# It's a travesty to end someone's career over "chink in the armor" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 21, 2012, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474 "2012-02-21T00:06:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/61 "2012-02-21T14:25:55Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Also, probably, because the headline isn’t calling Lin a “chink” of any kind–it’s saying there is a chink in his armor. If it’s meant in the derogatory sense, it’s saying there’s an asian person inside Lin’s armor. Seems like a very strange thing to say. Hard to make sense of it as derogatorily intended, because it’s hard to make sense of it at all if “chink” means “asian.” I’d buy this, but it doesn’t make sense the other way either. That would imply that somebody discovered a flaw in Lin’s game which allowed the Hornets to win, but he’s turned the ball over at least six times in every game he’s started. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/62 "2012-02-21T14:28:21Z")
Fire his ass. It’s always OK to be racist to Asians apparently in this country. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/63 "2012-02-21T14:41:09Z")
[how about I just read the thread] ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/64 "2012-02-21T14:46:22Z")
Well, we all know the news is slanted anyway. Full of gobbledygook these days. Nothing but a bunch of yellow journalism. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/65 "2012-02-21T14:47:27Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Fire his ass. It’s always OK to be racist to Asians apparently in this country. Not if you work at ESPN, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/66 "2012-02-21T14:57:25Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Lin, and his Chinese heritage, has been the buzz not only in sports news but in news in general for weeks. Anyone in the news business who doesn’t know that “chink” can be a racial slur doesn’t belong in that business. It’s that simple. Doesn’t matter if it was intentional or not It was stupid wordsmithing. If wordswmithing is your job, you should not be stupid at it. Banana is also a racial slur. Try reporting on the fruit without it. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/67 "2012-02-21T15:00:13Z")
> [@erislover](#): > > Banana is also a racial slur. Try reporting on the fruit without it. That’s a homophobic statement if I’ve ever seen one! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/68 "2012-02-21T15:00:36Z")
> [@erislover](#): > > Banana is also a racial slur. Try reporting on the fruit without it. Are you under the impression that this article was about a suit of armor? ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/69 "2012-02-21T15:03:21Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Are you under the impression that this article was about a suit of armor? It must have been, since it was about a chink. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/70 "2012-02-21T15:23:18Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > The point isn’t that he got fired for a racial slur, the point is that in certain contexts “chink” is a rather innocent word, and it’s up in the air whether or not it’s intentionally racist in this case. Chink isn’t akin to nigger, it’s closer to raging because “Spic ‘n’ Span” was in an article about a member of the hispanic community (without prior evidence that it was intentionally offensive). Sure “Spic” is offensive if used directly, but “Spic ‘n’ Span” is a very common product and phrase, it’s not immediately racist. Let’s say the California Angels, who just acquired Albert Pujols from the Cardinals, place him fourth in the batting order. Anyone going to be okay with a headline that says having him batting clean-up makes the lineup “Spic ‘n’ Span”? ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/71 "2012-02-21T15:23:55Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > You’re entitled to that opinion, but let’s call a spade a spade. (Another homonym with no racial connotation, by the way.) Seriously? If there was EVER a headline referring to a black player that contained, “Let’s call a spade a spade”, you’d see a much **bigger** backlash. Maybe the mistake was honest. So what? Incompetence or malice. Either way, the guy gets fired. People get fired from jobs for much less sometimes. What if a reporter was writing a story about Lin’s sudden popularity and headlined it “YELLOW FEVER!”? Maybe the intent was not to be malicious, but egregious displays of incompetence are commonly followed by losing one’s job. Why should this guy get more breaks than any of the rest of us for (at best) extreme incompetence? It’s not a “travesty” if a normal guy going to a normal 9-5 job can reasonably be fired for it. Maybe YOU wouldn’t have fired him, but it’s not a harsh or unusual reaction to the situation for many, if not most, people. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/72 "2012-02-21T15:24:35Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Lin, and his Chinese heritage, has been the buzz not only in sports news but in news in general for weeks. Anyone in the news business who doesn’t know that “chink” can be a racial slur doesn’t belong in that business. It’s that simple. Doesn’t matter if it was intentional or not It was stupid wordsmithing. If wordswmithing is your job, you should not be stupid at it. This. Also, the news sub-editors I have known have been constantly trying to slip semi-offensive stuff by their superiors; one guy was overjoyed that the restaurant review he was editing referenced a chef named “Poon” and that he could therefore plausibly put that name in his headline. ---
