# It's time to officially Pit Joe Paterno and the Penn State football program. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 7, 2011, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167 "2011-11-07T14:23:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/241 "2011-11-08T22:30:30Z")
[The Pennsylvania legal Code regarding Mandate Reporting of Sex Abuse is extremely clear.](http://www.pacode.com/secure/data/049/chapter42/s42.42.html). Joe Paterno did not in fact report it to the employee of Penn State University who is charged with then reporting to the Dept of Health of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. He turfed it off to a pal a bit higher up the food chain in the Athletic Department, and let it go. HE LET IT GO. He is a School Teacher, and may legally be regarded as a School Administrator. Therefore under Pennsylvania Law, he is a Mandated Reporter. Fucker. Swept it under the carpet. Well, he won’t live to see prison. The A.D. ? Hope he does, along with the Finance crony who also committed perjury. For 3 years I was a Mandated Reporter in NY State for all abuse and sex crimes. To knowingly suppress or NOT report information or something I had directly witnessed was good for a trip to the police station. Same goes for most states, including Pennsylvania. ETA: **Frank** , you are wrong. Joe Paterno is absolutely covered under the Mandatory Reporting Law. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/242 "2011-11-08T22:33:30Z")
> [@HubZilla](#): > > No way! > > The Penn State fans will rally around their beleaguered coach. It’s the anti-Paterno media’s fault for blowing this out of proportion. Ben Jones of [blackshoediaries.com](http://blackshoediaries.com) tweeted that [about 600](http://twitter.com/#!/Ben_Jones88/status/134019984694325248) students are planning to show up at Paterno’s house tonight in support of the coach. Yea, I have to agree that while a massive absence of student support at the next game would send a clear message, the likelihood of that happening is pretty slim. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/243 "2011-11-08T22:34:36Z")
> [@Huerta88](#): > > So the prosecutors draw the distinction based on (a) at least Paterno kicked it upstairs, whereas Curley and Schultz affirmatively suppressed (and later lied about under oath) it; and (b) no one has been willing to swear so far that Paterno heard any specific, detailed allegation of particular sexual contact. And, I guess, (c) no one’s been able to prove that Paterno lied under oath. > > As I’ve said before, that’s a pretty bogus distinction, but that’s the history. **Morally** , it **is** a bogus distinction. But the prosecutors quite rightly have to distinguish based on what they think they can convict someone on. Based on your summary, their **legal** case against Curley and Schultz appears to be on much more solid ground than any case they might make against Paterno. Paterno should still immediately resign and drop out of public life forever. Since he hasn’t, Penn State should immediately put him on administrative leave as they prepare to dismiss him permanently. I really expected to wake up this morning to an announcement that they’d already put him on admin leave. I don’t know what they’re thinking to let it ride this long. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/244 "2011-11-08T22:38:01Z")
From CBS Sports’ Keys to the Game for this weekend’s Penn State-Nebraska game: > [@](#): > > This is a very hard one to figure out. With everything going on in State College right now, we can’t even be sure who will or won’t be coaching Penn State this weekend Bet that helps the players get ready. 🙂 > [@Kolga](#): > > [Rush Limbaugh](http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2011/11/08/joe_paterno_and_the_degradation_of_american_culture) has weighed in, and the entire thing is a pattern of liberal left-wing attacks on Joe Paterno. And it’s all somehow related to Obama’s mission to destroy the country. Stay classy, Rush. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/245 "2011-11-08T22:38:32Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > **Morally** , it **is** a bogus distinction. But the prosecutors quite rightly have to distinguish based on what they think they can convict someone on. Based on your summary, their **legal** case against Curley and Schultz appears to be on much more solid ground than any case they might make against Paterno. > > Paterno should still immediately resign and drop out of public life forever. Since he hasn’t, Penn State should immediately put him on administrative leave as they prepare to dismiss him permanently. I really expected to wake up this morning to an announcement that they’d already put him on admin leave. I don’t know what they’re thinking to let it ride this long. They’re thinking “Paterno is God” and how much money they’re going to lose in endorsements and team paraphernalia without JoePa in the driver’s seat. It’s disgusting, but that’s the calculus. It’s really kind of hard to understand just how influential and powerful Joe Paterno is in Centre County. When I call him “God”, I’m not really exaggerating. I think people are going to be shocked at how much support he still has. I’m more than a little afraid to put this on my Facebook page, because I’ve got about 5 or 6 rabid Penn State fans among my aunts, uncles, and cousins. