# It's time to officially Pit Joe Paterno and the Penn State football program. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 7, 2011, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167 "2011-11-07T14:23:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 296
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5903 "2012-12-12T17:27:00Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > Did you get that? Most of the kids were molested AFTER the investigation that JP was an integral part of occurred. Big Joe isn’t looking so good now is he? What are you faulting JP for WRT the 1998 investigation? ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5904 "2012-12-12T19:52:58Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Hey, nothing wrong with shower hugs and naked horseplay. It happened all the time back in the 'fifties, before America was led down the wrong path by filthy hippies. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5905 "2012-12-12T21:05:58Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > Hey who knows more about this case? A special investigative team headed by a former head of the FBI or SA? A group that interviewed over 400 people and reviewed 3,500,000 documents or 1 yahoo with a paper towel tube and an Internet connection? **SA** has already claimed \*\*NLP \*\*is more completely informed on the topic, as well as more articulate. So, the answer is: \*The imaginary friend \*of a yahoo with a paper towel tube. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5906 "2012-12-12T21:26:44Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > You’ve already been corrected on this as well. > > The entirety of this thread is based on fantasy out of your own head. Stupid and ignorant re-imaginings of reality that involve benign naked man-boy shower play, lining up 9 year olds, fucking paper towel tubes, squatting and thrusting and the floor to anus height of typical adolescents. Your interpretation of PA law is no different, excepting that it’s less manifestly skeevy. Oh, really? :D:D:D Then let me cast your mind back a way to page 112, where I posted Pennsylvania law on mandated reporters, which would be in post [5562](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15587417&postcount=5562), which clearly states: > [@](#): > > \*§ 42.42. Suspected child abuse—mandated reporting requirements. > > (a) General rule. Under 23 Pa.C.S. § 6311 (relating to persons required to report suspected child abuse), licensees who, in the course of the employment, occupation or practice of their profession, come into contact with children shall report or cause a report to be made to the Department of Public Welfare when they have reasonable cause to suspect on the basis of their professional or other training or experience, that a child coming before them in their professional or official capacity is a victim of child abuse. > > (b) Staff members of public or private agencies, institutions and facilities. Licensees who are staff members of a medical or other public or private institution, school, facility or agency, and who, in the course of their employment, occupation or practice of their profession, come into contact with children shall immediately notify the person in charge of the institution, school facility or agency or the designated agent of the person in charge when they have reasonable cause to suspect on the basis of their professional or other training or experience, that a child coming before them in their professional or official capacity is a victim of child abuse. Upon notification by the licensee, the person in charge or the designated agent shall assume the responsibility and have the legal obligation to report or cause a report to be made in accordance with subsections (a), (c) and (d). \* To which I followed up in part by making the following observations: > [@](#): > > \*Note first of all that only by the greatest technical legal definition of a minor could Joe Paterno be said to have any child “come before him in his professional or official capacity” as the youngest any candidate for one of his football teams would have been seventeen years old at least. Still, one could make that argument if a seventeen-year-old member of his team were to come to him and make allegations that he had been abused. > > Which leads us to two more cruxes of the matter: > > 1. The law appears to say nothing which requires a mandated reporter to notify the police, requiring instead that the Department of Public Welfare be notified. > > So it appears my esteemed opponents are wrong in regard to Paterno’s having any sort of moral culpability as a result of having not notified the police, nor of any moral culpability for crimes that were committed subsequently because the police weren’t notified and therefore weren’t able to instantly indentify the boy and interrogate Sandusky so that he broke down and confessed the truth, as was so stidently alleged during the early phases of the thread. And… > > 1. It appears that the reporting requirement requires that the abused child come forth with allegations to the mandated reporter him or herself rather than for a requirement to be imposed merely upon hearsay. Note the wording of the law, which states: “a child coming before them in their professional or official capacity is a victim of child abuse.” > > Clearly the law is written to require that people who hear from a child who has been or is being abused, or who in their opinion based on their training or experience have reason to suspect the child has been or is being abused, report those accusations or beliefs to the Depart of Public Welfare in Pennsylvania. > > Thus it is my opinion that neither Joe Paterno nor any of the members of the Penn State administrative staff were legally remiss in not calling the Dept of Public Welfare for two reasons, as no child had come before them to allege that Sandusky had been abusing them, and all they had to go on at