# Jackals of the Dope, I pit you! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 11, 2007, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708 "2007-04-11T22:11:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/401 "2007-04-14T05:35:56Z")
[QUOTE=shamrock227] \ **Auto** , what the hell is that? [/QUOTE] I not equal GQ..err.. QG (Quiddity Glomfuster). The past few posts I’ve been accidentally butchering his name worse and worse. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/402 "2007-04-14T05:38:21Z")
Out of all those posts that **Auto** used as examples, I mainly see name-calling (something done out of anger and not usually what _I_ would take as more than junior high level intent-to-wound – or in other words, not that big of a deal), quasi-gloating/preening (of the “How dare you!? I’d never even _dream_ of doing such a thing!”) and hoping to instill fear (by showing how easy it is to be outed, etc.), as well as one of those heart-stopping moments that would encourage you to quit your awful (or whatever) behavior. Only one of those came across as potentially too vicious. Where they mean? Yeah. Not nice? That also. Par for the pit? Exactly. Does that mean it should be changed? I don’t think so, that’s specifically what it’s here for. And although I was somewhat joking with my first post to this thread, truly, if you’d like it to be a kinder and gentler place around these parts, then let things begin with you. I try not to be a petty bitch and I assume that’s my only responsibility. I can’t make anyone else do anything other than what they choose. Nor would I want to because that’s up to them. As for the four hypotheticals that have recently been listed, I still don’t quite see them as over-the-line either. I don’t particularly like that last one, but at the same time, I can’t take it seriously. Since I don’t always have a window to the wider world, one might argue this place means too much to me and they’d be right. However, at the end of the day, one must consider where the feedback comes from. If you respect that person than paying attention may serve you well. If not, noticing the source could also keep your sanity in tact. Oh, and **Ellis Dee** , I hope now you understand where I was coming from. I honestly just wanted to help. In addition to that, I must thank **QG** and **Klaatu** for taking a look-see at my offerings. I always like to have an open mind regarding how I come across to others. Not just as proof of how _not_ to act. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/403 "2007-04-14T05:38:51Z")
[QUOTE=Autolycus] I not equal GQ..err.. QG (Quiddity Glomfuster). The past few posts I’ve been accidentally butchering his name worse and worse. [/QUOTE] Not to mention QG is female. Get yer shit straight man. ---
**Author:** ![shamrock227](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@shamrock227](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shamrock227)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/404 "2007-04-14T05:41:24Z")
[QUOTE=Autolycus] I not equal GQ..err.. QG (Quiddity Glomfuster). The past few posts I’ve been accidentally butchering his name worse and worse. [/QUOTE] Thanks. Sorry, guess I should have been able to figure that out. (to be honest I thought it might have been a emote I wasn’t familiar with so I was tilting my head in every conceivable direction trying to figure out what I was missing. :rolleyes: ) ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/405 "2007-04-14T05:41:25Z")
[QUOTE=Klaatu] Not to mention QG is female. Get yer shit straight man. [/QUOTE] Fucking hell. Can I quit this thread now? :smack: 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/406 "2007-04-14T05:43:22Z")
[QUOTE=Autolycus] Fucking hell. Can I quit this thread now? :smack: 😛 [/QUOTE] No one here gets out alive. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/407 "2007-04-14T05:46:20Z")
[QUOTE=featherlou] No one here gets out alive. [/QUOTE] Well then, can we at least nuke it from orbit? You know, just to be sure? ---
**Author:** ![Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heffalump_and_roo/32/7691_2.png) [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heffalump_and_Roo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/408 "2007-04-14T06:00:12Z")
[QUOTE=Rubystreak] But it’s the price you pay for all the good advice, for the attention, for the opportunity to vent. But again, forget it Jake. It’s fucking Chinatown. [/QUOTE] Of course you’re right. It is what it is. But she paid a pretty steep price for this advice, attention and opportunity to vent. Now if she had started this in the Pit, I’d have to say that she deserved whatever she got. But she started it in IMHO and someone dragged her in the Pit. If she had started it in MPSIMS, from what I’ve seen, she’d have at least a small chance that she’d get the same advice without all the vitriol. One of the concerns that I have about all of this is that it just takes people’s feelings underground. Perhaps a message board is not a good place to air all of your feelings, but there’s a sense of support in MPSIMS that would be squelched if no one was honest or spoke honestly about their feelings. I hope that sense of openness and support doesn’t go away because people are too afraid to say anything on the chance that they might get dragged into the Pit and stoned. ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/409 "2007-04-14T06:04:58Z")