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/246 "2011-11-08T22:38:44Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > I’m thinking a better protest would be to see the student section totally empty. It’s one thing to expect the players–who are totally blameless in all this–to potentially jeopardize their scholarships by effectively going on strike. They know most of the team is not going to make it to the NFL and that degree is all they’re going to get out of Penn State. But the students…how can you go to the game and sing “For the Glory” after this? How do you tailgate or do the stadium walk after this? I couldn’t, no way. I’m good with either idea. But having the players do it would be much more powerful. It would be a great reminder to every coach and school official who has allowed themselves to be seduced by “the importance of sports”. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/247 "2011-11-08T22:40:34Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > What I want to know is how in the fuck do you witness a child being raped and not try to stop it right then and there? How in the fuck to you see that and tip toe out of the room to talk to your dad about it and then schedule a meeting with a coach leaving a child to continue to be raped? This is what I don’t get. It’s mind boggling how someone could do that. I hope that guy has many sleepless nights. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/248 "2011-11-08T22:42:38Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > Well, they aren’t going to fill that stadium with 100,000+ people to watch a calculus exam. _2-4-6-8, Dude, it’s time to integrate!_ ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/249 "2011-11-08T22:50:38Z")
FWIW, I don’t think, based on the facts that are settled at this point, that JP is necessarily morally culpable at all. ISTM that the righteous indignation that surrounds anything relating to child abuse these days is no different than that of fanatics of other times and places, over other crimes. [Note: the first paragraph would not stand if in fact JP knew that the kid was being raped. But it’s not clear that he knew or should have known, since it’s not clear what he was told. The assumption that he must have known is itself part of the child abuse hysteria sanctimony, IMHO.] ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/250 "2011-11-08T23:01:05Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > FWIW, I don’t think, based on the facts that are settled at this point, that JP is necessarily morally culpable at all. > > ISTM that the righteous indignation that surrounds anything relating to child abuse these days is no different than that of fanatics of other times and places, over other crimes. > > [Note: the first paragraph would not stand if in fact JP knew that the kid was being raped. But it’s not clear that he knew or should have known, since it’s not clear what he was told. The assumption that he must have known is itself part of the child abuse hysteria sanctimony, IMHO.] He damn well knew something was going on, but he chose to play the part of the Mafia Lawyer. He sat there with his fingers in his ears, going “la, la, la!! I can’t HEAR you!! Don’t talk about anything that would implicate me in all of this!” And that’s the best case scenario. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_the\_Impaler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Carol\_the\_Impaler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_the_Impaler)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/251 "2011-11-08T23:03:29Z")
Especially, AIUI, since he knew there was a problem in 1998. Or did he think that the 2002 incident was a horrible coincidence? ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/252 "2011-11-08T23:34:28Z")
It is ASTONISHING to me how many of the board conservatives continue to insist that Paterno did no wrong, legally or morally. I just can’t wrap my head around it at all. Paterno was informed that McQueary saw sexually inappropriate behavior on the part of Paterno’s former heir. Paterno informed the AD, and then…did nothing. Hired McQueary, the man who had accused Paterno’s former heir of sexual improprieties with a child. Keep hanging out with Sandusky, the man so accused. Didn’t check with any authority figures other than his boss. Didn’t follow up to make sure that the accusation had been investigated by the appropriate people. What was his thought process? “I’m going to hire this guy who accused my former heir apparent of child molestation, even though I don’t believe his accusations?” This, like the thread on the Texas judge belt-whipping his teenage daughter, is certainly clarifying the character of a number of people on this board. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/253 "2011-11-08T23:36:17Z")
