# It's the 21st century. I can't believe we still... **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 5, 2009, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126 "2009-12-05T20:44:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Cumberdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8c91f0/32.png) [@Cumberdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumberdale)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/61 "2009-12-09T03:49:50Z")
Waste so many hours on our collective knees crying about how wretched we are to some primitive sky dictator thought up by ancient desert dwellers. Major city newspapers still having biblical quotes on the front page. Frauds like Sylvia Browne, Benny Hinn are not locked away in a tiny dank cell for the remainder of their pathetic lives. ---
**Author:** ![Cardinal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardinal/32/4000_2.png) [@Cardinal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardinal)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/62 "2009-12-09T04:43:39Z")
> [@Maiira](#): > > I’m also gonna ask for a cite for the cannibalism and human sacrifice. Although even if they _did_ practice these things, who cares? Some cannibalistic, etc., societies kept these practices contained within their own. There are societies where consuming a dead relative is considered an honor: the better you know the person, the more of them you eat. And if they’re only being “savage” to themselves, why bother trying to change them? That’s one of the most insensitive, unfeeling things’ I’ve seen on these boards. Say, can I send a cannibal over for your children? I mean, it’s just a cultural thing he’s been brought up with. ---
**Author:** ![Maiira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Maiira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maiira)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/63 "2009-12-09T05:41:22Z")
> [@Cardinal](#): > > That’s one of the most insensitive, unfeeling things’ I’ve seen on these boards. Say, can I send a cannibal over for your children? I mean, it’s just a cultural thing he’s been brought up with. …Did you miss the part where I said that they kept that within their own culture and ate folks that were already deceased? Cannibal =/= psychotic murderer. THAT is insensitive. There are much worse cultural practices out there than cannibalism. > [@](#): > > Cite for recent cannibalism in Papua New Guinea: [Cannibalism in New Guinea 2, 1950s: Killing With Rapture](http://www.heretical.com/cannibal/nguinea2.html) This site is…I don’t even know. Seriously, what the hell is this? > [@](#): > > And if cannibalism and such practices are what their cultural practices are than their culture in inferior in comparison to others. Based on whose criteria? Why is it “inferior”? What makes another culture “superior” to another? > [@](#): > > Also you say it’s nobody’s business; well not everybody especially missionaries think that way. And I would argue that some missionaries go too far, stripping entire cultures of their identity simply for not being Christian. Not ALL missionaries are like this, mind, but for some it’s like they’re issuing an ultimatum: convert or die. And what kind of choice is that? > [@](#): > > For instance if someone was going to commit suicide should we not care about them or should we try to help him? Some would say no, we shouldn’t help them. But that is a different argument for a different thread. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/64 "2009-12-09T06:09:25Z")
> [@Maiira](#): > > > [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > > > Cite for recent cannibalism in Papua New Guinea: [http://www.heretical.com/cannibal/nguinea2.html](http://www.heretical.com/cannibal/nguinea2.html) > > This site is…I don’t even know. Seriously, what the hell is this? According to [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Sheppard_%28activist%29), it’s a website “devoted to publicising theories of ‘procedural analysis’, racist theories and caricatures, holocaust denial and the inferiority of women.” I’m not sure why **Curtis LeMay** would consider that a legitimate citation. ---
**Author:** ![Maiira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Maiira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maiira)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/65 "2009-12-09T06:15:08Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > According to [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Sheppard_%28activist%29), it’s a website “devoted to publicising theories of ‘procedural analysis’, racist theories and caricatures, holocaust denial and the inferiority of women.” I’m not sure why **Curtis LeMay** would consider that a legitimate citation. Ah, thank you. I didn’t think it was legit either, but I’ve been wrong before. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/66 "2009-12-09T06:19:57Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Cite for recent cannibalism in Papua New Guinea: [http://www.heretical.com/cannibal/nguinea2.html](http://www.heretical.com/cannibal/nguinea2.html) > > And if cannibalism and such practices are what their cultural practices are than their culture in inferior in comparison to others. Also you say it’s nobody’s business; well not everybody especially missionaries think that way. For instance if someone was going to commit suicide should we not care about them or should we try to help him? **Curtis** , you might want to read the rest of the website before you consider it a credible source: [Simon Sheppard, site owner](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Sheppard_%28far-right_activist%29) Here’s some of his other work: [What Jews Do](http://www.heretical.com/sheppard/wjd.html) [Anne Frank’s Novel](http://www.heretical.com/sheppard/frank.html) [The ‘Anti-Semite’ Smear](http://www.heretical.com/miscellx/anti-sem.html) Dude, they even link to Stormfront! Might wanna check and make sure that you’re not getting your “facts” from a Holocaust denial website. :rolleyes: Note: It IS a fact that up until recently, cannibalism was practiced as a FUNERAL RITUAL in Papua New Guinea. BUT, note the words _funeral ritual_. In other words, the bodies being eaten were those of people who had died of natural causes, at their funerals. No one was being killed. If anything is “savagery”, it is the fact that we still HAVE people like the ones who run that site, **Curtis**. THOSE kinds of people are the REAL savages. ---
**Author:** ![Sr\_Siete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6de8d8/32.png) [@Sr\_Siete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sr_Siete)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/67 "2009-12-09T06:43:24Z")
…don’t live in barren wastelands fighting bands of mutants. (Why, yes, I did grew up during the eighties. How did you know?) ---
**Author:** ![Maiira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Maiira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maiira)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/68 "2009-12-09T07:03:13Z")
Umm…I kinda feel bad for derailing the thread, so I’ll post some other on-topic stuff. Not necessarily serious, just some things I think would be pretty frickin’ sweet. …don’t have screens that are all holographic and stuff. …can’t have actual conversations with computers. I wanna be able to say “umm…what do you mean by this error message?” And the computer would say “well, see this thingy right here? Yeah, it’s broken.” …can’t fly jet-packs to work or school. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/69 "2009-12-10T02:01:18Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > According to [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Sheppard_%28activist%29), it’s a website “devoted to publicising theories of ‘procedural analysis’, racist theories and caricatures, holocaust denial and the inferiority of women.” I’m not sure why **Curtis LeMay** would consider that a legitimate citation. > [@Maiira](#): > > Ah, thank you. I didn’t think it was legit either, but I’ve been wrong before. > [@Guinastasia](#): > > **Curtis** , you might want to read the rest of the website before you consider it a credible source: > > [Simon Sheppard, site owner](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Sheppard_%28far-right_activist%29) > > Here’s some of his other work: > [What Jews Do](http://www.heretical.com/sheppard/wjd.html) > [Anne Frank’s Novel](http://www.heretical.com/sheppard/frank.html) > [The ‘Anti-Semite’ Smear](http://www.heretical.com/miscellx/anti-sem.html) > > Dude, they even link to Stormfront! > > Might wanna check and make sure that you’re not getting your “facts” from a Holocaust denial website. :rolleyes: > Note: It IS a fact that up until recently, cannibalism was practiced as a FUNERAL RITUAL in Papua New Guinea. BUT, note the words _funeral ritual_. In other words, the bodies being eaten were those of people who had died of natural causes, at their funerals. No one was being killed. > > If anything is “savagery”, it is the fact that we still HAVE people like the ones who run that site, **Curtis**. THOSE kinds of people are the REAL savages. Well crap… I just linked to the top link on Google to “Papua New Guinea Cannibalism”. However from Wikipedia: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannibalism](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannibalism) > [@](#): > > The Leopard Society were a West African society active into mid-1900s that practiced cannibalism. They were centred in Sierra Leone, Nigeria, Liberia and Côte d’Ivoire. The Leopard men would dress in leopard skins, waylaying travelers with sharp claw-like weapons in the form of leopards’ claws and teeth.[75] The victims’ flesh would be cut from their bodies and distributed to members of the society.[76] In Tanganyika, the Lion men committed an estimated 200 murders in a single three-month period.[77] > > The Aghoris of northern India consume the flesh of the dead floated in the Ganges in pursuit of immortality and supernatural powers. Members of the Aghori drink from human skulls and practice cannibalism in the belief that eating human flesh confers spiritual and physical benefits, such as prevention of aging.[101][102][103] > > In September 2006, Australian television crews from 60 Minutes and Today Tonight attempted to rescue a six-year-old boy whom they believed would be ritually cannibalized by his tribe, the Korowai, from West Papua, Indonesia.[107] > > In Tanzania in 2008, President Kikwete publicly condemned witch doctors for killing people with albinism for their body parts which are thought to bring good luck. Twenty-five albinic Tanzanians have been murdered since March 2007.[113][114] > > # As of February 9, 2009, five members of the Kulina tribe in Brazil were wanted by Brazilian authorities on the charge of murdering, butchering and eating a farmer in a ritual act of cannibalism.[117] All these cases were commited by tribes who did this intentionally, while not starving, and murdered and consumed living people. > [@Maiira](#): > > Based on whose criteria? Why is it “inferior”? What makes another culture “superior” to another? Based on how much they’re respectful of human rights and decency. For instance all real civilizations (Western, Islamic, Chinese, etc.) agree that murdering someone for no reason or consuming human flesh is immoral. > [@](#): > > And I would argue that some missionaries go too far, stripping entire cultures of their identity simply for not being Christian. Not ALL missionaries are like this, mind, but for some it’s like they’re issuing an ultimatum: convert or die. And what kind of choice is that? I don’t advocate destroying entire cultures only those parts that are immoral. