# It's time to officially Pit Joe Paterno and the Penn State football program. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 7, 2011, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167 "2011-11-07T14:23:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 334
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2016, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6663 "2016-07-14T01:32:30Z")
> [@Randolph](#): > > Hey, this thread’s starting to get weird. It got weird November of 2011. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2016, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6664 "2016-07-14T02:56:40Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > Welcome to the real world. This is what happens. All the fucking time. Yeah, how does this type of response “just not add up” for **anyone** who’s seen _Spotlight_, or read the Murphy Report or anything about the Boy Scout sex abuse cover-ups? _“I don’t want to hear about any of that kind of stuff”_ was not at all an uncommon attitude with regard to allegations of molestation before about a couple decades ago. Public recognition of and outrage about child sex abuse is a comparatively recent phenomenon (and is still by no means universal, despite having become much more widespread). Many people used to find it literally unthinkable. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2016, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6665 "2016-07-14T03:19:16Z")
Rape culture. It’s not just for girls anymore. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2016, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6666 "2016-07-14T09:13:10Z")
> [@faithfool](#): > > Rape culture. It’s not just for girls anymore. Some of us are well aware that it never was. ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2016, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6667 "2016-07-14T20:59:03Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > I gotta say…this didn’t sit well with me either. > > I was outraged when I saw some of the details but some of it…well something just don’t seem right. Right as in that doesn’t seem the way I expect people to behave. > > I can believe that one man, one lone guy, can witness an adult man sexually abusing a minor and only tell his boss, then keep quiet. But two men? Three men? From the rough and tumble gay-hating football culture, could witness with their own eyes a man sexually abusing a boy _in their own showers_ and do nothing? I would expect that they would beat Sandusky senseless before they had a chance to think about his relationship with Joe Pa. At the very least, one would have exclaimed “WHAT THE FUCK???” > > I ain’t saying it didn’t happen, but something is just not adding up for me. I think you’re confused. The “man” in the quote is the 2014 adult version of the 14 year old boy who had been assaulted in 1976. Not a witness like McQueary. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6668 "2016-07-17T14:40:36Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > Yes. > > The entire question here is about the strength of the evidence that “_Paterno was complicit and probably even enabling the Sandusky behavior_”. > > In your prior post you seemed to be assuming that the evidence against Sandusky can be automatically equated with evidence against Paterno. Not at all. You are twisting my words. Yes I am talking about that ‘entire question’ and to that is where I apply ‘where there’s smoke, there’s fire’ standard. Paterno had good reason to know that Sandusky was inappropriately touching boys. He chose to ignore the complaints. Paterno is a jerk. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6669 "2016-07-17T16:27:51Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Not at all. You are twisting my words. > > Yes I am talking about that ‘entire question’ and to that is where I apply ‘where there’s smoke, there’s fire’ standard. Paterno had good reason to know that Sandusky was inappropriately touching boys. He chose to ignore the complaints. Paterno is a jerk. [nitpick] Paterno _was_ a jerk. [/nitpick] ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6670 "2016-07-17T17:22:07Z")
Paterna was an accessory after the fact, or possibly, a criminal accomplice. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6671 "2016-07-18T06:03:59Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Paterna was an accessory after the fact, or possibly, a criminal accomplice. Accessory after the fact for some of the molestations, and an enabler of other future ones. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6672 "2016-07-18T13:45:53Z")
I’m thinking that dying was a handy move for Paterno, legally\*. Any lawyers can chime in, but I’d be surprised if he couldn’t have been charged. Maybe now, but probably even back when Sandusky was sentenced. \*Tongue in cheek. I kid my son that Jim Morrison and Kurt Cobain were smart enough to die before they became lounge singers in Vegas (in large white sequined jumpsuits)… ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6673 "2016-07-18T13:50:17Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Yes I am talking about that ‘entire question’ and to that is where I apply ‘where there’s smoke, there’s fire’ standard. Paterno had good reason to know that Sandusky was inappropriately touching boys. He chose to ignore the complaints. Paterno is a jerk. I don’t think that type of vague assessment is worth a whole lot - anything, really - especially coming from a guy who by his own admission came to that conclusion having “_not read a lot of the Paterno and Sandusky issue_”. YMMV, but I don’t think this is even worth arguing about. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6674 "2016-07-18T15:27:07Z")
