# Ivan **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 7, 2004, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540 "2004-09-07T21:08:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Bruce\_Daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Daddy)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/61 "2004-09-11T14:41:43Z")
> [@JillGat](#): > > I beg your pardon. Granted. > [@](#): > > Most people in Florida have some kind of insurance, or at least a govt. infrastructure that assures that they will get some support and aid. Yes, that makes it all better. > [@](#): > > It really sucks to be a Grenadian or, probably, a Jamaican, with Ivan in the Caribbean. Sorry, i don’t feel as sorry for Americans (even my father, who lives in West Palm Beach). That’s quite soulless, don’t you think? Americans don’t give a rat’s ass about you either, I suppose. > [@](#): > > These people in Grenada, Tobago, and soon probably Jamaica are being devastated by these storms. They are losing everything they have, facing disease epidemics, looters, and other challenges most Americans can’t even fathom. They are the ones who deserve our prayers and assistance. People in Grenada are looting themselves. This is our responsibility how? Florida will be hit by 3 major hurricanes in the span of weeks. I’m sorry you don’t share my compassion. Go start your own thread and quit hijacking mine. ---
**Author:** ![Dan\_Turk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dan\_Turk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dan_Turk)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/62 "2004-09-11T15:06:09Z")
^5 Bruce Daddy I’m awaiting the 11am update w/ pants-wetting anxiety :eek: ---
**Author:** ![JillGat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9fc29f/32.png) [@JillGat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JillGat)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/63 "2004-09-11T15:14:27Z")
I’m sorry, that did sound insensitive. Actually I _am_ an American living in the Caribbean. It’s terrible what Florida has experienced with one storm after another. Although, thankfully, there has been little loss of life, many people have lost everything and at the least have gone through real disruption and trauma in their lives. Insurance won’t change that. The reason I responded in the kneejerk way I did is that even in the international news, the potential damage of a hurricane often seems to be gauged only by whether it might hit the US and who cares about what it does elsewhere. I was offended when the weather reporters voiced relief that a storm skirted the US or weakened before it got there but didn’t think it was important to mention that several islands in the Caribbean had been destroyed. The wording they use - and I’m talking about American-based news that is broadcast internationally - often seems insensitive and clueless: “This storm is unlikely to be as strong when it hits land, so we are optimistic that it won’t be as dangerous to people.” (uh, it already hit land and took some lives, destroyed homes, ruined farms and flooded villages). There are People living in these islands, and many of them have no way to escape and have insecure, tenuous lives already. Floods can mean permanent loss of livelihoods and spread of disease - not just losing possessions. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard Americans say, after a hurricane flattened villages elsewhere but spared them, that “our prayers have been answered.” A Jamaican friend that had experienced the terror of Hurricane Gilbert said to me, “De American people dem, dey pray better dan us.” The looting that happened in Grenada could happen anywhere if people are desperate enough. It didn’t help that all the prison inmates escaped. If you don’t think this could happen in the US, or hasn’t already before, you’re in denial. I’ve watched people just stranded in the Chicago airport for the night turn into animals; taking blankets and sleeping spots away from elderly people, insulting parents who are trying to keep control of their kids, etc. I guess I would appreciate hearing American newspeople acknowledge that news happens elsewhere too, and affects real lives besides just theirs. I want to believe that Americans recognise that there are other people in the world and that they would care and be interested enough to want in-depth coverage of the aftermath of a hurricane in Dominican Republic, too. As for my father, I hate to tell you that he was disappointed that he didn’t get to go through a “real” hurricane. Sorry if I offended any Floridians. Carry on. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/64 "2004-09-11T15:31:05Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > Betsy (under historical hurricanes) actually went _backwards_ and hit Miami! We had the same experience back in '99 – Dennis came up along the coast and headed out to sea, and everyone breathed a sigh of relief. Then it stopped and effectively started a K-turn – backtracking along its path back to the coast, came inland and dumped scads of water on everyone (though the winds were down to tropical storm status or lower by then) and headed on across North Carolina to the mountains. The waterlogging we got from Dennis was principally responsible for how devastating Floyd was – the normal ability to drain off floodwater by absorption into the soil and backup into reservoirs and streams was already in use disposing of Dennis’s water delivery, so Floyd flooded everything. ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Bruce\_Daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Daddy)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/65 "2004-09-11T15:39:22Z")