- 1. ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2011, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/254 "2011-11-08T23:38:46Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > You realize that Penn State is in fact a very large University outside of its football program, right? This is true, but Penn State games draw a LOT of people who don’t live in the immediate area. And by “a LOT”, I mean “good luck getting anywhere near State College on a Saturday.” ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2011, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/255 "2011-11-09T00:02:57Z")
> [@Kolga](#): > > It is ASTONISHING to me how many of the board conservatives continue to insist that Paterno did no wrong, legally or morally. I have to take exception to this. There are maybe two or three board conservatives defending him. **Mr. Moto** , **magellan01** , and several more have been right along with the board centrists and liberals condemning him. You can’t really divide the defenders and condemners by political ideology on this one. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2011, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/256 "2011-11-09T00:07:55Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I have to take exception to this. There are maybe two or three board conservatives defending him. **Mr. Moto** , **magellan01** , and several more have been right along with the board centrists and liberals condemning him. You can’t really divide the defenders and condemners by political ideology on this one. You know, you’re right. There have only a couple of board conservatives that went with the “no culpability” argument. I apologize for the incorrect generalization. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2011, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/257 "2011-11-09T00:26:34Z")
> [@Kolga](#): > > It is ASTONISHING to me how many of the board conservatives continue to insist that Paterno did no wrong, legally or morally. I just can’t wrap my head around it at all. See, Joe Paterno is God. The only person in football more God than Joe Paterno is Tim Tebow, Blessed Be His Name and Uniform. Glad to have cleared that up… ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/258 "2011-11-09T00:28:12Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > [Note: the first paragraph would not stand if in fact JP knew that the kid was being raped. But it’s not clear that he knew or should have known, since it’s not clear what he was told. The assumption that he must have known is itself part of the child abuse hysteria sanctimony, IMHO.] Are you kidding? Is there a meaningful distinction to you between “anal rape” and “sexual contact [of ANY kind] with a minor?” Legally? Morally? There is no dispute that JP heard **at least** the latter. (BTW, I am beginning to suspect that McQuery might be just enough of a careerist scumbag to have been vague about what he told JP (not that there is a meaningful distinction between the two alternatives – I can’t stress that strongly enough) and then be very specific about telling Curley and Shultz “anal intercourse.” Maybe that was intentional to give the prosecution **some** (bogus) basis to treat Paterno differently, and to allow Paterno to in turn be vague, and, most importantly, avoid perjury (which is probably the fundamantal reason for Shultz and Curley being prosecuted – prosecutors ALWAYS go after easily-demonstrated perjurers). ADs come and go, university VPs are a dime a dozen. Legendary coaches who have selected you as their protege are a commodity that needs to be protected. I’m not saying McQuery deliberately set up his testimony specifically to protect JP, just that there was ample incentive built in if he were/was/is inclined to do so. Can we agree that if/when JP goes, McQuery will just about have to as well? ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2011, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/259 "2011-11-09T00:31:14Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I have to take exception to this. There are maybe two or three board conservatives defending him. **Mr. Moto** , **magellan01** , and several more have been right along with the board centrists and liberals condemning him. You can’t really divide the defenders and condemners by political ideology on this one. Hey . . . I’m kind of hurt . . . ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2011, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/260 "2011-11-09T00:32:58Z")
> [@Huerta88](#): > > Hey . . . I’m kind of hurt . . . It’s like the Gilligan’s Island theme. You’re part of “and the rest”. 🙂 Honestly, I only went by memory and didn’t go back over the thread to get all the names. It wasn’t an intentional slight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=14)