# It takes 67 senate votes to impeach. Please don't waste our time. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 23, 2018, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298 "2018-01-23T15:24:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/41 "2018-01-23T19:43:58Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > You make it sound like we’d take spiteful joy in Trump’s downfall,. Gee, how would I ever think a crazy thing like that? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/42 "2018-01-23T19:49:36Z")
By projection. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/43 "2018-01-23T19:59:57Z")
I can’t see how I could be projecting that. I’ve just noticed you seem to often take spiteful joy in Republican missteps. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/44 "2018-01-23T20:01:38Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > That all sounds fine to me, except for the last bit – there are some circumstances in which an attempted impeachment that wasn’t certain to succeed would still be politically a good idea. Not all, but some, depending on the extent and clarity of the evidence of wrongdoing. Maybe it would be “politically” a good idea, but there is an opportunity cost to everything. I want things that are pragmatically a good idea. For instance- 64,000 Americans died of opiod overdoses last year. That is more than 20 9/11s worth of casualties! How about addressing that, save some actual lives and future potential of the nation instead of charging at the windmill that is impeachment? Yes, if it is a slam-dunk that it is not a windmill, go for it. But it is hard for me to imagine finding the votes. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/45 "2018-01-23T20:04:32Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Yes, if it is a slam-dunk that it is not a windmill, go for it. But it is hard for me to imagine finding the votes. Trump is despised by most members of House and Senate. If they had a reasonable hope that Trump’s base wouldn’t hang them for it, they’d push him out of office in a heartbeat. Everyone’s rooting for Mueller right now. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/46 "2018-01-23T20:09:26Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > But it is hard for me to imagine finding the votes. It took steady erosion over many months of hearings to get the public to agree Nixon had to be impeached. The votes weren’t there at the beginning of that one, either. Give Fox something they can’t avoid covering, and even their base can’t avoid seeing it. **CarnalK** , you’re just verifying it. ---
**Author:** ![Kevbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e47774/32.png) [@Kevbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kevbo)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/47 "2018-01-23T20:11:42Z")
Pence would likely do as much or more harm that Trump is doing, albeit he may be less likely to bumble his way into setting off a nuclear war. A real gain would be forcing Republican senators to defend treasonous Trump, and losing everyone but hard core conservatives, or vote to remove him from office, thus losing the hard core conservatives they can’t be elected without. Impeachment would put them between a rock and a hard place. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/48 "2018-01-23T20:33:11Z")
> [@Kevbo](#): > > Pence would likely do as much or more harm that Trump is doing, albeit he may be less likely to bumble his way into setting off a nuclear war. > > A real gain would be forcing Republican senators to defend treasonous Trump, and losing everyone but hard core conservatives, or vote to remove him from office, thus losing the hard core conservatives they can’t be elected without. Impeachment would put them between a rock and a hard place. You will never get a charge of treason, so you can forget about that. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/49 "2018-01-23T20:34:27Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > If they do pursue impeachment, I foresee endless garment rending and teeth gnashing, months of arguing and bullshit, all ending in _no results_. First of all, it takes only a majority of the House of Representatives to “impeach.” It takes 67 Senators to “convict and remove.” Remember, Bill Clinton was “impeached” successfully. If, somehow, the Democrats can get 51 Senators, they may consider it early in 2019, so they can claim, “A majority of Senators voted to remove him! #NotOurPresident!” However, what would be much more likely would be a symbolic gesture in November, 2020 if he loses the election. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/50 "2018-01-23T20:43:04Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You will never get a charge of treason, so you can forget about that. John Mace, the crusher of dreams. ---
**Author:** ![Ashtura](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ashtura/32/2963_2.png) [@Ashtura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashtura)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/51 "2018-01-23T20:59:55Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > A failed impeachment would be an absolute blessing for the country. He’d have less time to hurt the USA if he was busy dodging press impeachment inquiries. In fact, anything that keeps him from his duties is a blessing for the country. Pfft. The dude spends a lot of time tweeting, watching TV, golfing, and doing campaign rallies. One more useless endeavor isn’t going to stop him from “damaging” anything. He’s little more than a figurehead. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/52 "2018-01-23T21:12:18Z")
> [@That\_Don\_Guy](#): > > First of all, it takes only a majority of the House of Representatives to “impeach.” It takes 67 Senators to “convict and remove.” Remember, Bill Clinton was “impeached” successfully. Thank you. Obviously “convict and remove” is what I mean, but I am not phrasing it correctly. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/53 "2018-01-23T22:28:52Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You will never get a charge of treason, so you can forget about that. Not unless Mueller finds a true ‘smoking gun,’ which does seem unlikely. Then again, with Trump’s big mouth, who knows? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/54 "2018-01-23T22:32:13Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You will never get a charge of treason, so you can forget about that. I agree, it is probably not technically treason. But what you you call a deal to help with the election in exchange for relaxing sanctions and letting Russia have its way with its neighbors? If that is proven, it’s the biggest political scandal in US History. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/55 "2018-01-23T22:37:29Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > … But what you you call a deal to help with the election in exchange for relaxing sanctions and letting Russia have its way with its neighbors? … A myth? Fiction? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/56 "2018-01-23T22:40:05Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > A myth? Fiction? Let’s hope. But I wouldn’t put it past him. ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/57 "2018-01-23T22:42:36Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Well, OK, but what if we also get some sort of smoking gun on Pence! Then we could kick both of them out, and end up with President Pelosi! Right? Except you still need the Republican votes in the Senate, and that’s just not going to happen. You might be able to convince a few of them to replace one Republican with another, but there’s no way in Hell (nor in the District of Columbia, which amounts to about the same thing) that you’ll get enough of them to vote to replace a Republican with Pelosi, no matter how damning the evidence might be. I agree that if the Dems reclaim the HoR in January it’s likely that Pelosi will be elected Speaker. But I think it’s important to remember that it’s not a guarantee. If the Speaker role goes to someone more palatable to the Pubs than Pelosi, that changes the dynamics quite a lot. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/58 "2018-01-23T22:48:06Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Let’s hope. But I wouldn’t put it past him. That’s fine, as long as we agree that the evidence available to date doesn’t support that theory. ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/59 "2018-01-23T22:58:48Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Although there is no precident, I think the House and Senate would both have to have separeate proceedings for each prospective candidate for impeachment. The clever move might be to impeach Pence first, then Trump before he has a chance to nominate someone else for the Vice President, and if it doesn’t happen until after 20 Jan 2019, Paul Ryan has a shot at having the longest presidency of anyone since FDR. _In the fantasy world where impeachment happens._ I’m not following you here. Are you saying that the GOP holds the HoR in the next general election? Cause otherwise, wouldn’t Ryan no longer be Speaker after 20 Jan 2019? Or does the Speaker from the now-minority-party remain Speaker until the now-majority-party elects a replacement? IIRC, if Pence leaves office for any reason (and Trump is still POTUS) then Trump nominates a new VP who must be approved by a majority of both the House and the Senate. If this happens after Jan 20 2019, who do you think Trump might nominate that would get approved? (Frankly, I have no idea. If McCain were still healthy, I’d say he’d have a chance. Otherwise I do not have a clue.) So suppose Pence is out and the approval process for VP takes forever. Now if Trump is impeached and convicted, the presidency would go to the Speaker of the House, right? If that speaker is Pelosi and it looks like impeachment and conviction are imminent, I think that the GOP congress critters may well be pretty flexible on who would replace Pence. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298/60 "2018-01-23T23:23:16Z")
I’m am not as sanguine as some about the potential for Democrats to regain control of the House in the 2018 general election, but if it occurs it pretty much guarantees that a Republican-led Senate will aboslutely not vote for removal of both Trump and Pence even if a case could be made for the latter. And the odds of the Senate being dominated by Democrats in that election are [slim at best even if you assume they hold onto all existing seats](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/are-democrats-senate-chances-overrated/). The notion of the GOP giving into an impeachment process that ends with Pelosi (or some other Democrat; Pelosi is the likely favorate for a Democratic House Speaker but not a certain lock) in the White House is about as fanciful as white rabbits in waistcoats worrying about the time. Unless, of course, you are operating under the assumption that the Republicans in Congress are suddenly going to take notice and do “the right thing” when the Mueller investigation reveals collusion with foreign agents even if it means their undoing, in which case even Charles Dodgson doesn’t have that much imagination. This could all change if increasing negative public opinion befalls the Republican candidates as a whole in the next ten months, but Trump has already done pretty much all the damage he can do to the GOP and they’re still looking favored to control the Senate come 2019. So as it stands, impeachment and removal looks like a non-starter. Stranger [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/it-takes-67-senate-votes-to-impeach-please-dont-waste-our-time/807298.md?page=4)