# It's time to officially Pit Joe Paterno and the Penn State football program. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 7, 2011, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167 "2011-11-07T14:23:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 61
**Author:** ![Bri2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/48db29/32.png) [@Bri2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bri2k)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1201 "2011-11-17T00:05:41Z")
It turns out the local judge that let Sandusky out on $100,000 unsecured bond has ties to Second Mile: [P-G story Judge did work at Sandusky’s non-profit prior to freeing him](http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11319/1189964-455.stm). The prosecution wanted $500,000 bond with electronic monitoring. Another article I saw said she’d also donated money to Second Mile, but I can’t find the link. Fortunately, that judge is gone and another one from outside Centre county is taking over: [P-G story Retired district judge assigned to Sandusky case](http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11320/1190368-100.stm). Also, Gov. Corbett approved a state grant to Second Mile: [P-G story $3 Million grant approved despite abuse investigation](http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11320/1190145-455-0.stm). This thing is turning out to be a cancer for everyone involved but the poor victims. Bri2k ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1202 "2011-11-17T15:41:43Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > I had asked before how McQueary came to the attention of the grand jury. > > [I guess you can find anything on the internet!](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/17/sports/ncaafootball/internet-posting-helped-sandusky-investigators.html?_r=2&pagewanted=1) That’s a great article. It clarifies a few points, and offers some information that hasn’t been written about in the media in the past few weeks. It specifies who came forward, how the prosecutors proceeded, and other things of that nature. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1203 "2011-11-17T16:52:18Z")
The [NY Times](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/17/sports/ncaafootball/lawyer-says-client-will-testify-to-severe-sexual-assault-in-sandusky-case.html?src=recg) also has a rebuttal to Sandusky’s lawyer’s claim that further investigation of the facts will lead victims to recant their stories. Of course, apparently he and Sandusky met at the Old(er) Dudes Who Bang Young People meetings, so he probably believed what he was saying at the time. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1204 "2011-11-17T17:03:04Z")
Also, both State College Police and Campus Police say [McQueary did not report anything in 2002](http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2011/11/17/sports/ncaafootball/AP-FBC-Penn-State-Abuse.html?pagewanted=1&ref=ncaafootball). Does anyone on this board currently live in that area? I am trying to imagine just how much of a clusterfuck Sandusky’s court appearance on December 7th is going to be. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1205 "2011-11-17T17:06:02Z")
> [@lorene](#): > > … Of course, apparently he and Sandusky met at the Old(er) Dudes Who Bang Young People meetings, so he probably believed what he was saying at the time. I would think that would mean he knew Sandusky was lying. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1206 "2011-11-17T17:06:59Z")
That definitely rebuts McQueary’s email. The thing that surprised me was that the local police say they don’t have jurisdiction on the Penn State campus. I don’t know if that’s common, but it doesn’t seem right. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1207 "2011-11-17T17:17:06Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > That definitely rebuts McQueary’s email. The thing that surprised me was that the local police say they don’t have jurisdiction on the Penn State campus. I don’t know if that’s common, but it doesn’t seem right. University Park (the actual name of the main campus) has its own police force. They’re actually recognized by the state as a separate city-police organization, as if the campus itself were a separate city from State College (the town the campus is set in). When you come right down to it, the campus is actually larger in area than State College proper. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1208 "2011-11-17T17:22:30Z")
> **[South Park ripped Penn State (video) - WWTDD - What Would Tyler Durden Do?](http://www.wwtdd.com/2011/11/south-park-ripped-penn-state-video/)** > > ‘South Park’ creators Trey Parker and Matt Stone have said that one huge advantage animation has over live action is that you can get things done much faster. It lets them be more topical. Like last nights episode about Kenny and Cartman going to a... ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1209 "2011-11-17T17:47:27Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > I had asked before how McQueary came to the attention of the grand jury. > > [I guess you can find anything on the internet!](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/17/sports/ncaafootball/internet-posting-helped-sandusky-investigators.html?_r=2&pagewanted=1) Thank you. Excellent account of the investigation. The amount of dirt surfacing is almost beyond belief. As is the fact that so far there’s nary a good apple in the whole bunch. * * * Here’s yet another damming article; this one speaks to what **Carmady** has been trying to purvey to **brickbacon** – good on him for trying I guess. I’ve given up on all of the apologists – namely that Penn State & The Second Mile were close to being one and the same: [**Patriot-News Special Report: The Second Mile and Penn State: Charity and university’s fates were tied together**](http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/11/patriot-news_special_report_th.html) > [@](#): > > \*\*The Penn State Nittany Lion mascot wore a Second Mile T-shirt. > > There’s no more striking image of the bond that existed between the university and the kid’s charity founded by Jerry Sandusky. > > \ > > The Second Mile and Penn State were locked in an embrace so tight that the fate of one inevitably impacts the other. > > The charity basked in the imprimatur of Penn State. Sandusky ran it at the same time he was the Nittany Lions’ greatest defensive coach. Joe Paterno served as master of ceremonies at its biggest fundraiser. Penn State players helped with fundraising. > > When Sandusky announced his retirement in 1999, saying he wanted to spend more time with The Second Mile, Paterno called him “a person of great character and integrity.” That’s all the validation many people needed.\*\* Words fail. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1210 "2011-11-17T17:54:53Z")
