# It's no wonder man inveted Television. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 14, 2005, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993 "2005-08-14T19:08:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/1 "2005-08-14T19:08:03Z")
Not entirely certain if this is Cafe Society material. I rather think it’s more mundate and pointless. So in an effort to make myself an more well read and rounded person I seized a list of classics which I commited myself to read before the end of the year. The list consists of: Robinson Crusoe (Defoe) Scarlet Letter (Hawthorne) Three Musketeers (Dumas) Walden (Thoreau) Silas Mariner (Eliot) Moby Dick (Melville) Adv. of Sherlock Holmes (Doyle) Great Expectations (Dickens) Count of Monte Cristoe (Dumas) Last of the Mohecans (Cooper) Treasure Island (Stevenson) And last but not least, a book I chose to start with, Picture of Dorian Gray (Wilde) Half way through Dorian Gray, I’m at serious risk of poking my eyes out with a sharp implement. What a load of homoerotic, self indulgent crap! I though Ayn Rand had the gift for torturing a point to death but I now see she’s not the first to attmpt to bore the reader into a catatonic stuppor. Get the fuck on with it Wilde… Yes, Dorian is beautiful, perfect and a complete self centered upper class twit who’s got two old queens trying to get into his pants. One keeps wanting to paint him and the other keeps wanting to date him. I can’t take much more of this. Just have them blow eachother and get on with the plot. Which by the way is fucking dull. Is this what I have to look forward to with the rest of the books on my list? Just a never ending stream of over written self indulgent tripe? 'Cuz if it is, I may just move on to Dostevsky, Gogol and Tolstoy so I can just slice open my wrists all the sooner. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/2 "2005-08-14T19:23:41Z")
Dumas is not self-indulgent, although he’s a wee bit longwinded. I don’t like Hawthorne much (he’s like an anti-Wilde), and I only read a child’s version of Crusoe many years ago (at least, I think it was a child’s version). I can’t say anything about the rest. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hey_It_s_That_Guy)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/3 "2005-08-14T19:44:21Z")
I couldn’t get through _The Picture of Dorian Gray_ either, for the exact reasons the OP listed. Wilde is a good writer and very witty and quotable, but that story just sucked. I hated _The Scarlet Letter_ back when we had to read it in 11th grade AP English class, but that was mostly for the unreadable and long introduction, “The Customs House.” I also think Tolkien is a windbag, and couldn’t get through the second \*Lord of the Rings \* book. If I were you, I’d just watch the excellent movies and save yourself a lot of florid prose and intense boredom. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/4 "2005-08-14T19:59:59Z")
No reason to read DORIAN GRAY when the 1940s Hurd Hatfield/George Sanders film so perfectly captured it. No real reason to watch any remakes either, tho I do mainly to see what they do with the picture. ---
**Author:** ![RandMcnally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b782af/32.png) [@RandMcnally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandMcnally)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/5 "2005-08-14T20:00:57Z")
I couldn’t read, The Scarlet Letter. The first page alone bored me to tears. The Count of Monte Cristo, on the other hand, I enjoyed greatly. In fact, I’ll most likely read it again soon. ---
**Author:** ![Jman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jman/32/4416_2.png) [@Jman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jman)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/6 "2005-08-14T20:03:50Z")
Hmmm… both my wife and I really enjoyed _Picture of Dorian Gray_. Different strokes for different folks, I guess, though I havn’t read it in 10 years, so I don’t know if I’d like it as much this time around. ---
**Author:** ![davenportavenger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f8ce5/32.png) [@davenportavenger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davenportavenger)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/7 "2005-08-14T20:05:00Z")
I don’t think one has to “torture” themselves with long-winded nineteenth century novels to be a well-rounded person. Except for Doyle I don’t enjoy any of the writers on that list. I bet if you tried reading more recent “classics” you’d probably enjoy them a lot more. I remember reading somewhere that many novels written in the 1800s were long-winded and description-stuffed on purpose, because they were designed to be read aloud to large groups (books were expensive, not everyone knew how to read), so five-page-long descriptions of someone crossing a ford were like built-in bathroom breaks. The Last of the Mohicans was one of those books. I would recommend reading Doyle though; he’s one of the main influences on all modern fiction, especially mystery fiction, and his work doesn’t feel dated at all. For that matter, also read Poe–his work translates well almost 150 years later. ---
