Ah. So having three people on you doesn’t count as being restrained?
Not if they are in the process of restraining you.
No dickbong, I couldn’t. It’s not exactly high definition.
That’s absurd. If he’s being prevented from moving, he’s restrained whether it’s by people or handcuffs.
Is that the police manual definition of restrained or yours?
I have to admit, you guys are seeing much more in this video than I am. It’s such a dark mass of dark clothing, I can’t really tell the difference between an officer’s leg and the victim’s arm. I don’t see how anyone could. I simply couldn’t make any judgments as to whether he was sufficiently restrained based on the video alone. The officers’ positions during the before the shot and the fact that the victim’s arm flops away from his body after the shot isn’t indicative of fully restrained, but without testimony and answers to the many questions, it’s impossible to make any reasonable conclusions.
My thinking is, B E G, is that based on Mr. Grant’s behavior before he was thrown to the ground (calm, sitting with others, and so on) and that there is a three on one officer/Mr. Grant ratio after he is thrown to the ground, that he is at least somewhat in his right mind and not high enough to reach for a weapon while surrounded by police. He is not handcuffed as is evidenced of his arm flopping.
It is only conjecture, I admit, but pursuant to my best thinking if he is struggling at all significantly it is because he can’t breathe, which will cause anyone short of Scylla to panic. Even if he were struggling, it sure doesn’t seem as if he is in any position to harm any of the police officers.
There are two videos, have you seen both? The second one was shot from the left side of the altercation, and did not cut away from the struggle before the officer drew his weapon and shot Mr. Grant. For me, it is easily apparent from either video that Mr. Grant and the other men sitting against the wall are black. The second video gives another good angle of the altercation that when combined with the first one gives a pretty complete idea of what went on.
There is no evidence, as well, that he was involved in the fight. No one has said that he was. Looks like wrong place/wrong time/wrong color to me.
Mine. So what?
You are just assuming that he’s being prevented from moving. I can’t tell that from the video.
If he was restrained (ie. being prevented from moving) then you must believe that there is no other explanation for the shooting other than cold blooded murder on the part of the officer. Is this your position?
I could tell he was black, or at least not white, but the two guys sitting on either side of him appear to be white. I can definitely believe that somebody can’t tell what race he is.
On the other hand, I can clearly see he was fully restrained, too.
Well, obviously your definition of restrained doesn’t match Krav’s. One can’t be certain it’s even in the same ballpark as the definition that actually counts, which would be the police procedural definition.
But you just keep on playing Judge. How could you possibly be wrong? :rolleyes:
'Cause police are allowed to shoot arrest suspects dead when they can move now ? Well fuck me, America really *is *tough on crime.
Yeah, because that’s exactly what I said, fuckwit.
You said the only possible explanation for Grant’s shooting if he was restrained would be murder. It follows that to you, if he wasn’t, then murder isn’t the only explanation. As in “he might have had a very good reason to shoot him in the back”.
I’ll grant you that the suspect was very well restrained after that.
Boy, that’s about the falsest false dichotomy I’ve ever heard, right up there with “You’re either with us or against us.” No, I don’t think the shooting was justified, nor do I think that Officer Mehserle made a level-headed decision to kill Mr. Grant. Fuck off with your “then you must believe” bullshit.
A black citizen of the US. That makes it all more understandable. He probably had a long rap sheet and was a threat to the poor undertrained over matched police. Anything they do is fine by me. Taser him,shoot him ,beat him up. it’s all in the name of public safety. We can not question the police.
Well he *was *a blackness recidivist. I’m sure he’s been warned many times during his life not to be black. But these people never learn, do they ? Brought it on himself is all I’m sayin’.
I really like how you people that put forth strawmen such as the bolded statement above, have decided that anyone who suggests the possibility that this wasn’t cold-blooded murder is not interested in getting answers and justice. It just goes to show how biased you truly are.
He has a 4 year old daughter. We have managed to remove a person from her life that would have been a bad influence due to his forcing the police to shoot him. Society has a win -win here.
The mortage companies were really the ones behind this nefarious scheme.
Yay! The race card! This is always productive.