# "It's not a remake; it's a new movie based on the same source" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [March 21, 2022, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402 "2022-03-21T01:25:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/21 "2022-03-21T13:01:28Z")
How about [The Producers (2005)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Producers_(2005_film))? In a loose sense, it’s a remake of [the 1967 film with the same title](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Producers_(1967_film)), but it’s really a film adaptation of [the stage musical that was based on the 1967 film](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Producers_(musical)). ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/22 "2022-03-21T13:32:30Z")
No. That way madness lies. Do that and you’ll want to do the same with **Little Shop of Horrors.** ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/23 "2022-03-21T13:39:52Z")
_Charley and the Chocolate Factory_ was based on the book, not the Gene Wilder film, _Willie Wonka and the Chocolate Factory_. Dahl supposedly hated the latter, so his estate insisted they stick with the written version. On stage, the Broadway musical _Mary Poppins_ was based on the book, not the movie. However, they worked with Disney to include some of the songs from the movie. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/24 "2022-03-21T16:33:15Z")
This is kind of stretching the premise, but there are also TV series that may be based on a movie or may be based on a book. For a recent example, the _His Dark Materials_ series is based on the _His Dark Materials_ books and not on the movie _The Golden Compass_. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/25 "2022-03-21T16:43:27Z")
More Broadway: _A Gentleman’s Guide to Love and Murder_ is the same story as _Kind Hearts and Coronets._ They wanted to use the latter title, but the owners of the movie refused to let them and sued them over it. So the musical was based on the original book, _Israel Rank: The Autobiography of a Criminal_. The book was in the public domain, so permissions were not an issue. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/26 "2022-03-21T16:45:55Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > This is kind of stretching the premise, but there are also TV series that may be based on a movie or may be based on a book. For a recent example, the _His Dark Materials_ series is based on the _His Dark Materials_ books and not on the movie _The Golden Compass_ . That’s another case of both the HBO series and the movie being based on the same source material, which is the usual case. Similarly, the HBO **Watchmen** series and the **Watchmen** movie were both based on the graphic novel, and neither on the other (so the HBO series DID have the giant squid-thing that the movie lacked). I’m not terribly surprised by such cases of multiple interpretations based on the samesource. It’s the cases where one movie is based on another movie, especially if the first movie was not itself an original source, that are most rare and interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/27 "2022-03-21T17:17:43Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > certainly not a remake of **Nosferatu** That’s coming up. Maybe. > **[Robert Eggers and Anya Taylor-Joy Still Planning Nosferatu Remake](https://www.denofgeek.com/movies/robert-eggers-anya-taylor-joy-planning-nosferatu-remake/)** > > Exclusive: Robert Eggers, director of The Witch and The Northman, gives an update about what he and Anya Taylor-Joy are discussing for a Nosferatu remake. > [@kayaker](#): > > Is there a special category for intentional shot-by-shot remakes of the original like Gus Van Sant’s Psycho? “Pointless wastes of time”? ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/28 "2022-03-21T17:41:11Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > > [@CalMeacham](#): > > > > certainly not a remake of **Nosferatu** > > That’s coming up. Maybe. Well, there already has been the Werner Herzog remake from 1979. I watched the original Murnau film, but not the Herzog version, only bits and pieces from it, so I personally cannot judge if it’s based more on the novel or on the Murnau version. Judging alone from Klaus Kinski’s make-up and mask which resembles Max Schreck’s strongly, I think Herzog went for the Murnau version as inspiration. > **[Nosferatu the Vampyre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nosferatu_the_Vampyre)** > > Nosferatu the Vampyre (German: Nosferatu: Phantom der Nacht, lit. 'Nosferatu: Phantom of the Night') is a 1979 horror film written and directed by Werner Herzog. It is set primarily in 19th-century Wismar, Germany and Transylvania, and was conceived as a stylistic remake of F. W. Murnau's 1922 German Dracula adaptation Nosferatu. The picture stars Klaus Kinski as Count Dracula, Isabelle Adjani as Lucy Harker, Bruno Ganz as Jonathan Harker, and French artist-writer Roland Topor as Renfield. Ther... ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/29 "2022-03-21T18:15:26Z")
I’d forgotten the Herzog **Nosferatu.** It’s actually two films – Herzog filmed it both in English and in German (actually filmed it twice – not merely dubbed). I’ve seen both versions now. The film is definitely a remake of Murnau’s 1922 **Nosferatu** , since there was no book “Nosferatu” – Murnau used Bram Stoker’s **Dracula** as his source, without obtaining permission from Stoker’s widow, or paying royalties. Flo Stoker was, not surprisingly, furious, and tried to have all copies destroyed. Fortunately, she didn’t succeed. But the Herzog film isn’t based on Stoker’s book, or on any other filmed version of “Dracula”. Although it deviates significantly from the 1922 film, it’s clearly a remake of that film. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/30 "2022-03-21T18:18:56Z")