**Author:** ![marque\_elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71c47a/32.png) [@marque\_elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marque_elf)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/8 "2005-08-14T20:13:46Z")
_Silas Marner_ was the most excruciating torture I’ve ever encountered reading the English language. It was the only time I ever read the Cliff Notes on a book required for high school. In Hell, the only book in the library is _Silas Marner._ I read Moby Dick in one night when I was working a 16 hour shift. I decided to read it on my own because I really liked the John Huston movie. Most of it I found boring. It told me far more about the business and techniques of whaling than I wanted to know. In fairness to the book, the conditions were not the best for reading great literature. My tiredness had to have an effect on my enjoyment of the book. I’ve always meant to give another try under better conditions as people whose opinions I respect have urged me to do. It seems unlikely that I will. There are so many other books yet to read. I enjoyed both the Dumas books and Stevenson’s. I’ve not read Cooper. After reading Mark Twain’s essay about him I don’t think I could take anything he wrote seriously. I love Dickens. I don’t find him overly wordy which is a common complaint. Some books may be more accessible but I’ve read them all and enjoyed them all. I’ve not read Defoe. Thoreau was hard to plow through but worth the effort. Sherlock Holmes is essential and wonderful. It has never grown stale for me. I read it periodically and always enjoy it. The story that were written before the visit to the Reichenbach Falls are the best but it all is worthwhile. I hope this is some help to you. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/9 "2005-08-14T20:19:15Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > No reason to read DORIAN GRAY when the 1940s Hurd Hatfield/George Sanders film so perfectly captured it. Or _League of Extraordinary Gentlemen_! That stayed pretty close to Wilde’s original text, right? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/10 "2005-08-14T20:22:07Z")
Dickens is going to kill you. There is no earthly reason for anyone to ever have to read Dickens. None. Ever. I don’t really know where my loathing for Dickens started…I’ve read everything he ever wrote, I think, and I find most of it to be utter garbage. On the other hand, I love Dumas, Stevenson and Defoe. Oh, well. Good luck with your task. Better you than me. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/regallag_the_axe/32/445_2.png) [@Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Regallag_The_Axe)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/11 "2005-08-14T20:34:16Z")
I would skip Thoreau’s Walden if I were you. It doesn’t realy have a point, or go anywhere. It’s just sort of, “I was in the forest, and I thought about some stuff. Then I wrote about it.” ---
**Author:** ![Barely\_Adequate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/58956e/32.png) [@Barely\_Adequate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barely_Adequate)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/12 "2005-08-14T20:55:58Z")
Thank You, Dopers… a 1000 times “Thank You”. You have assuaged the personal guilt I have harbored for nearly 60 years in not having read most of these aforementioned literary classics. I dunno’ that I can be assured of transitioning this earthly realm as the proverbial “happy man”, but every little bit helps. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/13 "2005-08-14T21:56:48Z")
Well, too late now. I got them all for a huge discount from Barnes and Noble so I’m going to at least attempt to read each and every one. If nothing else, they’ll look very erudite on the bookshelf. Maybe even impress the odd date that I can actually talk into a nightcap. 😉 Hmmm… I wonder if books actually ever helped get a guy laid … :dubious: 😃 ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/14 "2005-08-14T23:03:52Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Robinson Crusoe (Defoe) > Scarlet Letter (Hawthorne) > Three Musketeers (Dumas) > Walden (Thoreau) > Silas Mariner (Eliot) > Moby Dick (Melville) > Adv. of Sherlock Holmes (Doyle) > Great Expectations (Dickens) > Count of Monte Cristoe (Dumas) > Last of the Mohecans (Cooper) > Treasure Island (Stevenson) Three Musketeers – fine book. Of course, I read it in French, but any problems with it would most likely be due to a poor translation. Walden – interesting, though not a favorite. Silas Marner – meh. Moby Dick – as good as people say it is. The trick to to understand two things: list=1] [li]Melville was written in the sentimental novel tradition. If you get a chance to read one (See if you can find any of the works ofr Mrs. E.D.E.N. Southworth), you’ll understand more where Melville was coming from.[/li][li]The book is really three books: the story of the friendship between Queequeg and Ishmael (short), Captain Ahab’s search for the whale (a bit more), and an essay on whaling (the major part of the book). The essay is fascinating and probably the best nonfiction account of the ins and outs of the trade.[/li][/list] Sherlock Holmes – required reading for everyone. Great Expectations – also a truly great novel, though you probably have to be around 30 to begin to appreciate it. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/15 "2005-08-14T23:19:36Z")