I just keep wondering when strippers, Al Sharpton, and one of Michael Jackson’s relatives are going to show up to class this whole thing up proper. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1211 "2011-11-17T18:01:18Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > This is all speculation. I think we can all recognize that absence some position giving him access to children, the number of victims would have been lower, but your supposition that the charity thrived on Penn State idolatry, and giving folks access to Penn State football is not really bourne out by the facts. Go to their [website](http://www.thesecondmile.org/aboutUs/history.php). Do you see a lot of mentions of Penn State, or football? Look at the events they have organized. Few of them are on PS campus. Also note they have offices in PA roughly 2 and 4 hours away from the main office. I don’t think they are wholly dependent on PS for anything. From a former Penn State Basketball player: > [@](#): > > A graduate of Penn State … > The shame that swept over Amaechi then is unlike anything he has ever felt toward his school. > "As he said ‘Penn State,’ there was an audible intake of breath from the room,‘’ said Amaechi, a former NBA player. "I had to scrap the entire beginning of my speech and explain. I feel ashamed, embarrassed and humiliated. I’ve been talking to former athletes from Penn State, and we were all involved in the Second Mile Program. We were roped into creating the respectable face of Second Mile. That makes me feel unwittingly complicit. We were the front of the house, and the front of the house hid the dark back of the house.‘’ From [this article.](http://www.herald-review.com/mobile/article_7e15c50a-0fa5-11e1-ac64-001cc4c002e0.html) ---
**Author:** ![Sinsaint](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@Sinsaint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinsaint)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1212 "2011-11-17T18:16:58Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > I just keep wondering when strippers, Al Sharpton, and one of Michael Jackson’s relatives are going to show up to class this whole thing up proper. None of the victims were African American so I doubt they have much interest in it. ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1213 "2011-11-17T19:04:39Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > That definitely rebuts McQueary’s email. Not necessarily. It only says that the police have no record of McQueary reporting a sexual assault. However, Ockham’s razor indicates that he most likely didn’t report it. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1214 "2011-11-17T19:11:10Z")
> [@Punoqllads](#): > > Not necessarily. It only says that the police have no record of McQueary reporting a sexual assault. However, Ockham’s razor indicates that he most likely didn’t report it. I didn’t say it completely proves him wrong- I agree it’s possible he reported it and the report was lost or destroyed. But we’re agreed the most likely explanation is that he was full of it. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1215 "2011-11-17T19:37:21Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Thank you. Excellent account of the investigation. The amount of dirt surfacing is almost beyond belief. As is the fact that so far there’s nary a good apple in the whole bunch. Yeah there is – the high school principal (or whatever layer of administration it was) who actually called the cops on Jerry Sandusky after the mother of victim #1 reported to him that her son had been abused. The thing that the excuse-makers are so eager to say couldn’t have been expected for Curley or Paterno or McQueary or any of them to do, somehow managed to get done. Must be a miracle or something. And, arguably also the prosecutors who kept digging after it looked like the victim #1 case alone might be difficult to prosecute. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1216 "2011-11-17T20:21:29Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](#): > > From a former Penn State Basketball player: I don’t agree with his conclusion, or his perspective on the issue, but I will cede the point since he was there. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1217 "2011-11-17T20:24:42Z")
I don’t blame any of the players or former players. If they want to assume guilt over the things they did when they had no idea about Sandusky, it’s their prerogative, but I can’t see that any of them have any culpability here. ---
**Author:** ![mnemosyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1218 "2011-11-17T20:35:52Z")
I think, in their shoes, I’d be thinking about all the interactions I’d had with Sandusky over the years and wondering _did I miss something? Could I have done anything to stop him? Did I know any of his victims?_ It’s normal, and understandable that they might try and blame themselves, but of course they bear no culpability. It’s just hard to believe that someone you trusted could be such a monster. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1219 "2011-11-17T20:39:50Z")
I agree. The guilt is unwarranted but entirely understandable given the circumstances. Just the idea of unwittingly helping… shudder. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1220 "2011-11-17T20:41:51Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > I don’t agree with his conclusion, or his perspective on the issue, but I will cede the point since he was there. How magnanimous of you to cede that point.:rolleyes: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=60) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=62)