# It's time to officially Pit Joe Paterno and the Penn State football program. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 7, 2011, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167 "2011-11-07T14:23:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 62
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1221 "2011-11-17T20:52:22Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I don’t blame any of the players or former players. If they want to assume guilt over the things they did when they had no idea about Sandusky, it’s their prerogative, but I can’t see that any of them have any culpability here. Is it possible that Amaechi’s feelings are merely a reaction, not a choice? I believe that his statement about feeling unwittingly complicit is an appropriate response. ---
**Author:** ![King\_Bobo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@King\_Bobo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/King_Bobo)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1222 "2011-11-17T22:29:38Z")
> [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > Yeah there is – the high school principal (or whatever layer of administration it was) who actually called the cops on Jerry Sandusky after the mother of victim #1 reported to him that her son had been abused. Before we get too lavish in our praise for ONE educator who did the right thing… the reports I’ve read say that the school asked the Mother to think if she wanted her son to go through with the charges and it was she who called CPS - not the school. The summation is in the GJ presentment. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1223 "2011-11-17T23:16:47Z")
> [@King\_Bobo](#): > > Before we get too lavish in our praise for ONE educator who did the right thing… the reports I’ve read say that the school asked the Mother to think if she wanted her son to go through with the charges and it was she who called CPS - not the school. > > The summation is in the GJ presentment. I read an interview with the Mom recently. She gave the impression that the high school just wanted her to fully understand what bringing charges would mean for her life, and the life of her son, going forward. In other words, they knew the media storm was coming and wanted to make sure she was okay with it. She was. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1224 "2011-11-17T23:28:17Z")
> [@Sinsaint](#): > > None of the victims were African American .. Really? How do you know this? ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2011, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1225 "2011-11-17T23:41:51Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > Really? How do you know this? [http://hypervocal.com/news/2011/sandusky-interview-backfires-emboldens-victims-to-testify-against-him/](http://hypervocal.com/news/2011/sandusky-interview-backfires-emboldens-victims-to-testify-against-him/) > [@](#): > > Investigators broke the case open after discovering that 1998 report. What they found when looking into Sandusky was a pattern of “grooming” behavior. He preyed on white boys, 8-12 years old, from broken homes. He plied them with gifts and trips. Innocent touching soon turned into overtly sexual play, which progressed to molestation and rape. Source for that characterization is unclear. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1226 "2011-11-18T00:08:09Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I didn’t say it completely proves him wrong- I agree it’s possible he reported it and the report was lost or destroyed. But we’re agreed the most likely explanation is that he was full of it. It’s just barely possible he thought that the administrators he had told would contact the police themselves, and therefore he now thinks he was responsible for the police being contacted. Or the police, being Pennsylvanians and PSU fans themselves, might have been part of it - all they did to Sandusky in 2002 was tell him, orally, not to shower with boys anymore. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1227 "2011-11-18T00:09:51Z")
> [@Sinsaint](#): > > None of the victims were African American so I doubt they have much interest in it. Even if they were, like in [the Red Sox clubhouse case](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/15/donald-fitzpatrick-red-sox-sex-scandal_n_1095118.html), that doesn’t mean they would have taken interest. What Red Sox case, you ask? Exactly. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1228 "2011-11-18T00:33:30Z")