**Author:** ![Apollo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/41988e/32.png) [@Apollo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollo)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/73 "2012-02-21T15:24:37Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Well, we all know the news is slanted anyway. Full of gobbledygook these days. Nothing but a bunch of yellow journalism. **So brave!** You know what? I have a ball. Perhaps you’d like to bounce it? ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/74 "2012-02-21T15:29:24Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Maybe the mistake was honest. So what? Incompetence or malice. Either way, the guy gets fired. People get fired from jobs for much less sometimes. What if a reporter was writing a story about Lin’s sudden popularity and headlined it “YELLOW FEVER!”? I am not familiar with that particular colloquialism. Can you describe its use? > [@](#): > > Why should this guy get more breaks than any of the rest of us for (at best) extreme incompetence? I would not get fired for using a common phrase. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/75 "2012-02-21T15:35:03Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > That doesn’t fly with me. I thought I had made it clear: I am constantly in “copy editor” mode in regard to everything I read, scanning for even small mistakes in grammar or spelling, the subtlest incongruity in tone, any lack of absolute airtightness in a logical argument or in the reliability of cited evidence, and yes: the faintest hint of prejudice, racial or otherwise. I’m the one who usually spots “heteronormative” constructions (even though I myself am straight), or subtly disparaging assumptions about race, class, or gender. > > So, yes: if you are saying an editor working at this site would be “daft” or “dumb” or “stupid” to let this go through without noticing that it could be seen as a racial slur, that is necessarily ascribing those adjectives to me, because I completely missed it even with all my considerable faculties trained upon it. > > You’re entitled to that opinion, but let’s call a spade a spade. (Another homonym with no racial connotation, by the way.) > > ETA: Chinks in one’s armour do not have to be “discovered”. The phrase simply indicates that someone is not as powerful as they had previously appeared to be. Lin had a worse game than he had had in all previous starts; thus, the usage is apt. Meh. I’m pretty much a hardcore prescriptivist who would defend to the (metaphorical) death the right to use “niggardly,” “chink,” and other such terms in the correct context…and I think this was an egregious, immediately obvious racist pun. For example, I’d defend a headline saying “City Council Niggardly With Bonuses,” but I would instantly see the problem with “Martin Luther King Paid Niggardly Speaking Fee.” It could _still_, I suppose, be an accident/oversight, but I feel justified calling into question the competence of any senior editor who approved such a headline. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/76 "2012-02-21T15:37:14Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > That doesn’t fly with me. I thought I had made it clear: I am constantly in “copy editor” mode in regard to everything I read, scanning for even small mistakes in grammar or spelling, the subtlest incongruity in tone, any lack of absolute airtightness in a logical argument or in the reliability of cited evidence, and yes: the faintest hint of prejudice, racial or otherwise. If you are bound and determined to be offended by this, nobody can stop you. But your hypothetical copyediting skills are not under discussion. We’re talking about the job that was done by the people at ESPN. They are paid to do this job. The fact that maybe you didn’t notice the offensive reading of the headline as a casual (if sharp-eyed) reader does not say much of anything. > [@](#): > > The phrase simply indicates that someone is not as powerful as they had previously appeared to be. No, it indicates that the person has a significant vulnerability or flaw. Like every basketball player, Lin has several. But the fact that no new weaknesses became apparent during this game makes it a dull headline, and double meaning in the headline makes it really idiotic. > [@SlackerInc](#): > > If I were editing your comment, I’d advise not using “trouble” twice in four words in the first sentence. This is much more annoying than helpful. You do not need to demonstrate your amazing skills. You’re not a professional copy editor, and your copy editing skills are not being impugned. > [@](#): > > It’s an interesting question as to why I didn’t see it as a slur. I think, first of all, it was (as someone noted upthread) part of a commonly used expression. Thus I wasn’t parsing the words individually so much as noting whether the phrase was used correctly in context (which it was). Copy editors need to pay attention to things like that. > [@SlackerInc](#): > > The article I subsequently posted, from the NY Daily News, proved conclusively that my interpretation of the original article had been right all along. No, it doesn’t prove your interpretation was correct. It indicates I was wrong when I said Federico didn’t deny making a pun, and I’ve acknowledged that. But it does not prove his intent in writing the thing, and it doesn’t change the fact that it’s a poor choice for a headline regardless. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/77 "2012-02-21T15:42:21Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Lin, and his Chinese heritage, has been the buzz not only in sports news but in news in general for weeks. Anyone in the news business who doesn’t know that “chink” can be a racial slur doesn’t belong in that business. It’s that simple. Doesn’t matter if it was intentional or not It was stupid wordsmithing. If wordswmithing is your job, you should not be stupid at it. I agree 100%, and I can’t see where there is room for endless argument here. Whether or not he was intentionally trying to be racist is besides the point. Even if we suppose it was accidental and only meant with the purest of intentions, so what? That just means he’s too incompetent to be entrusted with a job that apparently has loose editorial oversight. If I were his boss, I’d fire him too. That goes for any writer who somehow can’t see how easily “chink in the armor” could be misconstrued. Ignorance is not an excuse. The barrage of jokes and one-liners out there making fun of Lin because of his race is not surprising to me, but nevertheless, I still find it disappointing that this form of humor is so popular in the sports fan community. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/78 "2012-02-21T15:51:58Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > But the fact that no new weaknesses became apparent during this game makes it a dull headline, and double meaning in the headline makes it really idiotic. A headline of “asian-american in the armor” doesn’t make sense at all. So why would you insist on this interpretation? It’s not even ambiguous. That interpretation is just nonsensical. It’s a poor kind of double entendre if only one interpretation of the words actually makes sense. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/79 "2012-02-21T16:02:21Z")
> [@erislover](#): > > A headline of “asian-american in the armor” doesn’t make sense at all. I suggested they were making a pun on the two meanings of chink, not calling Lin a chink. The proposed pun, if it exists, refers to both the newly famous Asian-American player and the flaw in the team. That’s about all that is required. I don’t think being doggedly literal-minded will improve anybody’s chances of understanding what went in this situation. > [@Sailboat](#): > > It could _still_, I suppose, be an accident/oversight, but I feel justified calling into question the competence of any senior editor who approved such a headline. Right. I agree that it’s unfair to jump on someone just for using a word that has one meaning that is relevant and innocent and another that is not. Bretos could be getting a raw deal. But when you’re writing and publishing articles, you have time to reflect on what you’re doing and you are supposed to be on the lookout for things like this. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474/80 "2012-02-21T16:04:04Z")
> [@erislover](#): > > I am not familiar with that particular colloquialism. Can you describe its use? It’s not really a colloquialism but an example of a very stupid headline. In the US, East Asians were (more often in the past than now) referred to as “yellow”, just as African-Americans are often called “Black”, people of northern European descent “white”, Native Americans “Red”, and Middle Easterners, Mexicans, subcontinent Indians, and South Americans “Brown” (note: “Brown” is less commonly used in some parts of the US). So, if you were to refer to refer to Lin’s sudden popularity by using the phrase “Yellow Fever”, you’d obviously not be referring to the disease but trying to make a pun based on his race (Yellow) and the Feverish excitement of fans at his sudden rise. While it’s not the most offensive headline, there’s no reason to play the race card in an article on his popularity, other than to point out that the “usual” expectation that you don’t often see people of East Asian descent playing well enough in the NBA to be popular. > [@erislover](#): > > I would not get fired for using a common phrase. Well, lucky you. But if I were to refer to a one-off bad job performance by a person of Chinese or Taiwanese descent as demonstrating a “chink in the armor”, I sure as hell would be disciplined for it, if not fired. It doesn’t matter if I meant it as an insult or not. I would be demonstrating extreme incompetence and stupidity and that alone would be enough to call my job performance into question. Likewise, if I referred to any black people by using the phrase “calling a spade a spade”, I’d probably be fired. Is that fair? Sure. “Fairness” in employment status after being ludicrously stupid (and possibly malicious) is in the eye of the beholder. Maybe I wouldn’t like it, but it would be as “fair” as not being fired, despite other people calling for my head. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-a-travesty-to-end-someones-career-over-chink-in-the-armor/613474.md?page=5)