cockney in “Mary Poppins” . _Star Trek_ is about racial stereotypes, and it always has been. Race determines personality in the Star Trek universe, to the point where being a half-breed like Spock is as much a psychic conflict as a cultural one. If you’ve been watching the show you should know this. An Irisman could no more escape the blarney in Star Trek than Spock could shed his human emotions – and you know he’s tried. **Alphagene** wrote: > [@](#): > > Being Irish-Italian-American makes it hard for me to watch the movie The Untouchables. It’s all ruthless Italian gangsters and corrupt Irish cops. Yeah, way different than how it actually happened. > [@](#): > > Plus it’s irritating that the only Irish good guy is played by someone who isn’t actually Irish and the only Italian good guy is played by someone who isn’t actually Italian. Christopher Lambert was both _The Highlander_ and _The Sicilian_. Sometimes I can’t quite get over that. **mattk** wrote: > [@](#): > > It’s the O’Bollocks-style chain pubs that infest both of these places that are as much to blame as anything else for the “Oirish” stereotypes. I’m fed up with fucking pubs that think “authentic Irish” is warm Guinness and a “diddly-diddly” band - I’ve seen 'em in Edinburgh, Reading, London, Sydney, Melbourne, Darwin, Amsterdam - if anything perpetuates a stereotype, it’s the appropriation by a blinkered marketing department. We’ve got something of a cottage industry here in America, sucking money away from people who claim even a trace of Irish or Scottish ancestry. I call it _Celtsploitation_. At the bookstore the other day, I saw a leather CD case with knotwork on it. If only they could have somehow incorporated a dreamcatcher into it, it would have sold like hotcakes. ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/30 "2000-06-21T06:15:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > what do you think of Irish-Americans like Conan O’Brien and Denis Leary? Are they doing their part to dispel the stereotypes, or are they considered to be just a couple of Americans, not Irish? > \*\* The Irish have a curious phenomenon of claiming those Irish-Americans who they feel have really accomplished something (e.g. the Kennedys) as being Irish while disclaiming those who haven’t as being “just Americans”. yojimbo, you think Voyager was bad? There was an episode of Walker, Texas Ranger last year in which the bad guys were, you guessed it, IRA men. I don’t suppose I need to go into any further detail about it … ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/31 "2000-06-21T09:42:31Z")
ahhh… Dennis Leary… a DAMN funny guy. Listen to his Lock and Load album about Lord of the Dance… There is a certain breed of Irish-American who dosent try to use his Ancestry as an excuse for his shortcomings. Conan and Denis are in this. however, I get annoyed by people who do. Case in point, the Kennedys. Several of them tried to blame their Alcoholism, Drug problems, Gambling addiction on the fact they were “Irish”. “Oirish” is never really perptrated IRL but almost exclusively through the Media. ---
**Author:** ![Doobieous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/da6949/32.png) [@Doobieous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doobieous)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/32 "2000-06-21T11:01:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Bottom line? All gay men were sexless, limp-wristed charicatures, and all lesbians were man-hating psychotic murderers. Top _that_! 😛 (Thankfully, things have obviously changed, albeit slowly.) Oh yes, that stereotype. I’m glad things are slowly changing. I remember seeing a snippet from an old film from the 50’s that showed gay men as pedophiles! > [@](#): > > But, yes, your summation has been fairly accurate, and I hope things change for the better (but, with Hollywood, I wouldn’t hold my breath). I’m glad Asians are getting roles such Garett Wang, and Von Flores have gotten. I’d really like to see more Asians in roles that are not about their ethnicity, but about them (i’m not sure how well the Charlie’s Angels Movie will turn out, but it’s nice Lucy Liu (I hope I got her name correct) was cast as one of the angels). LOL, my parents and I always go “My god! An Asian on TV?!” whenever we see Asians in commercials or TV shows. And yes, I can tell you’re a geeky Rice Queen lol. > [@](#): > > Um, I _really_ need to see a picture of you now. Well, when Dem gets the pics of the SF bash up, you’ll get to see me in a more updated pic (I’ve changed my hairstyle since the Monterey bash. The Monterey ones are up, just follow the links from his homepage). I’m surprised you haven’t seen it already. Anyway, i’m one of those half breeds that looks like a different ethnicity than I am (but, i’ve gotten a good response from it…) > [@](#): > > Yes, I know - I’m moving to Mira Mesa in San Diego in the fall. Whoopee! 😉 Wow, well i’m sure you’ll have a GREAT time here in California :). Lots of Filipinos in San Diego (and of course other Asian groups). I just hope for your sake your head doesnt explode ;). ---
**Author:** ![SwimmingRiddles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SwimmingRiddles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SwimmingRiddles)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2000, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/33 "2000-06-21T13:04:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > SwimmingRiddles did I read in another post somewhere that your from Burlington, Vermont ? > I was there about 3years ago with about 100 other Irish guys/gals , had an absolute ball . The only thing pit-worthy > I could say about it is that it was too fucking hot . 🙂 > \*\* Yes, indeedy. In fact, I seem to remember you are an IBMer, correct? If that is the case, you know people I work with, as I am a contracted worker for IBM. Education dept. If this is the case, you guys are remembered quite fondly around my department. They opened an Irish pub here, which plays a lot of the Corrs, and serves a lot of Guinness. Ri Ras. Give me a break. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2000, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/34 "2000-06-22T16:26:05Z")
Doobieous said: “I remember seeing a snippet from an old film from the 50’s that showed gay men as pedophiles!” That assumption is still made. ---
**Author:** ![jayron\_32](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/41988e/32.png) [@jayron\_32](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayron_32)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2000, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/35 "2000-06-22T18:13:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Christopher Lambert was both The Highlander and The Sicilian. Even more amusing when you consider that he’s French. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2000, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/36 "2000-06-22T18:54:45Z")
Sean Connery : Egyptian with a Spanish name --Highlander Russian – The hunt for Red October Irish – The Untouchables And many more , all with a Scot accent. And as to Doobieous & dropzone’s point about gay men as pedophiles , it really pisses me off when people say that homosexuals shouldn’t be teachers . A pedophile is a pedophile. Pedophiles shouldn’t be teachers. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2000, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/37 "2000-06-22T21:35:05Z")
No, they should be priests! 😉 Just finished an interview with an Irish fellow whose wife is being transfered back to Dublin. Ya’ll got an unemployment rate of **under five percent?!?!?** Not just under fifty percent, nor forty, nor thirty, but FIVE! Ireland, apparently, rocks. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2000, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897/38 "2000-06-22T22:09:41Z")
[QUOTE] No, they should be priests! 😉 [QUOTE] We had/have a lot of them bastards . That’s a shameful fact about Ireland . The Catholic Church was almost all powerful in Ireland until relatively recently . They did a lot of good obviously but also caused a huge amount of pain and hurt to my people. It has led to a lot of people turning away from the church/religion in general. Not a bad thing IMO. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-s-irish-not-oirish-you-stereo-typing-bastards/22897.md?page=1)