Some of the books you’ve got on the list are a good deal less ponderous than Dorian Gray. Actually, so is everything else by Oscar Wilde. “Great Literature” isn’t a genre or a style, it’s just a haphazard list of stuff other people liked. How did you come by this specific list, anyway? It seems like gathering a bunch of books because you know they’re famous isn’t exactly setting yourself up for a good time. That being said, you might like Dumas or Stevenson because they are adventure stories. On the other hand, all 19th century prose is going to seem stilted and take some getting used to by the standards of today’s potboiler, so be patient. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/16 "2005-08-14T23:31:03Z")
> [@Barely Adequate](#): > > Thank You, Dopers… a 1000 times “Thank You”. > > You have assuaged the personal guilt I have harbored for nearly 60 years in not having read most of these aforementioned literary classics. I dunno’ that I can be assured of transitioning this earthly realm as the proverbial “happy man”, but every little bit helps. You shouldn’t feel guilty for not reading the classics. If you enjoy them, then read them. If you don’t, don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/17 "2005-08-14T23:37:34Z")
You’ll get a wide range of opinions on just about every book on that list, ranging from people who love the work in question to people who hate it with a passion. I liked _Dorian Gray_. I suggest reading it with a hiliter handy; WIlde is a great one for throwing in quotable remarks, witticisms, etc. _Walden_, also, is a good one to hilite. It shows Thoreau’s several sides: there are descriptions of nature, philosophical musings, countercultural scolding… depending on your tastes, you may find some of these facets fascinating and others boring. But it is a great American book. _Sherlock Holmes_ is great entertainment, and probably the fluffiest and funnest book on your list. (Some would say the same of _Treasure Island_, but personally, I found it, not bad, but overrated.) _The Scarlet Letter_ I didn’t get much out of, but that could have been because I was too young when I read it. I did like _The House of the Seven Gables_, though, and Hawthorne wrote some of the best short stories of his century. _Three Musketeers_: I’m only familiar with the candy bar, and I’m sure a lot was lost in the change of media. _Robinson Crusoe_ is good if you like that kind of thing: reading about the day-to-day details of how someone might go about surviving by himself on an island. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/18 "2005-08-14T23:38:50Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Dickens is going to kill you. > > There is no earthly reason for anyone to ever have to read Dickens. None. Ever. I find his novels immensely enjoyable. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/19 "2005-08-15T00:28:47Z")
Toss out _Silas Marner_ and _The Scarlet Letter_. (The Illustrated Classics version of _The Scarlet Letter_ is great, though.) You definately won’t like them, I’d be willing to bet. You’ll probably hate _Moby Dick_ - I tried once and failed. I loathe _Walden_ too, but a lot of people like it. I can’t understand all the hate that always comes up for _Great Expectations_ though. I think people get forced to read it too young. It’s really a lot of fun, particularly if you understand that a lot of it is supposed to be funny. I couldn’t stand _David Copperfield_, though, so different strokes for different folks. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993/20 "2005-08-15T00:58:57Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > Toss out _Silas Marner_ and _The Scarlet Letter_. (The Illustrated Classics version of _The Scarlet Letter_ is great, though.) You definately won’t like them, I’d be willing to bet. You’ll probably hate _Moby Dick_ - I tried once and failed. I loathe _Walden_ too, but a lot of people like it. > > I can’t understand all the hate that always comes up for _Great Expectations_ though. I think people get forced to read it too young. It’s really a lot of fun, particularly if you understand that a lot of it is supposed to be funny. I couldn’t stand _David Copperfield_, though, so different strokes for different folks. I can’t understand saying “throw out Silas Marner and The Scarlet Letter.” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-no-wonder-man-inveted-television/316993.md?page=2)