**JillGat** , perhaps we read different news sources but all the news/weather sites I visit have heavy coverage of the damage inflicted on non-US places. [Hurricane Ivan Slams Into Jamaica, Looting Erupts](http://news.myway.com/top/article/id/425758%7Ctop%7C09-11-2004::00:47%7Creuters.html) \<- From [drudgereport.com](http://drudgereport.com), top of page [Category 4 Ivan slams Jamaica](http://www.cnn.com/2004/WEATHER/09/11/hurricane.ivan/index.html) \<- First story on [cnn.com](http://cnn.com) [Red Cross Launches Emergency Appeal for Victims of Hurricane Ivan …](http://www.voanews.com/article.cfm?objectID=0F5B1E9D-8C93-4939-85D6864D582252EB&title=Red%20Cross%20Launches%20Emergency%20Appeal%20for%20Victims%20of%20Hurricane%20Ivan%20in%20Grenada&catOID=45C9C78A-88AD-11D4-A57200A0CC5EE46C&categoryname=Americas) \<- 2nd link on [news.google.com](http://news.google.com) > [@](#): > > The International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies is launching an emergency appeal to assist thousands of people on the Caribbean island of Grenada, where Hurricane Ivan has left a trail of death and destruction. Official figures put the number of dead at 17 and casualties at around 150. The Red Cross says these figures are likely to rise. [Hurricane Ivan Pummels Jamaica; 39 Dead](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=3&u=/ap/20040911/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/hurricane_ivan) \<- 3rd story on [news.yahoo.com](http://news.yahoo.com) Anyway… It appears it’s aiming more for the [panhandle](http://www.wunderground.com/tropical/tracking/at200409_model.html), official guess is around [Tallahassee](http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/ftp/graphics/AT09/refresh/AL0904W5+GIF/111458W5.gif). Also supposed to [strengthen](http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/text/refresh/MIATCDAT4+shtml/111448.shtml?) and make landfall in the early morning hours of Tuesday? ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/66 "2004-09-11T16:59:14Z")
I hope the Tallydopers come through okay, but I hope you won’t mind as a I sigh with relief that it’s missing Orlando(ish) this time. Good luck, guys. Come south if you can. I think Disney will still be open. ---
**Author:** ![Poonther](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Poonther](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poonther)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/67 "2004-09-11T18:30:19Z")
As someone who is in the direct line of Ivan, I can say that I agree with what **JillGat** is saying about how the U.S. perceives things. Often times I’ve heard weather forecasters say something along the lines of “Good news the hurricane is going into Mexico.” :rolleyes: Hurricane Mitch hit Central America mainly Honduras and killed over 9,000 people just about 5 years ago, but you hardly ever hear anyone refer to him because it did not bother the USA. And if you think that looting does not occur in the USA or that we are above that sorta thing…let me tell you about a third world country called Miami-Dade. I was living in South Florida during Andrew and the looting was wild and rampant after Andrew. Looters even came to Palm Beach County (local radio said those arrested were from Miami and St. Pete) before and during Francis. As for Disney World being open “WHO GIVES A CRAP!” YMMV Don’t take your guard down too much Orlando and Tampa Bay. There is a front coming down from the North and these things love to scoop up a cane and slingshot it Northeasterly. If that happens in the middle Gulf, it’s your cane Central and North Central Florida. However, based on what I read the best chance of landfall of the eye is from Panama City Beach area to about Cedar Key. But base on the 11am forecast, Ivan will not be a 5 or even a strong 4 in this region, it will probably be a 3 or worst case a weak 4. That is still a mightly awful force to deal with especially in the tree city of Tallahassee. I am not going to leave Tally, but if I were, I’d head due west to Alabama or Mississippi (gambling in Biloxi would be nice) or head NW way into Alabama towards Montgomery or Birmingham. I would not head south or SE of here because an early turn (remember Francis) would still get you down that way. Half sunny/Half cloudy day here in Tally town. I see my neighbor has bought plywood for his house. Looks like we’ve got all day today, Sunday and most of Monday I think to get ready for this thing. But the track and intensity of the cane could greatly change before that. Here’s hoping that it will! I’ll see y’all late tonight or tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![XJETGIRLX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9fc29f/32.png) [@XJETGIRLX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XJETGIRLX)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/68 "2004-09-11T18:33:17Z")
[QUOTE=ivylass] I hope the Tallydopers come through okay, but I hope you won’t mind as a I sigh with relief that it’s missing Orlando(ish) this time.QUOTE] No, not at all **ivylass**. My SO is in Orlando and I’m glad they won’t be getting the brunt of it this time. They’ve got a 10’x6’ hole in their roof that still hasn’t been repaired, and I was worried sick about their whole roof being blown off if Ivan continued up their way. We’re boarding up some of the windows at my parents house today, I’ve been cutting plywood all morning. I’m hoping Ivan fizzles out before it gets here and falls apart like Francis did. It’s already looking like it’s going to slow down a bit. Glad you guys will get a reprieve down there this time! ---
**Author:** ![Monkeypants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Monkeypants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monkeypants)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/69 "2004-09-11T19:06:08Z")
I was supposed to be on vacation in Curacao from the 9th to the 14th. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/70 "2004-09-11T19:35:52Z")
Wow, I’m in one of the few parts of Florida that is completely out of the risk zone, lower East coast. Thank Christ, I had to sleep in my bathroom last weekend while wind lashed at my home and tore apart my patio. I didn’t need to do that again this weekend. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/71 "2004-09-11T20:25:51Z")