I don’t see how even the sweetness and light of MPSIMS would support a woman with two young kids posting gleefully about having an affair, but then again, I don’t frequent MPSIMS. eta As I said upthread, she knew damn well it would end up in the Pit. Come on, she’s been here seven years. Even if she didn’t get “dragged”, do you think that kind of OP would stay in IMHO, especially with the perceived attitude on her part? ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/410 "2007-04-14T06:24:28Z")
[QUOTE=Heffalump and Roo] Of course you’re right. It is what it is. But she paid a pretty steep price for this advice, attention and opportunity to vent. [/quote] I think it’s small potatoes next to the price she’s going to have to pay IRL. In fact, it reflects that price in a meaningful way. > [@](#): > > Now if she had started this in the Pit, I’d have to say that she deserved whatever she got. But she started it in IMHO and someone dragged her in the Pit. If she had started it in MPSIMS, from what I’ve seen, she’d have at least a small chance that she’d get the same advice without all the vitriol. First, no one dragged her anywhere. This is not RL, where a crowd of people was literally standing around her, taunting her, shouting things, holding her captive and forcing her to listen to a lot of abuse. She chose to enter that thread and respond, often throwing gasoline on the flames, IMO. There are ways she could have dealt with the Pit thread that would have diminished or defused the pile-on but did not. Let’s not turn her into a blameless, choiceless victim here. She was aware of the audience she was playing to and complicit in what happened in that Pit thread. To absolve her of responsiblity here and place all of it on the Dopers is making excuses for her. She’s a big girl. The MPSIMS thread could have gone on. However, it was a solicitation for help/advice. When you do that, you have to accept what you get, and in a situation like this, it’s not going to be nice. If Miz Grand were so divorced from reality that she thought it would be, then maybe a 12 page smack-down was a good tonic for that delusion and a prep for the RL reactions she might get if the situation blew up. NOTE: I am not condoning the pointless meanness. I’m just saying, who really couldn’t see that coming, all the way from the OP in MPSIMS? > [@](#): > > One of the concerns that I have about all of this is that it just takes people’s feelings underground. Perhaps a message board is not a good place to air all of your feelings, but there’s a sense of support in MPSIMS that would be squelched if no one was honest or spoke honestly about their feelings. I hope that sense of openness and support doesn’t go away because people are too afraid to say anything on the chance that they might get dragged into the Pit and stoned. She was not dragged into the Pit and stoned. I think that’s an unfair characterization and god, I wish people would stop distorting what happened. I concur with featherlou that she actually got off easy. The signal to noise ratio on that thread was above average for a Pit thread that heated, IMO. I’ve seen worse get dished out for less. How could people “support” her, really? What she was doing was wrong. The only way to support her was to give her a reality check and some advice. Some did it nicely, some harshly, some downright cruelly, but all were opinions _she solicited_ and continued to egg on. I really don’t see how it could have gone much differently unless it took place in a perfect world, which this ain’t. You want to vent on topics and not provoke criticism? Get a livejournal and make it friends only. That’s the only way to guarantee responses you like from nice people. This is a messageboard teeming with thousands of people. You pays your money and you takes your chances. Human nature is what it is, and the Pit is what it is. Whining about it and wagging your finger is only going to piss people off. It’s not going to change shit and it’s a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/411 "2007-04-14T07:05:19Z")
**Starving Artist** , a review of two rules of SD logic: 1, If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck, it’s probably a duck. 2. If it claims to be a woman, but looks like a duck and walks like a duck, see Rule #1. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/412 "2007-04-14T07:13:22Z")
[QUOTE=Zoe] **Starving Artist** , a review of two rules of SD logic: 1, If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck, it’s probably a duck. 2. If it claims to be a woman, but looks like a duck and walks like a duck, see Rule #1. [/QUOTE] And it probably got run over in a parking lot near LilShieste’s house. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/413 "2007-04-14T07:15:40Z")
