# Italian pronunciation **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 5, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736 "2009-10-05T22:11:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![drhess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/94ad74/32.png) [@drhess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drhess)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/1 "2009-10-05T22:11:59Z")
How is the Italian last name Majone pronounced? ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/2 "2009-10-05T22:18:19Z")
Ma-yo’-neh. ---
**Author:** ![drhess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/94ad74/32.png) [@drhess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drhess)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2009, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/3 "2009-10-05T22:31:47Z")
> [@Svejk\_1](#): > > Ma-yo’-neh. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/4 "2009-10-06T00:43:31Z")
It’s an odd last name for an Italian, since there is no “j” in the Italian language. I’m guessing its origin is foreign or maybe a dialect. But yes, in Italian, when there is a j, it is pronounced with a y sound, like the soccer club Juventus (from the Latin), which is pronounced Yuventus. ---
**Author:** ![drhess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/94ad74/32.png) [@drhess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drhess)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/5 "2009-10-06T01:39:12Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > It’s an odd last name for an Italian, since there is no “j” in the Italian language. I’m guessing its origin is foreign or maybe a dialect. But yes, in Italian, when there is a j, it is pronounced with a y sound, like the soccer club Juventus (from the Latin), which is pronounced Yuventus. Thanks. That explains why I couldn’t find a J in the pronunciation guides! So the first syllable is Mah, not may? ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/6 "2009-10-06T01:49:29Z")
> [@drhess](#): > > So the first syllable is Mah, not may? Correct. The ‘-ay’ sound is normally signfied in Italian with the letter ‘e’. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/7 "2009-10-06T02:29:59Z")
How do they pronounce X? I know it only appears in a few words of foreign derivation, but none of the pronunciation guides I have explain it, and there are a few words: _xilofono_, _xilano_, _xenofobia_, etc. I’d guess /ks/, but they appear to have variants in s- which suggests it might be /s/ or /z/. ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/8 "2009-10-06T05:15:24Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > How do they pronounce X? I know it only appears in a few words of foreign derivation, but none of the pronunciation guides I have explain it, and there are a few words: _xilofono_, _xilano_, _xenofobia_, etc. I’d guess /ks/, but they appear to have variants in s- which suggests it might be /s/ or /z/. Your examples xylophone and xenophobia are derived from the Greek, so they would be pronounced with a /z/ sound, like in English. With other foreign words with an X in the middle of the word, I would think it would more often be /ks/, mirroring how they sound in the foreign language. I love the Italian alphabet because it only has 21 letters. They’ve weeded out a lot of the chaff. Plus, it’s nice to cut directly from V to Z. ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/9 "2009-10-06T12:59:26Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > How do they pronounce X? I know it only appears in a few words of foreign derivation, but none of the pronunciation guides I have explain it, and there are a few words: _xilofono_, _xilano_, _xenofobia_, etc. I’d guess /ks/, but they appear to have variants in s- which suggests it might be /s/ or /z/. Be careful though. I believe an initial ‘x’ in Catalan/Menorquin is pronounced like an English ‘ch’; the same pronounciation could apply to other Mediterranean dialects. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/10 "2009-10-06T15:07:05Z")
A Catalan initial X is a Sh… it’s pronounced like Xabier and xylophone. Out of curiosity, when you say an English ‘ch’, do you mean as in chocolate? I ask because I’m pretty tired of having to correct people who try to pronounce the ch in my lastname as a k (no, it’s ch as in chocolate…) ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/11 "2009-10-06T16:57:51Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Your examples xylophone and xenophobia are derived from the Greek, so they would be pronounced with a /z/ sound, like in English. How does this follow? Both Ancient and Modern Greek pronounce Ξξ (xi) as /ks/. Not saying you’re wrong, just not sure about the logic. Wikipedia says X is pronounced /z/ in the Venetian dialect, for what it’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/12 "2009-10-06T18:17:12Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > How does this follow? Both Ancient and Modern Greek pronounce Ξξ (xi) as /ks/. Not saying you’re wrong, just not sure about the logic. Wikipedia says X is pronounced /z/ in the Venetian dialect, for what it’s worth. Hmm, well I’m way out of my depth here, so my conjectures are not worth much for GQ purposes. I would guess that both English and Italian have transmuted the initial /ks/ sound to a /z/ since a /ks/ sound at the beginning of a word is not common in either language. Don’t we have any Italian Dopers? Che cazzo fanno, italiani? ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/13 "2009-10-06T20:00:41Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Hmm, well I’m way out of my depth here, so my conjectures are not worth much for GQ purposes. I would guess that both English and Italian have transmuted the initial /ks/ sound to a /z/ since a /ks/ sound at the beginning of a word is not common in either language. Your logic seems to be that because English reduces /ks/ to /z/, Italian must also do so. This does not follow, obviously. Italian has reduced -x- to -ss- in spelling (Maximus \> Massimo), so maybe that gives a hint as to how to pronounce an x when it _is_ spelled, but then again, maybe it doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/14 "2009-10-06T21:38:54Z")