> [@Sinsaint](#): > > None of the victims were African American so I doubt they have much interest in it. > [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > Really? How do you know this? Some are speculating just that: [What If The Sandusky Victims ARE Black?](http://sparethekids.com/2011/11/what-if-the-sandusky-victims-are-black/) > [@](#): > > Unconfirmed reports allege that former Penn State defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky chose black boys as his primary victims. The mainstream media’s use of the coded terms “underprivileged” and “at-risk” to describe the victims has rightly raised suspicions among black observers. A parent of one of the boys has said that Sandusky’s victims were “blacks about 10-12 and had a tall slim muscular build.” But the [NYT article](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/17/sports/ncaafootball/internet-posting-helped-sandusky-investigators.html?src=recg) cited upthread insinuates that indeed, the victims were white kids: > [@](#): > > …As additional suspected victims were located, a profile began to emerge, according to people with knowledge of the investigation. Sandusky engaged in what experts on child predators call “grooming” behavior, law enforcement officials asserted this month, making his first approach when children were 8 to 12 years old. **He tended to choose white boys from homes where there was no father or some difficulty in the family** , investigators said, and he drew them in with trips to games and expensive gifts like computers. However you have this new “gem” that may necessitate a new Pit thread of its own: [The Other Penn State Cover-Up: Death Threats Against Black Students](http://loop21.com/content/other-penn-state-cover-death-threats-against-black-students) > [@](#): > > As news unravels around the grand jury report revealing charges against former Penn State football defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky for raping and sexually molesting underage boys, some former black Penn State students are now painfully reliving a scandal that occurred at their university ten years ago. In 2000, the year a janitor witnessed a boy younger than 13 (“Victim 8” in a grand jury report) “pinned against a wall” while Sandusky performed oral sex on him, black students and football players on Penn State’s campus began receiving hate mail. > > The hate mail sent to black students had nothing to do with Sandusky’s proclivities, but the two incidences shared something in common: both were ultimately covered up by the university, even as both chain of events grew worse. > > \ > > LaKeisha Wolf was president of Penn State’s Black Caucus ten years ago, and she received the lion’s share of life-threatening letters. Today, she watches the news about Sandusky’s rape charges, the firing of Joe Paterno and Penn State president Graham Spanier, and the student riots that ensued, and it takes her right back to her days dealing with the university. > > In fact, Wolf and other concerned black students met with Paterno back in 2001 because of information circulating that black football players, like then-quarterback Rashard Casey, had been receiving death threats. Wolf recalls Paterno as almost emotionless. – much more at source, properly cited & linked. Beyond surreal if true. What the fuck else can come out of this scandal? > [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > Yeah there is – the high school principal (or whatever layer of administration it was) who actually called the cops on Jerry Sandusky after the mother of victim #1 reported to him that her son had been abused… Unfortunately, not so sure the mother totally agrees w/you: [Penn State Victim’s Mom Speaks](http://abcnews.go.com/US/penn-state-scandal-mother-victim-son-afraid-sandusky/story?id=14930219#.TsWcgbLKnzg) But yes, it appears that was the one person (persons?) that _finally_ got the cops involved. ---
**Author:** ![R.P.McMurphy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7993a0/32.png) [@R.P.McMurphy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R.P.McMurphy)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1229 "2011-11-18T03:59:58Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Some are speculating just that: [What If The Sandusky Victims ARE Black?](http://sparethekids.com/2011/11/what-if-the-sandusky-victims-are-black/) > > But the [NYT article](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/17/sports/ncaafootball/internet-posting-helped-sandusky-investigators.html?src=recg) cited upthread insinuates that indeed, the victims were white kids: > > However you have this new “gem” that may necessitate a new Pit thread of its own: > > [The Other Penn State Cover-Up: Death Threats Against Black Students](http://loop21.com/content/other-penn-state-cover-death-threats-against-black-students) > > – much more at source, properly cited & linked. > > Beyond surreal if true. What the fuck else can come out of this scandal? > > Unfortunately, not so sure the mother totally agrees w/you: [Penn State Victim’s Mom Speaks](http://abcnews.go.com/US/penn-state-scandal-mother-victim-son-afraid-sandusky/story?id=14930219#.TsWcgbLKnzg) > > But yes, it appears that was the one person (persons?) that _finally_ got the cops involved. Imagine: Fire alarm type sounds. “ **Code blue, code black, code red, code WTF.** ” Announcement:\*\* “THE PATIENT IS HEMORRHAGING. BRING LIFE SUPPORT.”