that point was, in effect, hearsay, and not something they had learned by virtue of their own professional training or experience\*. To this you replied: > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by **Hentor the Barbarian** : > > \*Hey dumbfuck. Read the very last line of your quoted text. > > Goddamn you’re stupid. > > And there is nothing in the code that says a child has to make an allegation. You are as lacking in cognitive ability as you are possessing skeeviness\*. Followed by: > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by **Hentor the Barbarian** : > > \*I am a mandated reporter in Pennsylvania. I’ve done CE specific to mandated reporting requirements. I’ve had to make Childline reports many times, including as a supervisor of another person who was the one to obtain the info. > > I know this stuff a little better than a skeeve who just read it a little while ago on the internet. > > ETA: stupid ass, the child doesn’t have to make an allegation because they might not want to or be able to. The mandated reporter acts on their concerns, whether or not the child says anything. > > Rules of evidence don’t apply. It’s up to the subsequent investigators to determine if a report is founded or not.\* And: > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by **Hentor the Barbarian** : > > _Skeeving Artist believes his having read it on the internet trumps professional experience and legal counsel._ [Echoes of **Rick** here - **SA**] Then, guess what? :eek: 😃 Five days later you’d done a complete turn-around and began schooling people yourself on the limitations of the mandated reporter law which I’d taught you. To wit: > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by **Hentor the Barbarian** : > > \*Being one myself, I am aware. However, were they affiliated with Penn State? Did the child come before them in their professional activities? > > “If neither was true, they would not have mandated reporting requirements in this matter.”\* ~ Post 5658 and > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by **Hentor the Barbarian** : > > _“So what? That’s accurate. He is a mandated reporter. It does not mean he is mandated to report any and all abuse he suspects. Only that regarding a child coming before him in his professional capacity (including any institution he is professionally affiliated with).”_ ~ Post 5660 And now you’ve apparently forgotten all that and you’ve gone back once again to hurling insults at me and demonstrating your own ignorance. 😃 😃 😃 Believe it or not and despite our years-long mutual animus I had actually come to feel a smidgeon of respect for you for having come to accept the wording of the law for what it is and reversing yourself on it, despite the fact that you never acknowledged that I was right and you were wrong and/or to apologize for the insults you hurled my way prior to your seeing the light and realizing that I was correct after all. But no more! Now you’ve forgotten everything I taught you and you’ve gone back to being the same ignorant, insult-tossing douchebag you’ve always been. So, welcome back, douchebag! 😃 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5907 "2012-12-12T23:20:27Z")
Kids are getting assfucked in the shower and you’re splitting hairs on the definition of mandated reporter? ETA: sick fuck. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5908 "2012-12-12T23:26:40Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Kids are getting assfucked in the shower and you’re splitting hairs on the definition of mandated reporter? Now you’ve done it. I hope you’re happy. Within 10 posts we’ll get another chapter of _The Wayward Orphan_, where little Timmy has a serene look of no-distress on his face while his benevolent mentor gives him a misinterpreted naked heterosexual sports-related shower hug. There will be straining ham-strings, showering lessons, games of “hide the soap,” it’ll be brutal. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5909 "2012-12-12T23:30:56Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Oh, really? :D:D:D > > Then let me cast your mind back a way to page 112, where I posted Pennsylvania law on mandated reporters, which would be in post [5562](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15587417&postcount=5562), which clearly states: > > To which I followed up in part by making the following observations: > > To this you replied: > > Followed by: > > And: > > Then, guess what? :eek: 😃 > > Five days later you’d done a complete turn-around and began schooling people yourself on the limitations of the mandated reporter law which I’d taught you. To wit: > and > > And now you’ve apparently forgotten all that and you’ve gone back once again to hurling insults at me and demonstrating your own ignorance. 😃 😃 😃 > > Believe it or not and despite our years-long mutual animus I had actually come to feel a smidgeon of respect for you for having come to accept the wording of the law for what it is and reversing yourself on it, despite the fact that you never acknowledged that I was right and you were wrong and/or to apologize for the insults you hurled my way prior to your seeing the light and realizing that I was correct after all. > > But no more! Now you’ve forgotten everything I taught you and you’ve gone back to being the same ignorant, insult-tossing douchebag you’ve always been. > > So, welcome back, douchebag! 😃 🆒 Neither of the last two of those quotes from me were about Paterno. You’ve clipped the references to Dr. Dranov and Dr. McQueary from the exchanges you have posted. Add deceitful and lying piece of shit to your amazing resume. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5910 "2012-12-12T23:35:17Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Kids are getting assfucked in the shower and you’re splitting hairs on the definition of mandated reporter? > ETA: sick fuck. Woah! You’re right! What the hell was I thinking? Here! Let me stop explaining what the law says! Whew! That was brutal! Oh, well! At least no kids are getting fucked in the ass now! How can I ever thank you? ETA: stupid fuck. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5911 "2012-12-12T23:40:46Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Oh, well! At least no kids are getting fucked in the ass now! Not at the PSU football showers, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5912 "2012-12-12T23:47:15Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Neither of the last two of those quotes from me were about Paterno. You’ve clipped the references to Dr. Dranov and Dr. McQueary from the exchanges you have posted. > > Add deceitful and lying piece of shit to your amazing resume. Oh, so a different set of Pennsylvania mandatory reporter laws (that just happens to say the same thing) applies to Dr. Dranov and Dr. McQueary than to Paterno, Curley and Schultz? Or do the laws as written apply only to whomever you happen to be talking about? :rolleyes: I think it’s pretty obvious who’s lying and (trying to be) deceitful here, chum(p). ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5913 "2012-12-13T00:03:40Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Oh, so a different set of Pennsylvania mandatory reporter laws (that just happens to say the same thing) applies to Dr. Dranov and Dr. McQueary than to Paterno, Curley and Schultz? > > Or do the laws as written apply only to whomever you happen to be talking about? :rolleyes: > > I think it’s pretty obvious who’s lying and (trying to be) deceitful here, chum(p). The same law applies to everyone. You look really stupid talking about things you don’t understand, even despite having them repeatedly explained. I told you before, all you have to do is read the last line regarding mandated reporters from your very own quote. Were Dranov or Dr. McQueary affiliated with Penn State? Or are you contending that Joe Paterno was not affiliated with Penn State? Is that your position? You’re so stupid, it just might be. It would be as defensible as your paper tube/anus level theory. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5914 "2012-12-13T00:23:00Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > ETA: stupid fuck. :rolleyes: Truth hurts, you piece of shit? ETA: I say that with all respect due to a pedophile apologist. We cool? ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5915 "2012-12-13T00:28:06Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > The same law applies to everyone. You look really stupid talking about things you don’t understand, even despite having them repeatedly explained. I told you before, all you have to do is read the last line regarding mandated reporters from your very own quote. > > Were Dranov or Dr. McQueary affiliated with Penn State? > > Or are you contending that Joe Paterno was not affiliated with Penn State? Is that your position? You’re so stupid, it just might be. It would be as defensible as your paper tube/anus level theory. Jesus, it’s like shooting stupid in a barrel. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5916 "2012-12-13T00:32:59Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > The same law applies to everyone. You look really stupid talking about things you don’t understand, even despite having them repeatedly explained. I told you before, all you have to do is read the last line regarding mandated reporters from your very own quote. And as I told you before, the last line is governed by the first line of the quoted text. Paterno did not, “in the course of his employment, occupation or practice of his profession, come into contact with children, nor did he have reasonable cause to suspect on the basis of his professional or other training or experience, that a child coming before him in his professional or official capacity is a victim of child abuse.” Therefore as a licensee of the “public or private institution, school, facility or agency” known as Penn State, he had no “standing on the basis of his professional training or experience,” nor as the result of “a child coming before him in his professional or official capacity as a victim of child abuse.” Therefore he had no legal standing to act as a mandated reporter and therefore the final line of the quoted text clearly does not apply to him. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5917 "2012-12-13T00:39:35Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Truth hurts, you piece of shit? I don’t know, you tell me. You’re the one who seems to think that kids would stop getting assfucked if I’d just stop quoting the law. > [@kayaker](#): > > ETA: I say that with all respect due to a pedophile apologist. We cool? As cool as we could be given that I’ve never apologized for any pedophiles and you can’t seem to think straight. Other than that, yeah, we cool. > [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > Jesus, it’s like shooting stupid in a barrel. Yeah, it is. Maybe I’ll aim at you next. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5918 "2012-12-13T00:43:45Z")
Ooooh, the “I know you are, but what am I?” defense. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5919 "2012-12-13T00:45:23Z")
What can I say? I play to the level of the room. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5920 "2012-12-13T00:46:45Z")
There it is again. Do “I’m rubber, you’re glue…” next! ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5921 "2012-12-13T00:55:06Z")
To be exact, neither of the insults I used and which you so richly deserve fit your description of them, I just played along with the first one because it was good straight man fodder. But now I’m getting bored so you’re gonna have to do better. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/5922 "2012-12-13T01:00:27Z")
Now you’re on to “Nuh uh!” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=295) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=297)