_The Unholy Three_ was a silent film that was remade once sound came it. Though they were both based on a novel, the sound version used the silent version as a template, even bringing back Lon Chaney as the lead. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/31 "2022-03-21T18:22:56Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > The film is definitely a remake of Murnau’s 1922 **Nosferatu** , since there was no book “Nosferatu” – Murnau used Bram Stoker’s **Dracula** as his source, without obtaining permission from Stoker’s widow, or paying royalties. I knew that, basically Murnau took Bram Stoker’s novel and changed the places, nationalities and names of the protagonists, but kept the basic story. So I think you can say that Murnau’s Nosferatu was based on Stoker’s Dracula. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/32 "2022-03-21T18:37:33Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > If there is no original source other than the first movie. Akira Kurasawa’s classic **The Seven Samurai** was an original screenplay, owing nothing to any earlier source. So **The Magnificent Seven** really IS a remake of the film. This reminds me of the 1964 Clint Eastwood movie, “A Fistful of Dollars”, and the 1996 Bruce Willis movie, “Last Man Standing”. Lone gunman rides/drives into a desert town completely dominated by two gangs. He plays both gangs off against one another and emerges victorious in the end. It was basically two different eras but the same essential movie. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/33 "2022-03-21T18:40:24Z")
The Peter Jackson Lord of the Rings and the 1978 animated film. Partially posting this so I can post this complete [sidetrack](https://preview.redd.it/qtn1zqxz1pc51.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=6078f2f6aae05744bbb96ee944cafa688de402b1). ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/34 "2022-03-21T18:41:18Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > This reminds me of the 1964 Clint Eastwood movie, “A Fistful of Dollars”, and the 1996 Bruce Willis movie, “Last Man Standing”. Lone gunman rides/drives into a desert town completely dominated by two gangs. He plays both gangs off against one another and emerges victorious in the end. It was basically two different eras but the same essential movie. If you aren’t aware of it, this is yet another Akira Kurasawa samurai epic that was re-imagined as a western. **A Fistful of Dollars i** s basically a remake of Kurasawa’s 1961 film **Yojimbo**. The film was based on Kurasawa’s own story, so it’s pretty clear that **A Fistful of Dollars** and **Last Man Standing** are examples of films based on another film. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/35 "2022-03-21T18:42:03Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > The Peter Jackson Lord of the Rings and the 1978 animated film. > > Partially posting this so I can post this complete [sidetrack](https://preview.redd.it/qtn1zqxz1pc51.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=6078f2f6aae05744bbb96ee944cafa688de402b1). I think this is pretty clearly a case of films based on the same source material, not of a film based on another film. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/36 "2022-03-21T18:44:13Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > I think this is pretty clearly a case of films based on the same source material, not of a film based on another film. OK so I completely misread the OP then 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/37 "2022-03-21T18:46:11Z")
Does a movie based on a TV show count? (or vice versa) Lots of examples of that. Lost in Space, Traffic, etc. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/38 "2022-03-21T19:11:57Z")
I’ve read _Nightmare Alley_ and seen the original movie. I know there were some minor differences between the two, but they’re very similar. I wish I could remember what those differences were, because I’d like to see if the new film is based more on the book than the first film. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/39 "2022-03-21T19:18:45Z")
What about things that are sort of a hybrid of the original source and the first movie? I’m thinking of “Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles”, which was “based on the 1959 novel _[Starship Troopers](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starship_Troopers)_ by [Robert A. Heinlein](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_A._Heinlein) and the 1997 [film adaptation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starship_Troopers_(film))”. It incorporated elements from the original book that were left out of the movie, like the powered armor, and tended to be more faithful to the tone of the book, but also incorporated elements that were created for the movie, so it was clearly intended as a remake of the movie as well. > The show combines elements of Verhoeven’s film and the original novel, such as the extraterrestrial race known as the Skinnies, [powered armor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powered_armor) suits and drop pods. The series also adds some original elements (e.g., the war starts on [Pluto](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluto)), while omitting the political aspects of the original work and film. As well, character models for both the humans and the Bugs were clearly based on the movie. > **[Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roughnecks:_Starship_Troopers_Chronicles)** > > Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles is a CGI animated television series based on the 1959 novel Starship Troopers by Robert A. Heinlein and the 1997 movie adaptation. The film's director, Paul Verhoeven, served as executive producer. It follows the exploits of the Mobile Infantry squad, "Razak's Roughnecks," during the SICON–Bugs War between a newly united humanity and an extraterrestrial race, known as the "Bugs," also sometimes referred to as Arachnids. The show focuses mainly on the R Th... ---
**Author:** ![Levolor\_the\_Blind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bc8723/32.png) [@Levolor\_the\_Blind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Levolor_the_Blind)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402/40 "2022-03-21T19:38:41Z")
I suspect the origin of all of these is Dashiell Hammett’s “Red Harvest”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-not-a-remake-its-a-new-movie-based-on-the-same-source/961402.md?page=3)