> [@Svejk\_1](#): > > Your logic seems to be that because English reduces /ks/ to /z/, Italian must also do so. This does not follow, obviously. But it is true that many consonant clusters in Latin have been simplified generally in Italian, whether or not it was “because” they didn’t occur at the beginnings of words. So in addition to /ks/-\>/s/ you have /ct/ -\> /t/, /pt/-\>/t/, /ns/-\>/t/, probably along with others I don’t remember right now. I think most Romance languages went through a similar process. On the other hand, medieval Spanish scholars deliberately [reclaimed some of the consonant clusters](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Spanish_language#Learned_words_and_consonant_cluster_simplification) that had been lost, resulting in a bifurcation between popular and educated speech, or sometimes standard-language word having variants for different senses or constructions. From the same link, > [@Wikipedia](#): > > Occasionally, both forms exist in Modern Spanish with different nuances of meaning or in idiomatic usage. afición is a ‘fondness of’ or ‘taste for’ while afección is ‘illness.’ Modern Spanish respeto is ‘respect’ while con respecto a means ‘with regard to.’ If nothing else I can see that advanced Spanish is much more difficult than I imagined! ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/15 "2009-10-06T22:04:38Z")
My buddy who studied Italian tells me that x is pronounced as /s/, but that maybe in the North there might be people who say /ks/. Still, no _actual_ Italian to confirm this. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/16 "2009-10-06T22:08:41Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > But it is true that many consonant clusters in Latin have been simplified generally in Italian, whether or not it was “because” they didn’t occur at the beginnings of words. > > So in addition to /ks/-\>/s/ you have /ct/ -\> /t/, /pt/-\>/t/, /ns/-\>/t/, probably along with others I don’t remember right now. I think most Romance languages went through a similar process. These are examples of changes in spelling; Does the fact that -x- in Latin became -ss- in Italian tell us that 'x’s that are actually there _in Italian_ are pronounced as /s/ instead of /ks/? I don’t think that necessarily follows. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/17 "2009-10-06T23:26:14Z")
While waiting for human experts, ht tp:/ /ww w.dizionario-italiano.it gives xilòfono [ksi’lɔfono]; xenofobìa [ksenofo’bia]; xèno ['ksɛno] (the element xenon). It also gives bordeaux ['bordeauks], which gives me pause. Really? Bor-de-a-uks? I can’t imagine that’s accurate. Ooh! [http://www.dizionario.rai.it/ricerca.aspx](http://www.dizionario.rai.it/ricerca.aspx) has sound files! ksilòfono; ksenofobìa; either ksèno or ksènon; and bordò (_not_ exactly as in French; different -o). At least one, _xumellese_, is pronounced like an Italian z (dz), with an alternate spelling _zumellese_. It’s an ethnonym; from Xumello? Anyway, /ks/ seems to be the default. Most of the words with medial or final -x were from English or French, where it was either /ks/ or silent, and most of the initial-x words seem to be Greek in origin. ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2009, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/18 "2009-10-07T01:06:30Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Don’t we have any Italian Dopers? Che cazzo fanno, italiani? I am not Italian but I speak some. And I think what you said here is obscene. 🙂 I think you meant “Che _cosa_ fanno, italiani?” ETA: I dunno, maybe you _meant_ to be obscene. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2009, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/19 "2009-10-07T02:55:19Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > While waiting for human experts, ht tp:/ /ww w.dizionario-italiano.it gives xilòfono [ksi’lɔfono]; xenofobìa [ksenofo’bia]; xèno ['ksɛno] (the element xenon). It also gives bordeaux ['bordeauks], which gives me pause. Really? Bor-de-a-uks? I can’t imagine that’s accurate. > > Ooh! [http://www.dizionario.rai.it/ricerca.aspx](http://www.dizionario.rai.it/ricerca.aspx) has sound files! > > ksilòfono; ksenofobìa; either ksèno or ksènon; and bordò (_not_ exactly as in French; different -o). At least one, _xumellese_, is pronounced like an Italian z (dz), with an alternate spelling _zumellese_. It’s an ethnonym; from Xumello? Anyway, /ks/ seems to be the default. Most of the words with medial or final -x were from English or French, where it was either /ks/ or silent, and most of the initial-x words seem to be Greek in origin. Nice find. I am surprised. I’ve taken many years of Italian, but I don’t ever remember discussing the X, or xylophones coming up in casual conversation. > [@CookingWithGas](#): > > I am not Italian but I speak some. And I think what you said here is obscene. 🙂 I think you meant “Che _cosa_ fanno, italiani?” > > ETA: I dunno, maybe you _meant_ to be obscene. 🙂 Sorry, yeah, I meant to be obscene. But I should have said, “Che cazzo fate, Italiani?” I got the plural you mixed up with Spanish. Unless I was being extremely respectful of our non-existent Italian dopers. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2009, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736/20 "2009-10-07T04:53:17Z")
(Correction of my earlier post) > [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > So in addition to /ks/-\>/s/ you have /ct/ -\> /t/, /pt/-\>/t/, /ns/-\>/s/\*, probably along with others (changes to /s/ not to /t/) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/italian-pronunciation/512736.md?page=2)