\*\* Disclosure: When I posted the OP I had NO idea, as bad as I thought it was, that the scandal would get to this level. The Feds are going to have to get involved. There is evidence that Sandusky took minors across state lines for immoral purposes. The feds used the Mann Act [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mann\_Act](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mann_Act) on people that committed crimes that were less egregious than what Sandusky has allegedly done. The Mann Act has been used as recently as 2008. ---
**Author:** ![Sinsaint](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@Sinsaint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinsaint)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1230 "2011-11-18T13:13:52Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > Really? How do you know this? I know victim 1. He’s white. I’ve also read the article another poster cited about Sandusky’s pattern for choosing victims. Also, I remember a program I watched some time ago that said most (but not always) of the time in sexual abuse/assualt cases the perpetrator tends to choose victims of his own race. ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1231 "2011-11-18T13:23:32Z")
In other news, my office deli sells [these](http://pennstate.co.uk/home/). College football isn’t closely followed here in the UK, but I’ll still bet the company is debating if it should change the brand name… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1232 "2011-11-18T13:35:44Z")
> [@DragonAsh](#): > > In other news, my office deli sells [these](http://pennstate.co.uk/home/). > > College football isn’t closely followed here in the UK, but I’ll still bet the company is debating if it should change the brand name… Hmmm…yeah. I wonder if the campus Creamery is going to discontinue or rename the Peachy Paterno flavor? ETA: How (okay, WHY) does a UK pretzel maker use the Penn State name, anyway? Had you folks over there even HEARD of Penn State, as a university/football team/brand before this whole pedophile thing came out (other than those pretzels, anyway)? ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1233 "2011-11-18T13:43:41Z")
Now, it seems, 2 former ball boys are accusing Syracuse associate basketball head coach Bernie Fine of molesting them for years. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1234 "2011-11-18T14:05:52Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > ETA: How (okay, WHY) does a UK pretzel maker use the Penn State name, anyway? Had you folks over there even HEARD of Penn State, as a university/football team/brand before this whole pedophile thing came out (other than those pretzels, anyway)? I assume it doesn’t actually refer to the university. They probably mean Penn State in the sense of the State of Pennsylvania. Maybe a Pennsylvania Dutch thing? In other guilt by association, University of Pennsylvania (often referred to as Penn) is probably super pissed at Penn State as well. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1235 "2011-11-18T14:19:23Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > ETA: How (okay, WHY) does a UK pretzel maker use the Penn State name, anyway? Had you folks over there even HEARD of Penn State, as a university/football team/brand before this whole pedophile thing came out (other than those pretzels, anyway)? The state of Pennsylvania is justifiably famous for the quantity and quality of its snack food offerings. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1236 "2011-11-18T14:32:03Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > The state of Pennsylvania is justifiably famous for the quantity and quality of its snack food offerings. Okay, I’ll concede this, given that I live less than an hour from both Berlin and Hanover, of the respective Snyders, and grew up in Altoona, home of the original Benzel’s Bretzels factory. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1237 "2011-11-18T15:02:29Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > The state of Pennsylvania is justifiably famous for the quantity and quality of its snack food offerings. I grew up in the Reading area - we got Yuengling beer, Unique pretzels, Fifth Avenue candy bars…good stuff. But Penn State pretzels suck. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1238 "2011-11-18T19:04:22Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Okay, I’ll concede this, given that I live less than an hour from both Berlin and Hanover, of the respective Snyders, and grew up in Altoona, home of the original Benzel’s Bretzels factory. [http://www.utzsnacks.com/store/p-34-family-size-bags.aspx](http://www.utzsnacks.com/store/p-34-family-size-bags.aspx) ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1239 "2011-11-18T19:05:26Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > Now, it seems, 2 former ball boys are accusing Syracuse associate basketball head coach Bernie Fine of molesting them for years. Boeheim better hope he’s done his homework – he didn’t just deny the allegations on behalf of Fine, he repeatedly called the accusers “liars” yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167/1240 "2011-11-18T19:27:23Z")
> [@Huerta88](#): > > [http://www.utzsnacks.com/store/p-34-family-size-bags.aspx](http://www.utzsnacks.com/store/p-34-family-size-bags.aspx) :smack: Forgot about Utz! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=61) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/its-time-to-officially-pit-joe-paterno-and-the-penn-state-football-program/602167.md?page=63)