I’m sitting in Miami now, laid up in an old hotel downtown. On Thursday, when I was driving down, I called my new boss and he recommended that I journey back into Georgia. I contemplated his recommendation for a few minutes and realized that I couldn’t go back. First off, I couldn’t cancel my hotel reservation without forfeiting all of my little money. Second, the storm isn’t supposed to hit until Monday, and I wanted to get my bearings around town and go apartment hunting before I started work. A lot can happen in four days. So, after filling up on groceries and stuff, I decided to keep going down 1-95. And now I’m here, excited by the city and my new life. But I’m kinda scared too. On my way down, I heard all the horror stories from callers on the radio. People without electricity in 90 degree weather, caring for babies and for the elderly. I saw houses without roofs, downed trees, billboards missing panels, and whole subdivisions sitting in pitch blackness. Miami was pretty much untouched by Francis and Charley, but areas up north weren’t as fortunate. I want to give blood but I know they won’t take mine (darn anemia). I feel like such a stranger in this place (I don’t know anyone and I’m all alone), but I want to help somehow. Even though it seems like everyone in Miami is gruff and scary. ☹ 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Jurhael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/cab0a1/32.png) [@Jurhael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jurhael)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/72 "2004-09-11T23:58:44Z")
When I hear “Hurricane will hit Panama City”, I hear “Hurricane will hit Ft. Walton Beach.” I’m not too comforted at hearing that Ivan will weaken. It will still be a major storm that would probably flatten the Panhandle. ---
**Author:** ![XJETGIRLX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9fc29f/32.png) [@XJETGIRLX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XJETGIRLX)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2004, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/73 "2004-09-12T00:08:34Z")
> [@Jurhael](#): > > When I hear “Hurricane will hit Panama City”, I hear “Hurricane will hit Ft. Walton Beach.” Hey, I used to live in FWB! Yeah, forecasts now are putting it in around Appalachicola, so you guys will definitely feel it there. Here in Tally it looks like (yayfunwhoo) we’ll get the NE side of the storm. ---
**Author:** ![LilCutie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@LilCutie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LilCutie)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2004, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/74 "2004-09-12T16:00:52Z")
I am living in Tallahassee now because of school. However, my hometown is Panama City. So I couldn’t figure out which place would be better to go to. I don’t really have the option to travel outside of either place. I think I’ll just relax here in Tally and hope for the best! Be careful everyone! This season is so crazy. ---
**Author:** ![Poonther](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Poonther](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poonther)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2004, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/75 "2004-09-12T22:48:34Z")
Looks like the projected track of Ivan has been shifting to the west for the past 24 hours. As it appears on Sunday at 5pm, the best chance of landfall occurs between Tallahassee and New Orleans with the area from Pensacola to Apalachicola having the highest landfall probabilities. They are currently forecasting it to be a Cat 3 at landfall. This means those of you in the inland Panhandle and most of South and Central Alabama could get wet and wind blown too. Of course all of this is subject to change at any time. I feel the NHC will issue a Hurricane Watch late tomorrow at some point for all or most of the area between Tally and N.O. That part is just my educated guess and I’ve not read that ANYWHERE. But the good news that is that the Disney Empire will remain open!!! I’m sure all able bodied Floridians will sleep better now knowing they can continue to sell plastic dreams and make their millions! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Carcosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@Carcosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carcosa)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2004, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/76 "2004-09-13T01:04:05Z")
> [@Bruce\_Daddy](#): > > I’m gonna go out on a limb and say that it’s probably going to hit [Florida](http://www.boatus.com/hurricanes/hurricane_spaghetti2.asp) > > Call me crazy. I’m kind of partial to the track that takes it to Tampico. What’s the Vegas line on that one? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2004, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/77 "2004-09-13T06:15:24Z")
It’s not pointed at me. \ On the other hand, I wish all of you up Tally-way the best of luck- the last two were my first two, and they were no picnics. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2004, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/78 "2004-09-13T11:59:56Z")
Well, it could still come back this way, but I am totally mystified as to why all the local counties closed schools for today. It will be tomorrow, soonest, that anyone has any clue which way this things heads once it passes western Cuba and the Yucatan. I hope that people there are able to get to safety. In the meantime everybody that’s along the Gulf coast should pay attention and get ready to go if you need to. ---
**Author:** ![Carm6773](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/2bfe46/32.png) [@Carm6773](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carm6773)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2004, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/79 "2004-09-13T12:50:29Z")
> [@ShibbOleth](#): > > Well, it could still come back this way, but I am totally mystified as to why all the local counties closed schools for today. The decision was made on Friday, back when they thought Ivan would be here on Monday. Over the weekend he slowed down and went West. I’m assuming that since not a lot of people would have reported, they just left schools closed. Gives me an opportunity to get some stuff around the house, so that’s a good thing. I’m really hoping that FCAT gets postponed, since everyone has lost preparation days. ---
**Author:** ![whiterabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/cab0a1/32.png) [@whiterabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whiterabbit)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2004, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540/80 "2004-09-13T13:58:02Z")
I’m getting increasingly nervous here in New Orleans. [selfish side]I’m supposed to go out of town in a week! This better NOT HAPPEN![/selfish side] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ivan/263540.md?page=5)