# I've decided polygamy is an excellent way to raise a family **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 15, 2010, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218 "2010-10-15T05:53:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/381 "2010-10-21T07:00:03Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Still, it is good to see that the AUB is no FLDS, despite their former close association. And all it took was actually reading the available information. If you’d bothered in the first place, we could have avoided two pages and many days worth of this: > [@DrDeth](#): > > 100% of the heritic mormon cult poly families are like that, even tho they carefully **picked one that looks good on the surface**. > [@](#): > > So- Poly can work, if it is indeed a matter of free and informed choice. **It’s not that way in this family**. > [@](#): > > As has been pointed out to you several times, \*\*every wife \*\*in the family comes from a “ **mormon-cult-poly** ” background. Here what I said a couple pages ago-"No, actually **all** the Brown wives were raised in that \*\*repressive religious fanatic culture \*\*"From LA Times review: “…All three of the women were raised either in or surrounded by polygamist families " and as for the new wife” Robyn, … explains that although she grew up in a polygamist family… Apparently one of the wives- Janelle- was not part of a Poly family, but was raised in that cult and culture. Not every family in that cult is poly. " > [@](#): > > We have not been "blaming plural marriage itself ", we have been blaming **this particular coerced religous fanantic abusive culture.** There is plenty of reasons to make that leap. > [@](#): > > The main person here doing the “ignoring” is you. You are refusing to make this about Poly itself, but insist upon defending \*\*the coerced religous fanantic abusive culture whence this poor family comes from. \*\* > > Once you admit you’re wrong, **that this family, part of a coerced religous fanantic abusive culture** - is an extremey poor example to use to show that “polygamy is an excellent way to raise a family”, then you’d stop getting much of an argument. > > Stop defending **these abusive religous zealots** , and start defending Poly. > [@](#): > > There\*\* is scads of evidence outside\*\* that show that proves that **the coerced religous fanantic abusive culture they belong to** is nigh choiceless for the women. > [@](#): > > Thus, **we have proof that they are members of an abusive fanatic religious cult** , as all fundamentalist Mormon groups are abusive fanatic religious cults- to one extent or another. **The Browns group is related to the worst of the worst-** the FLDS. **We have provided you with tons of solid cites** which show that the FLDS is an undoubted abusive fanatic religious cult. > [@](#): > > Great site: > [http://www.rickross.com/groups/polygamy.html](http://www.rickross.com/groups/polygamy.html) > > Note the Brown’s Chruch is included. Yeah, I’ll be you wish you had actually read what it said before you tossed it in as proof of how the AUB is an coerced religous fanantic abusive culture. > [@](#): > > Except that the **wives were brought up in a poly religous cult environment,** where it’s been drummed into them from birth they this is the only way to live, that they must obey their husband, and having a divorce or leaving him means burning in hell forever. > [@](#): > > However, they still are part of a repressive religious fanatic culture. **That indeed is their faith and their culture**. Nor am I equating all plural marriages with communes, just the ones that are part of the various related semi-Mormon cults, as per my cites. In fact, if you’d read my posts, I agree there are a number of plural marriage that have nothing to do with a commune. However, even tho this one is carefully scripted,\*\* they are indeed, part of a repressive religious fanatic culture.\*\* > [@](#): > > Of course they are, but the ones that do so are **not members of a repressive religious fanatic culture, like the Browns are**. > [@](#): > > Outside the repressive religious fanatic culture, there are certainly happy and informed trios, etc. However, the show “Sister Wives” does not portray that lifestyle, but **instead that of the repressive religious fanatic culture - in this case, attempts have been made to conceal or sugarcoat it, but the hidden dark truth is still there**. > [@](#): > > **No, actually all the Brown wives were raised in that repressive religious fanatic culture** > [@](#): > > But the Browns are NOT part of the Mormon Church, aka The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), **and they ARE repressive religious fanatics.** ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/382 "2010-10-21T11:05:13Z")
You know, coercion can take a lot of different forms. How often on the dope have we seen people like\*\* Aanamika\*\* being asked countless times by aunties, her mother, her grandmothers, any random women in the appropriate community about 'When are you going to get married and start popping out children" and “you aren’t a real woman until you are married and have children” and “you need a husband, I know the perfect man” and even going ahead and setting up ‘accidental casual meetings’ with men … Unless you are female, you may not notice the pervasiveness of getting women to get married [single or plural] in a culture. Any time you go to a gathering - So when are you getting married/having a baby/having anther baby, s/he will grow up lonely without a little sprogling to keep it company, you need to give your \ a grand/child/neice/nephew/whatever sprogling. It can be seriously harassing to be on the recieving end of all this crap. How many threads have we had where the advice to the nosy old bats is to tell them NEVER or \ I cant have kids why are you asking me this… All of that is pressure to conform to the community norm. Get married, have sprogs, toe the line. It starts when we give the poor kid her first doll at chrismas, what do you think dolls and doll houses are? little tea sets, miniature kitchens … wife training. All the little brainwashing little games about what kind of husband you are going to have [doctor, lawyer, indian chief] little play irons and vacuum cleaners … So of course when some man comes a-courting, thoughts are going to turn to marriage, not just random fucking, all the cultural programming is marriage, bed, kids. In non-mormon society, married men don’t court women for marriage [they do for fucking but adultery is not what we are discussing here] so if the prospective wifeling was in non-mormon society, in say Newark NJ it would be a single guy courting her as his only wife. In mormon land, some random guy is courting her for wife #\. She is looking for that wedding ring, and culturally is pressured into getting married. Since the guy courting her is into plural marriage, she is getting ring #4 or 5 or 10 … ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/383 "2010-10-21T13:36:20Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I’ll give you what I like. Why are you afraid to answer the question? ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/384 "2010-10-21T13:42:15Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I’m really tired of this, although you haven’t been so much the perpetrator. I was just wondering if you were getting the implications of what you are talking about, as it applies to the polygamists. ---
**Author:** ![Telcontar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Telcontar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telcontar)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/385 "2010-10-21T15:17:01Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Nice try. Age of consent to sex, so if the state says a 14 year old can say yes to sex, who the hell are you to say she can’t? And that’s what we’re talking about: sex. And you claimed there was a bright legal line, and you were wrong. Until the age of majority, parents have the legal right to restrict who their children see, up to and including filing restraining orders on their behalf in some cases. I’m less than certain that the age is always 18, however (it may actually be higher in places). ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/386 "2010-10-21T15:59:50Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > And all it took was actually reading the available information. If you’d bothered in the first place, we could have avoided two pages and many days worth of this: > Yeah, I’ll be you wish you had actually read what it said before you tossed it in as proof of how the AUB is an coerced religous fanantic abusive culture. Actually, I had read about the AUB but like I said- there’s little info about it, and you found few new facts about it, just a lot of statements and press releases by the AUB. The AUB is still a coerced religous fanantic abusive culture. However, they don’t live in a compound like the FLDS, and they claim they don’t allow child-wives. They openly admit they violate the bigamy laws, and are reported to practice widespread welfare fraud. So, to go over your quotes from my posts: 1. _100% of the heritic mormon cult poly families are like that, even tho they carefully picked one that looks good on the surface_. Still true. 2.\* As has been pointed out to you several times, every wife in the family comes from a “mormon-cult-poly” background. Here what I said a couple pages ago-"No, actually all the Brown wives were raised in that repressive religious fanatic culture …\* still true. 3.\*We have not been "blaming plural marriage itself ", we have been blaming this particular coerced religous fanantic abusive culture. \* still true. 4.5, 6, 7, etc- all still true. 2. \*The Browns group is related to the worst of the worst- the FLDS. We have provided you with tons of solid cites which show that the FLDS is an undoubted abusive fanatic religious cult. \* Still true, The AUC has recently distanced itself from the FLDS, however. The AUC is “related to” the FLDS. 3. \*Except that the wives were brought up in a poly religous cult environment, \* Still true. 10- \*No, actually all the Brown wives were raised in that repressive religious fanatic culture \*. Still true. 11.