# It's not a fucking LIFESTYLE, you patronizing bastards!!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 25, 2000, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470 "2000-09-25T16:13:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/41 "2000-09-26T17:32:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mr. Cynical \* > \*\*Much like the fact that this is not your own personal board does yours. \*\* Eh? Where did that come from? I have no illusions that this is my board… hell I don’t even visit that often! Feeling a little cranky today? ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/42 "2000-09-26T17:38:54Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by **Scylla** _ > > Quite frankly, when I think of “gay lifestyle,” I picture those two guys from _American Beauty_, which is pretty close to my personal experience with the gay community. > > I understand there’s another “gay lifestyle” in San Francisco, but I imagine that it has more to do with San Francisco than being gay. > > At any rate, your stance seems very reasonable. I have never heard the phrase used in a demeaning fashion, but if it is, it is not the phrase that is at fault. It is a bigot who is trying to hide his bigotry behind an innocuous phrase. Um, **Scylla** , dear, where have you been living the past, oh, 30 years or so? “The gay lifestyle” is such a radical right, anti-gay, religious bigot, political zealot catch-phrase it hurts, right up there with “the homosexual agenda” and “special rights.” I have never, ever heard anyone use the phrase in any way other than a derogatory fashion. But sure, the phrase “gay lifestyle,” in and of itself, is just words - it’s the intent behind them that makes all the difference. But I put it to you that the intent, 99% of the time, is mean-spirited. > [@](#): > > Does this mean that there is not a lifestyle associated with being Gay? Last time I checked, there isn’t. Yes, there’s a gay _community_, but it represents every kind of gay _lifestyle_ there is, from **matt\_mcl** ’s radicalness to **goboy** ’s boringness to my feeding my cat every day. Don’t confuse the two. You and **IzzyR** should get together and play word games sometime… Esprix ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/43 "2000-09-26T17:48:07Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by **Scylla** _ > > Shit, Esprix’s a democrat? I had thought somebody as intelligent, diplomatic, and reasonable as he would naturally be a Republican. I’ll try not to hold it against him. Hey! Dem’s fightin’ words! 😉 (But thanks for the compliment anyway.) So, if you’re a Republican, tell me - what’s the Republican lifestyle really like? What is it that you people, you know, _do_? I mean, no offense, but I just don’t get you people… Esprix ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/44 "2000-09-26T17:49:13Z")
Sua: Excellent point. There is no non-derogatory usage of the word “nigger” in the English language though. If you use it, it’s very clear what you mean. Hastur: “No, there isn’t. Just as there is NOT a lifestyle associated with being black, irish, or catholic. The spectrum of diversity within a group is too broad to catagorize.” Don’t make me laugh. You are obviously wrong. There are differences and in generalizing it is valid to describe them. Take somebody who is leading a “Biker gang” lifestyle and drop them into a formal black tie dinner, and tell me that these differences won’t be apparent. Take your average Brooklyn Irishmen, and set him next to some Masai tribesmen, and tell me you can’t make a valid generalization. The BSM lifestyle of both gays and straights is very similar in Northern California (regardless of sexual preference) Your basic Harlem black guy isn’t going to have a lot of common ground or share the same mores as basic Wasp Prep school attendee. I have a real estate agent as a client who has an adage. “Follow the Gays.” Why, because “the gay lifestyle,” as he knows it, follows a pattern. Gay people move into an underutilized area and reform it. They fix up the houses, rejuvenate the parks, improve the downtown, open interesting stores, and add a lot to an ailing community. This makes it desirable, and real estate values go up. This has occured in Hoboken, and Key West that I have seen personally, and indeed is occuring all throughout certain communities in America. Once the place starts being really popular, it stops being cool, and the gays move out, selling at the top of the market, and moving elsewhere to start again. That this particular “gay lifestyle” is very real is apparent in the fact that my real estate agent makes a lot of money off this fact. Come to think of it, the premiere real estate developer in our area happens to be gay. Is this a stereotype? Who knows, it might become one. Who gives a shit? It’s descriptive and it’s valid. It is also the ONLY context in which I have heard “the gay lifestyle,” being referred to. Is it demeaning? I don’t give a shit. Within my context it’s accurate. Does this mean that all gay people are real estate wizzes? Clearly not, but again it’s how you use a generalization that matters. Generalizations within cultural contexts are perfectly acceptable and accurate as long as they are only applied to large populations and not individuals. If you think this isn’t true, than not only are you a whiny bastard, you are also fucking stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/45 "2000-09-26T17:52:46Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by **dropzone** _ > > Okay, while there may be some people who are solidly gay or solidly straight, there is an apparent continuum between the poles where most people fall. How one chooses to express his sexuality is, for most people, a choice. Agreed - there is a difference between sexual orientation and sexual behavior. My pet theory is that since there are, according to Kinsey, probably more bisexuals than exclusive hetero- or homosexuals, and since this society is so straight-oriented, most people tend to act only on their heterosexual side, and, in effect, “choose to be straight.” This is why I think that a lot of people still see being gay as a choice. Just my pet theory. 