# It's creepy: explain the Kennedy curse **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 7, 2002, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763 "2002-07-07T08:22:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Wikkit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c0e974/32.png) [@Wikkit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wikkit)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2002, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/61 "2002-07-09T03:00:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > **I really don’t give a flying crap how you do or don’t picture me. But you’ve obviously talked yourself and others into believing it so more power to you. How the fuck dare you call someone else’s worship system idiotic?** Because some ‘worship systems’ are idiotic. If I prance around downtown naked screaming to the invisible pink unicorn gods, I’m going to get ridiculed, and rightly so. So should I if I try to convince a bunch of logical people that a group of people is cursed without actually offering any evidence. What I’m getting at is that you, your beliefs, and your worship system **are** inferior and stupid. Not all convictions are created equal. > [@](#): > > Do you act like this to everyone who you don’t share beliefs with, proportional to the distance away from your beliefs that their beliefs are? No, of course not, some people have something behind what they say. > [@](#): > > Wikkit, when you’re confronted by an asshole like this with no apparent restraint or finesse I’ll take you seriously. Until then quit brown nosing the moderators and trying to equate yourself to their importance.\*\* What I was trying to do was to keep this thread from being moved to the pit. I like the pit, and shit like this and dumbasses like you don’t fit in well. Oh, and presuming that I’ve never been confronted by an asshole is just plain dumb, is was your response to it. ---
**Author:** ![dopetalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecccb3/32.png) [@dopetalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dopetalker)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2002, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/62 "2002-07-09T03:03:32Z")
“is was,” huh? ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2002, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/63 "2002-07-09T03:09:10Z")
He meant “as was” you ass plug. Shall we now go back over and scan for typos in your posts and point them out like a retarded monkey? Happy ---
**Author:** ![Spanky\_The\_Dolphin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Spanky\_The\_Dolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spanky_The_Dolphin)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2002, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/64 "2002-07-09T03:42:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Happy Lendervedder \* > **Shall we now go back over and scan for typos in your posts and point them out like a retarded monkey?** Just be sure to do it with multiple posts right after one another. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2002, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/65 "2002-07-09T04:54:45Z")
You should pray for _us_, the SDMB. We tragically have to put up with drooling morons on a daily basis. Our threads die faster than drunken Kennedy scions and our distant relatives (i.e. other boards) are full of criminals and miscreants. Pity us, for we surely be cursed. Now, give us $30 million and a Pulitzer, chop-chop! (obscure pun: “dt, what-a-whine.”) ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim_r.mortiss/32/142_2.png) [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_R.Mortiss)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2002, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/66 "2002-07-09T05:21:50Z")
Children, please. At least there is little chance that we will ever have to land at “JFK Jr. International Airport”…Timmy ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2002, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/67 "2002-07-09T11:50:51Z")
…so I have to do this. :rolleyes: dopetalker, here is a list of extracts from your postings on this thread, together with my comments. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* (bolding mine) > There’s something creepy about the frequency, severity and longevity of chaos, misfortune and scandal striking a certain family, **every year, at least once a year** I (and others) have repeatedly asked you for evidence to back up this statement. You have offered nothing. Bryan Ekers (clearly a gentleman and a scholar) posted a link. it showed 15 incidents in 61 years. These include two deaths in WW2, 1 treated for cocaine addiction and 1 acquittal. I don’t consider these the result of a curse, so that leaves just 11 incidents in 61 years. Assuming your maths is as deficient as your logic, that is an average of over 5 years between incidents. Yet above, you claim **every year, at least once a year**. Are you…wrong?! :wally > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > including relatives who don’t even bear the same last name but are just remotely related. I asked you to define which relatives are affected by the ‘curse’. You didn’t reply. This is **not** evidence (nor indeed worth considering). > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > The Rockefellers, Reagans, and other families have lots of branches too but don’t experience what the Kennedy’s are experiencing. Aha! Genuine evidence. This would at last add something to your case. And you have researched these families? No, I thought not. ☹ > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* (bolding mine) > Once a year or two, you say, ‘Oh, too bad!’ Twice every year, or two or three, you say ‘Boy what bad coincidences for that family!’ **But three, four and five times every two to three years** (a death in a plane, a lawsuit, a drug bust, etc in only the last two years, continuing a pattern spanning four decades, you say ‘My god…this is a curse.’ As shown above, something happens about every 5 years. You’re not studying maths, are you? :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > if you’ve been paying attention to the news like I have… Ah, the news. Now I don’t know if you know this, but journalists don’t often have time to dig deeply into a story. Also they are trying to attract people with a snappy human interest story. So you will never see ‘Myth of curse revealed’ in the media. There’s no follow-up. But mention a ‘curse’ and credulous shallow people rush out to buy the paper. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > you know that what I’m saying is correct and no matter how much you beat around the bush and say 'yes but other families also…" you know damn well no one is getting what the Kennedy’s are getting Ah, the argument of the trained scientist. Perhaps we could correct your sentence above: ‘I have no evidence, but you know that what I’m saying is correct…’ > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > Why don’t you open your eyes and ears and you’ll see that HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of people have this opinion. Is the reference to eyes and ears anything to do with our request for … evidence? :eek: As I posted plenty of people believe in dowsing, young earth and pyramid schemes. That does not mean they are right. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > I’ve had bad luck too, a lot of times many things all at once, in a very short space of time. ONCE AGAIN…that’s not what I’m talking about. I do not attribute that kind of event to a “curse.” Actually it sounds like you are under a curse. You, a single person, have suffered more than all the Kennedy clan put together over 61 years. Yet you do not attribute this to a curse. 😕 Why not? You said I should look up curse. Resisting the temptation to act like you and say “Why should I? I know what I believe. Anyway loads of people agree with me…”, …I did. curse: - solemn utterance designed to invoke a supernatural power to inflict destruction or punishment on a person or thing So, in your opinion, who cursed the family? Which supernatural power is being invoked? So far you have offered: a) the Universe b) God c) someone else I think you should let us know what your meticulous research has uncovered in this area. What, in your opinion, would constitute ‘destruction or punishment’? > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > So few people here believe in curses? Few believe that maybe in response to extremely dishonorable, mean, corrupt actions and words that hurt people and ruin their reputations and lives that a person or family can be made to suffer the same things, or that a person or people have the ability to purposefully or inadvertently influence another person’s existence with ill will, resentment, and anger? Yes that’s right. Few of us believe in curses, or Father Xmas or that you can avoid paying any taxes to the IRS. And our reason is…there is **no evidence** to support any of the above. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > But this kind of attack is perilously close to the kind of stuff that communist governments use to quash any and all ideas that don’t fit their little agenda. Ah, yes. Obviously we here at the SDMB want to persuade America that there is no ‘Kennedy curse’. Isn’t it clever how we cover that agenda up by offering **facts and cites** on loads of other subjects. :rolleyes: You mentioned communist governments quashing any and all ideas that don’t fit their little agenda. I know you’re deficient on maths and logic, but now you demonstrate ignorance of history too. :smack: The American Society for Human Genetics (ASHG) honoured C.C. Li for lifetime achievement in genetics education. The ASHG award, only the fourth such honor the society has bestowed, recognizes Li’s writings and teaching of human population genetics, segregation analysis and paternity problems, among his other specialties. But it also honors Li’s uncompromising defense of scientific freedom. Following the Communist revolution in his native China, Li became a key figure in the conflict between traditional genetics, pioneered by the Austrian botanist Gregor Johann Mendel (1822-84), and the **ideology-driven new genetics** of T.D. Lysenko (1898-1976), a Soviet biologist and agronomist. **Lysenko dismissed Mendel’s chromosome-based laws of inheritance as capitalistic and reactionary** and held that cells can absorb environmental influences and acquired human characteristics, which can be inherited by the next generation. Before the Soviet and Chinese governments finally rejected Lysenkoism in 1956, **the wrongheaded theories led to widespread crop failures and suppression of intellectual freedom.