We were discussing, right? Who’s arguing? Were you finding me argumentative? And we are not comparing research resumés on the topic, at least I am not. Words like “a lot” and “not a lot” are relative and subjective terms. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6675 "2016-07-18T19:15:12Z")
> [@digs](#): > > I’m thinking that dying was a handy move for Paterno, legally\*. Yeah. Everyone blamed it on the cancer but - was there an autopsy? Cancer is almost never that fast and convenient. Wiki says this: > [@](#): > > In November 2011, Scott Paterno reported that his father had a treatable form of lung cancer.[162] On January 13, 2012, Paterno was hospitalized in State College for complications relating to his cancer treatment, and he remained there until his death nine days later on January 22, 2012 But I’m starting to suspect that the “complication” was that he deliberately overdosed. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6676 "2016-07-18T20:06:53Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Yeah. Everyone blamed it on the cancer but - was there an autopsy? Cancer is almost never that fast and convenient. > > Wiki says this: > > But I’m starting to suspect that the “complication” was that he deliberately overdosed. Possibly, but my dad was diagnosed with lung cancer, and given, IIRC, 12 months. It seems like my brother called about every three days with a new, more dire prognosis, and he was dead inside a month. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6677 "2016-07-18T20:23:36Z")
Personally I think Sandusky murdered him. He knew that Paterno knew more than anyone about all his misdeeds over the years, and with his trial coming up he couldn’t afford to leave this key witness alive. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2016, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6678 "2016-07-18T20:31:21Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > Possibly, but my dad was diagnosed with lung cancer, and given, IIRC, 12 months. It seems like my brother called about every three days with a new, more dire prognosis, and he was dead inside a month. Yeah. It’s possible. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2016, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6679 "2016-07-19T10:07:46Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > But I’m starting to suspect that the “complication” was that he deliberately overdosed. Seems unlikely for a Catholic who was dying anyway. And cancer can be unpredictable, particularly when you pile that much stress on top of it. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2016, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6680 "2016-07-19T18:45:49Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Seems unlikely for a Catholic who was dying anyway. And cancer can be unpredictable, particularly when you pile that much stress on top of it. I’m just speculating of course. The part I quoted above said that Joe Jr. claimed the cancer was treatable, so he might not have thought off himself as dying. Who knows. OTOH, being a Catholic didn’t stop him from conniving at child molestation all those decades. Of course, the Catholic church in Pennsylvania was [also conniving its pants off](http://www.pennlive.com/news/2016/03/altoona_diocese_catholic_clerg.html) at the same time, so, well, who knows what he believed. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2016, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6681 "2016-07-19T19:20:49Z")
Well assuming that Sandusky didn’t murder him, my other theory is that he’s still alive, and the whole cancer thing was faked to enable him to get out of a sticky situation. I mean, what’s the likelihood that a guy gets diagnosed with cancer at the exact time that he’s facing a huge legal and PR crisis? I suspect he might be even now coaching another NCAA team under an assumed name. ---
**Author:** ![aag3981](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/53a042/32.png) [@aag3981](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aag3981)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2016, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/6682 "2016-07-20T00:31:53Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > Possibly, but my dad was diagnosed with lung cancer, and given, IIRC, 12 months. It seems like my brother called about every three days with a new, more dire prognosis, and he was dead inside a month. Same happened to my step dad. And Paterno also a crazy amount of stress from being fired and being accused of enabling a child molester. Sent from my HTC6525LVW using Tapatalk [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=333) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=335)