\* But the Browns are NOT part of the Mormon Church, aka The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), and they ARE repressive religious fanatics. \* Still true. All that is new is that the AUC has denounced the practice of child-wives, and there are no allegations they practice otherwise. Do note that the AUC statements about child-wives makes it pretty clear that said pracitce is thus fairly common in the other “fundy-mormon-cults”. AND, also that even though the two Churchs are related, the AUC has publicaly separated themselves from the FLDS leadership. Kudos for that. Come on, Stoid, just becuase they don’t practice “child-wives” and they don;t live in a walled compound- does that then clear them of being a abusive fanatic religious cult? They raise their families in small closed communities. The leader makes the decisions. He sends the “wives” out to apply for fraudulent welfare, then makes them bring the illgeal gains back to him. He openly condones the felony of bigamy. He makes the decisions are to who will do what, who will marry whom, and etc. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/387 "2010-10-21T17:15:43Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Why are you afraid to answer the question? I did answer it. You just don’t like the answer. Oh well. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/388 "2010-10-21T17:20:22Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I did answer it. You just don’t like the answer. Oh well. Even my high school debate team members know what a non answer is. “I DO WHAT I WANT!!!111!!!” is not an answer to a question. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/389 "2010-10-21T17:32:37Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I did answer it. You just don’t like the answer. No you didn’t. You’re just running away from it. Why so gutless? ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/390 "2010-10-21T17:33:23Z")
First, you say this: > [@DrDeth](#): > > Actually, I had read about the AUB but like I said- there’s little info about it, Then you immediately say this: > [@](#): > > The AUB is still a coerced religous fanantic abusive culture. You acknowledge there is little info, yet you continue to insist that you know for sure that they are a coerced fanatic abusive culture. Well, you are certainly entitled to believe whatever you like, including believing in little green men. But if you want to sell me on it, you’ll have to come up with something resembling actual evidence, not just your conviction. Cuz you know, people can be passionately convinced that a lot of things are true without evidence, starting with religion itself. But here we are at almost 400 posts and no one has brought any evidence at all for the things you assert, it just boils down to “Well, yeah, that’s what it looks like, that’s what they say, that’s all we know…but I don’t believe it, and because I don’t believe it, it must not be true, and anyone who does believe it is a fool.” So you can have your beliefs. But that’s all they are. Trying to convince me that they are right based on the fact that you believe them is like trying to convince me that Joseph Smith found golden plates in a weird language describing Jesus Christ’s visit to the Americas and I should believe it because you do. If you ever have actual information to back up your beliefs, I’m more than happy to take it in. Til then, appearances and information are pretty much in agreement about the Browns. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/391 "2010-10-21T17:35:45Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > Even my high school debate team members know what a non answer is. “I DO WHAT I WANT!!!111!!!” is not an answer to a question. And that wasn’t my answer to the question. That was my answer to Dio saying he didn’t like my answer and he wanted a different one. (Because it gives him a way to divert attention from the fact that I’ve shown that his relentless assertions about the Browns and their church are bullshit.) ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/392 "2010-10-21T17:36:52Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > No you didn’t. You’re just running away from it. Why so gutless? I’m not a person with a penis, Dio, that stuff doesn’t work on me. I answered the question, you don’t like it, now you have something to obsess over. See how nice I am to you? ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/393 "2010-10-21T17:43:53Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > And that wasn’t my answer to the question. That was my answer to Dio saying he didn’t like my answer and he wanted a different one. (Because it gives him a way to divert attention from the fact that I’ve shown that his relentless assertions about the Browns and their church are bullshit.) Let me say to you the exact same thing I say to my little 14 year olds when I’m teaching them how to competitively debate (and I’ve got this shit down pat, since I have to say it all the time): You know, just as well as I do, that you are intentionally being obtuse. While you’re certainly within your right to do that, such actions don’t bode well for both your position in the debate and your skill as a debater. Responses like the one you just gave are cop outs and an over all sign of shakiness if not flat out weakness in your position-- just like an ad hominem attack would be. Because I know you are a better debater than that, I’d suggest you don’t sink to such poor tactics, particularly if you’d like to come out on top in any argument. A good debater can answer a question without resorting to being intentionally obtuse. You’re a good debater. Prove me right. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/394 "2010-10-21T18:00:26Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > Because I know you are a better debater than that, … You’re a good debater. Prove me right. First. Thank you for the acknowledgement, very genuinely appreciated. Second, read post 374. I answered the question, and I did so truthfully. Third, Dio is not a good debater. He does not argue respectfully or honestly and I can’t remember any time in recent memory when he even tried to bring in a reasonably sourced fact, and he likes to make things personal when he feels like he’s losing ground. That’s what he’s doing with this question. Fourth, because I don’t respect his behavior, I don’t feel the slightest obligation to respond to his demands, especially since I don’t believe his purpose is to shed light on this discussion, but to make me uncomfortable. I’m not uncomfortable with my answer to that or anything else, so I have no intention of defending it for Dio’s entertainment. He hasn’t earned that. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/395 "2010-10-21T18:03:36Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I’m not a person with a penis, Dio, that stuff doesn’t work on me. > > I answered the question. You did not answer the question. It is flatly dishonest for you to continue to say you did. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/396 "2010-10-21T18:08:23Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > > [@DrDeth](#): > > > > They have seemingly picked this family- and perhaps Kody was even “volunteered”- for that very reason. This is not a typical “mormon fundy” family- the wives aren’t all wearing gingham, they aren’t all living in a compound, **there’s no apparent incest and certainly no pedophilia evident**. It’s as “normal” as a “mormon fundy” poly family can be. I think the idea was to try to get a somewhat “normal” family out there to fight the very poor (and well deserved) PR rep the “mormon fundy” folks got due to those raids and stuff. > > Cite that incest and pedophilia are typical of “mormon” families, please? **Moderator Note:** **Skald** , you’ve been here long enough to know that it’s against the rules to change another post when you quote it, and that includes bolding on your part without the requisite disclaimer. Don’t do this again. For the Straight Dope **Spectre of Pithecanthropus** ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/397 "2010-10-21T18:08:42Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > First. Thank you for the acknowledgement, very genuinely appreciated. > > Second, read post 374. I answered the question, and I did so truthfully. No you didn’t. You (erroneously) said it was legal in Hawaii, which is not an answer to the specific question I asked, which I will repeat: Do you personally believe it is EVER morally acceptable for a 40 year old to fuck a 14 year old, yes or no? > [@](#): > > Third, Dio is not a good debater. He does not argue respectfully or honestly and I can’t remember any time in recent memory when he even tried to bring in a reasonably sourced fact, and he likes to make things personal when he feels like he’s losing ground. That’s what he’s doing with this question. > > Fourth, because I don’t respect his behavior, I don’t feel the slightest obligation to respond to his demands, especially since I don’t believe his purpose is to shed light on this discussion, but to make me uncomfortable. I’m not uncomfortable with my answer to that or anything else, so I have no intention of defending it for Dio’s entertainment. He hasn’t earned that. These are simply evasive tactics, ad hominems and bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/398 "2010-10-21T18:21:44Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > No you didn’t. I answered your question in post #374. Read it again. Or continue to pretend I didn’t answer you, I don’t really care. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/399 "2010-10-21T18:23:55Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I answered your question in post #374. Read it again. Or continue to pretend I didn’t answer you, I don’t really care. See, there’s that obtuse thing. He didn’t ask you what the law says, he asked you if you think it’s _morally_ right. That you did not answer. And he is right: like I tell my little students, even if you have zero respect for your opponent and think they are the worst, dumbest person ever in the whole wide world. . . you don’t show that in your debate. You approach all opponents the same way, with the same facts, with the same persuasive techniques. If you don’t, it’s not your opponent who suffers for it. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218/400 "2010-10-21T18:34:42Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > See, there’s that obtuse thing. He didn’t ask you what the law says, he asked you if you think it’s _morally_ right. That you did not answer. Yes, I did. Read it again. Don’t scan it. READ it. I answered his question directly and truthfully. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ive-decided-polygamy-is-an-excellent-way-to-raise-a-family/557218.md?page=21)