🙂 > [@](#): > > Like **Milo** , I don’t know where the urges come from. Nature? Maybe. Nurture? Maybe. Too often people are absolutists who think there is no middle ground. There probably is. Certainly - let’s not forget about the _bisexual_ lifestyle… 😉 Esprix ---
**Author:** ![BillyBoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/34f0e0/32.png) [@BillyBoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BillyBoy)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/46 "2000-09-26T17:53:25Z")
> [@](#): > > **Last time I checked, there isn’t. Yes, there’s a gay _community_, but it represents every kind of gay _lifestyle_ there is, from matt\_mcl’s radicalness to goboy’s boringness to my feeding my cat every day. Don’t confuse the two.** If this is really true, how can your sig have a link to a “Homosexuality 101” thread? ---
**Author:** ![tradesilicon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/439d5e/32.png) [@tradesilicon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tradesilicon)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/47 "2000-09-26T18:01:09Z")
Hastur, > [@](#): > > I was attempting to make a point through sarcasm as Freyr aptly pointed out. If you don’t like being stereotyped, why do you think we do? First, you didn’t stereotype me, not in this OP, since I’m not Republican or WASP. But you’ve done it plenty in other threads, and I’m just pointing that out to you. Opal, > [@](#): > > WHOOOOOOOOOOSH!!! Hastur’s entire post went right over your head, didn’t it… No, I got the easy to spot sarcasm and mis-guided examples, as I said above, just pointing out his own inability to keep from doing what he acuses others of doing. DavisMcDavis, {quote]What exactly qualifies as being in your face? [/quote] Total aside from the OP, what I mean is anyone wwwho wants to tell me how to behave and think while at the same time screaming about their own right to determine their own behaviour and thinking. BTW, I think anyone who would care weather homosexuality is a choice or not is a dope. People have the right to make choices, and if it’s in regards to sssexual orientation that’s no different than choosing what car to drive. I also can’t stand the way everyone in this country has to be catagorized. Isn’t it enough to say we’re humans, Americans, neighbors. Fuckin pricks, take your categories and shove 'em where the solar particles don’t reach. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/48 "2000-09-26T18:02:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Esprix \* > **Certainly - let’s not forget about the _bisexual_ lifestyle… 😉** Hey! You comin’ onto me, boy?!?!? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/49 "2000-09-26T18:04:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Esprix \* > > So, if you’re a Republican, tell me - what’s the Republican lifestyle really like? What is it that you people, you know, _do_? I mean, no offense, but I just don’t get you people… > > Esprix Well, generally, I wake up in the morning and have breakfast, and then spend ten minutes genuflecting before my life-sized poster of Ronald Reagan. I get dressed (always in suit, tie, American Flag pin, and socks with garters, even if I’m just going to be hanging around the house) and go off to work, though usually I take a few minutes out of the morning routine to hawk a large loogie on the poor black family that lives next door. At work, I leave Christian literature in the chairs of all of my colleagues, and conspire with my fellow white Republicans as to which minority co-workers we’ll bombard with hate e-mail during the day. Thankfully, as a Republican, I’ve been promoted into middle management quite easily with my ‘old-boy’ network, and generally I spend the afternoons subtly inquiring into my subordinates’ lifestyles and political views so as to decide who to fire and who to keep. Needless to say, godless Commie Democrats are the first to go. I’d say gays and pagans first, but we burned all of them at the last company picnic. I come home from work in my '57 deSoto modified into an SUV, just to rub in it the faces of those who think that there’s some sort of energy crisis or global warming crap. It’s expensive, but I make more than enough money stealing food from poor families, medicine from the elderly, and candy from babies in order to afford it. Once I get home, I start cooking dinner- although occasionally I’ll take a few minutes out to go kill the black neighbor’s pets or set fire to his house- and beat my wife with the crucifix we have on the wall. Luckily, usually she’s barefoot and pregnant when I get home, so she’s pretty submissive about the whole thing. Then I’ll have a few martinis, sexually abuse the kids, and write a letter of support for Rush Limbaugh. Then it’s off to bed, force a little sex on the wife, and sleep easily, dreaming of tax shelters. (Sorry. It’s been a long day, and I’m feeling more bileful than usual about the way people like to paint Republicans. In fact, my ‘lifestyle’ is probably little different from your own, save that I lust after women instead of men.) ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/50 "2000-09-26T18:12:09Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by **BillyBoy** _ > > If this is really true, how can your sig have a link to a “Homosexuality 101” thread? If you’d read the OP, I clearly state I don’t speak for the entire gay community, nor am I any kind of expert. I can only speak from my own personal experience and my own life, and can cite sources where appropriate, and others jump in with their experiences as well. This is hardly a summation of “the gay lifestyle,” no matter how the phrase is intended. It is, however, a random sampling of people who live their own “gay lifestyle.” Esprix ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/51 "2000-09-26T18:13:56Z")
John: You too, huh? I usually try to get nine holes of golf in at the club before I go home, though. Of course, we are not prejudiced at the Club. We have one jew member and one black member. I enjoy berating the Mexican immigrant caddy (that I don’t tip) for carrying my 200 pound golf bag to slow, and in the foursome, we idly wonder “what the poor are doing today.” We also drink lots of Gin n’ tonics, before we beat our wives with the cross. I’m surprised you do don’t do that too. You must not be REAL Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/52 "2000-09-26T18:42:51Z")
**John Corrado** , my dear, thank you _so_ much for making our point for us. There is no more a “gay lifestyle” than there is a “Republican lifestyle,” _unless_ you want to buy into every stereotype of either category you’ve ever heard. Suffice it to say that there are gay Republicans, and there are Republican gays. Esprix ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/53 "2000-09-26T18:54:19Z")
Scylla said: > [@](#): > > Of course, we are not prejudiced at the Club. We have one jew member and one black member. Gotcha beat- we have one black jewish member. All the integration with less fuss. We’re thinking about breaking his legs so we can claim we have handicapped members as well. Esprix said: > [@](#): > > John Corrado, my dear, thank you _so_ much for making our point for us. Did I _say_ I disagreed with you? ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/54 "2000-09-26T19:01:36Z")
Actually I disagree. There are aspects of commonality among Republicans. Just as there are for any group. I’m not sure that there is a super-strong lifestyle correlation though, as there might be with a group like “Dead heads,” or followers of Phish. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/55 "2000-09-26T19:24:46Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by **John Corrado** _ > > Did I _say_ I disagreed with you? On the contrary - I know you agree, which is why I thanked you for your pointed commentary. I just hope others can take your example and see how annoying it gets after a while when people refer to your “lifestyle” rather than refer to you. Kinda gets to you until you have to snap in, say, a Pit thread… Esprix ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/56 "2000-09-26T20:02:02Z")
> [@](#): > > goboy’s boringness I’m not boring ( or maybe I am and nobody’s told me) I’m just not radical. There’s nothing wrong with being a regular guy. John Corrado, that was a hilarious post. I wish I could write that well. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/57 "2000-09-26T20:15:08Z")
Whoa. Thanks, goboy; I actually thought it was pretty bad and was debating asking a mod to delete it. It started as minor sarcasm and parody, but somehow my spleen figured out that I was talking, and decided to interject itself. Next thing you know, it’s become a full-blown rant of bile and hatred, spewing out an assortment of the things that I have heard assumed of Republicans over the last decade (given that most of my friends are liberal and very outspoken in their hatred for Republicans, it’s quite a bit). So what started as parody ended in a billial rant. I guess it works well as a rant, but as it wasn’t what I was trying for at the start, I was kind of disappointed with it. But it’s good to know that _some_ people out there liked it. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/58 "2000-09-26T21:25:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by tradesilicon \* > **No, I got the easy to spot sarcasm and mis-guided examples, as I said above, just pointing out his own inability to keep from doing what he acuses others of doing.** Um… his “doing” was tongue-in-cheek and meant to illustrate a point. It was clearly not meant to be taken seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/59 "2000-09-26T21:35:34Z")
JC - That was fucking priceless. I shared it via email with a friend of mine who will get a real kick out of it, giving you full credit of course. SuaSponte said: > [@](#): > > “Gay lifestyle” connotes, esp. when used by certain proud homophobes, perversion, a conscious choice to be gay, pedophilia, and attempts to convert innocent young men to gaydom. Says fucking who? ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2000, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470/60 "2000-09-26T21:51:53Z")
John, your wife doesn’t have dinner waiting for you when you get home from work? You must be one of those _moderate_ Republicans. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-fucking-lifestyle-you-patronizing-bastards/34470.md?page=4)