** Li, sensing that his refusal to endorse Lysenkoism was endangering not only his career but possibly his life, fled China for Hong Kong in 1950. Note that Mendel had facts and evidence, just like Bryan Ekers. Lysenko had only fanatic belief, just like…you. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > If they have the trait of someone being able to trigger that horrifying phenomenon of a runaway “instant expert” mouth making sounds and diatribes and no kind of a brain or intelligence to guide it then they’re a danger to themselves and others. Please don’t talk to yourself in public. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2002, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/68 "2002-07-10T00:06:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dopetalker \* > \*\*I agree with GATOPESCADO … \*\* :smack: :smack: :smack: * * * Theres a first time for everything, even Gay Anal Gang Rape. ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2002, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/69 "2002-07-10T05:54:56Z")
Whole villages in Honduras covered in mud during Hurricane Mitch. Thousands of victims never even recovered. Dozens (hundreds?, thousands?) of acts of genocide perpetrated all over the world for thousands of years. Bangladesh. (nuff said) Wars, a wholottadem. Project the timeline out long enough and everyones chance of survival is exactly zero. The whole human race is “cursed.” OTOH, Kennedys: rich risk-takers who’s every act of flatulence is surrounded by TV cameras. Don’t believe the hype. In reality, the Kennedys have lived charmed lives mostly immune from the trials and travails of common folk. Even their teeth are lucky. Note: JFK Jr. had a cast on his leg (planes have rudder pedals) when he tried to fly at night, w/o proper instrument training, with limited hours. The list of \*\*good \*\* pilots who have died must include tens of thousands of names. Inexperienced pilot + hubris = certain death. Not to mention skiing into a tree backwards while playing snow football drunk. Geez, what’s next? Blindfolded driving? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2002, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/70 "2002-07-10T07:34:49Z")
Cursed or not, the Kennedys can adopt me anytime. Just call me Bry-Bry. ---
**Author:** ![Ivan-Osokin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/4491bb/32.png) [@Ivan-Osokin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ivan-Osokin)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2002, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/71 "2002-07-10T08:25:26Z")
Didn’t JFK Jr date Darryl Hannah at one point? Hasn’t she hosted Saturday Night Live before? Couldn’t this whole Kennedy “curse” really just be a smaller part of the incredibly well documented curse that has befallen everyone ever involved with SNL? Poor rich drunks were doomed by Lorne Michaels if you ask me. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2002, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/72 "2002-07-11T07:57:26Z")
Some people believe there’s a curse attached to the [Hope Diamond](http://www.pbs.org/treasuresoftheworld/a_nav/hope_nav/hnav_level_2/level2_pitch_curse_hopfrm.html). Take note of the last entry\*. Now, that link states that not everything on that list may have actually happened. This link goes on to say that much of the legend may have been invented by [Pierre Cartier](http://history1900s.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.pbs.org/treasuresoftheworld/a%5Fnav/hope%5Fnav/hnav%5Flevel%5F1/2%5Fpitch%5Fhopfrm.html), in an attempt to impress Evalyn Walsh McLean while she hesitated over its purchase. Now, a number of bad things **did** happen in Mrs. McLean’s family after she bought the diamond. For instance, her husband left her for another woman, ran through much of their money, and drank himself to death. But people who can afford 44-carat diamonds aren’t likely to have much self-control. The point is, Cartier’s the one who started the “curse” story, then Mrs. McLean perpetuated it, and now people believe what supports the story and discount anything that does not. > [@](#): > > “Once a story starts to grow beyond its original basis in any sort of fact, it’s hard to put that back into the bottle again. You know, once that genie gets out you can’t just put it back in.” \*Now, what happened to James Todd (penultimate entry) is truly unfortunate. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2002, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763/73 "2002-07-11T15:41:01Z")
I aplogize in advance for this post. This was a little ditty I learned in college, back in the '80’s. While it is no longer completely accurate, it’s rare that I get to recall it. To the tune of _McTavish is Dead_: > [@](#): > > Oh, your father is dead and you brother is dead > And your brother is dead and your brother is dead > And Kopechne is dead and your son has one leg > And your mother is old and your wife is a lush > Hummmmmmmmmm [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-creepy-explain-the-kennedy-curse/117763.md?page=3)