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/70 "2009-12-10T08:39:43Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > The Leopard Society were a West African society active into mid-1900s that practiced cannibalism. They were centred in Sierra Leone, Nigeria, Liberia and Côte d’Ivoire. The Leopard men would dress in leopard skins, waylaying travelers with sharp claw-like weapons in the form of leopards’ claws and teeth.[75] The victims’ flesh would be cut from their bodies and distributed to members of the society.[76] In Tanganyika, the Lion men committed an estimated 200 murders in a single three-month period.[77] > > The Aghoris of northern India consume the flesh of the dead floated in the Ganges in pursuit of immortality and supernatural powers. Members of the Aghori drink from human skulls and practice cannibalism in the belief that eating human flesh confers spiritual and physical benefits, such as prevention of aging.[101][102][103] > > In September 2006, Australian television crews from 60 Minutes and Today Tonight attempted to rescue a six-year-old boy whom they believed would be ritually cannibalized by his tribe, the Korowai, from West Papua, Indonesia.[107] > > In Tanzania in 2008, President Kikwete publicly condemned witch doctors for killing people with albinism for their body parts which are thought to bring good luck. Twenty-five albinic Tanzanians have been murdered since March 2007.[113][114] > > # As of February 9, 2009, five members of the Kulina tribe in Brazil were wanted by Brazilian authorities on the charge of murdering, butchering and eating a farmer in a ritual act of cannibalism.[117] > > All these cases were commited by tribes who did this intentionally, while not starving, and murdered and consumed living people. Examples of _ritual_ cannibalism. Ritual has nothing to do with being starving unless it is an act to influence the gods to provide rain/sunlight/food in some way. The origins back in prehistory may have come about when someone ate someone and it rained, so it was assumed the gods were influenced - just like if someone danced around a fire and shook a rattle and it rained, it was assumed it influenced the gods to make it rain. Primitive concept of cause and effect. MauMaus[african leopard cult] were actually performing acts of terrorism, masked as ritual. The witchcraft/albinism link is mainly ritual involving someone who is _different_ for ritual use [the gods are influenced by the sacrifice, different = affected by the gods/demons. Us europeans used to kill people who were different, and seen as effected by the gods like albinos, dwarfs and epileptics.] Ritual cannibalism of dead relatives is seen as honoring the dead, and integrating them in ones self … bluntly, think of it as a religious version of organ donor just ingested instead of implanted. The 6 year old kid - Wawa … did you investigate the link? Some aussie woman imitation celebrity was making a news splash for publicity. I saw nothing indicating it was anything BUT an imitation news story. Just because someone reports that the kids is in danger of being eaten because he was accused of being a witch … and nothing happened to him and he is still in his own village. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/71 "2009-12-11T02:00:48Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > Examples of _ritual_ cannibalism. Ritual has nothing to do with being starving unless it is an act to influence the gods to provide rain/sunlight/food in some way. The origins back in prehistory may have come about when someone ate someone and it rained, so it was assumed the gods were influenced - just like if someone danced around a fire and shook a rattle and it rained, it was assumed it influenced the gods to make it rain. Primitive concept of cause and effect. The problem is that these rituals happen today and are murder. > [@](#): > > MauMaus[african leopard cult] were actually performing acts of terrorism, masked as ritual. > > The witchcraft/albinism link is mainly ritual involving someone who is _different_ for ritual use [the gods are influenced by the sacrifice, different = affected by the gods/demons. Us europeans used to kill people who were different, and seen as effected by the gods like albinos, dwarfs and epileptics.] Does that mean we shouldn’t stop the tribesmen from murdering their own? > [@](#): > > Ritual cannibalism of dead relatives is seen as honoring the dead, and integrating them in ones self … bluntly, think of it as a religious version of organ donor just ingested instead of implanted. It’s unhygenic and thus spreads disease amongst the populace. > [@](#): > > The 6 year old kid - Wawa … did you investigate the link? Some aussie woman imitation celebrity was making a news splash for publicity. I saw nothing indicating it was anything BUT an imitation news story. Just because someone reports that the kids is in danger of being eaten because he was accused of being a witch … and nothing happened to him and he is still in his own village. Fair but what about the last one where some Amazon tribesmen cannibalized a farmer? ---
**Author:** ![Illuminatiprimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/illuminatiprimus/32/11520_2.png) [@Illuminatiprimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Illuminatiprimus)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126/72 "2009-12-11T10:16:00Z")
Well this thread got derailed some plenty… For me, I can’t believe people can make a living fighting each other in a cage/ring. I thought the age of gladiatorial sport was over. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-the-21st-century-i-cant-believe-we-still/520126.md?page=3)