[QUOTE=Zoe] **Starving Artist** , a review of two rules of SD logic: [/QUOTE] Steely Dan logic? Oh, yeah, _Pretzel Logic_! Damn good album. 😛 (As you can see, I’ve been trying to keep my word and stay out of here, even though Rubystreak, et. al have my eyes rolling like cherrys in a slot machine. Still, it’s always good to hear from you. Cheers, dear.) 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heffalump_and_roo/32/7691_2.png) [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heffalump_and_Roo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/414 "2007-04-14T07:17:53Z")
[QUOTE=Rubystreak] I think it’s small potatoes next to the price she’s going to have to pay IRL. In fact, it reflects that price in a meaningful way. [/quote] I don’t share your crystal ball. I can’t say that I _know_ what’s going to happen to her in real life. The probabilities of a good outcome are not good if she continued down her present path, but it’s not a foregone conclusion either. > [@Rubystreak](#): > > Human nature is what it is, and the Pit is what it is. Whining about it and wagging your finger is only going to piss people off. It’s not going to change shit and it’s a waste of time. As you say, the Pit is what it is. Whining and wagging fingers is what happens here, whether it changes anything and wastes time or not. I like to think, though, that sometimes awareness brings change. You seem pretty hopeful that some of the recipients of these Pit roastings gain some understanding. I like to think that Pit citizens are just as capable of change and self-awareness. And no, this is certainly not a perfect world, but saying that doesn’t mean that I give up trying to influence my little piece of it to the best of my ability. ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/415 "2007-04-14T07:26:16Z")
[QUOTE=Starving Artist] Steely Dan logic? Oh, yeah, _Pretzel Logic_! Damn good album. 😛 (As you can see, I’ve been trying to keep my word and stay out of here, even though Rubystreak, et. al have my eyes rolling like cherrys in a slot machine. Still, it’s always good to hear from you. Cheers, dear.) 🙂 [/QUOTE] Drink some more of that Turkey 101 dude. And give me a shot too. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/416 "2007-04-14T07:30:22Z")
[QUOTE=Heffalump and Roo] I don’t share your crystal ball. I can’t say that I _know_ what’s going to happen to her in real life. The probabilities of a good outcome are not good if she continued down her present path, but it’s not a foregone conclusion either. [/quote] People reacted based on the course of action she said she wished to take. Based on that, I think her future is going to be fraught with trouble. Maybe she has made positive changes based on advice she received. If that’s so then the Pit thread was a good thing, not a pack of jackals. > [@](#): > > I like to think, though, that sometimes awareness brings change. You seem pretty hopeful that some of the recipients of these Pit roastings gain some understanding. I like to think that Pit citizens are just as capable of change and self-awareness. Sure. Which is why I asked for cites, so the rest of us can gain understanding of what behaviors are considered over the top, and maybe change, or maybe not. > [@](#): > > And no, this is certainly not a perfect world, but saying that doesn’t mean that I give up trying to influence my little piece of it to the best of my ability. As long as you do it productively, I’m sure you’ll be fine. ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/417 "2007-04-14T07:36:52Z")
I really don’t thing we need to drag up cites from that thread into this thread…Hello! duh… This thread is already fading away, as it should. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/418 "2007-04-14T07:37:38Z")
> [@Klaatu](#): > > Drink some more of that Turkey 101 dude. And give me a shot too. 😛 Already there, my friend. Here, have a shot. And I’m reading _The Testament_ this evening but I’ve finished _The Firm_, so here…enjoy it too. Cheers. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heffalump_and_roo/32/7691_2.png) [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heffalump_and_Roo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/419 "2007-04-14T07:39:55Z")
[QUOTE=Rubystreak] People reacted based on the course of action she said she wished to take. Based on that, I think her future is going to be fraught with trouble. Maybe she has made positive changes based on advice she received. If that’s so then the Pit thread was a good thing, not a pack of jackals. [/QUOTE] If the Pit thread helped, it was probably in spite of the “jackals”, not because of them, although I can’t know that for sure. I’ll just say that they wouldn’t have helped me. . . that’s for sure. And with that, I’m off to bed. Last one in, shut off the lights! ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2007, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708/420 "2007-04-14T07:41:57Z")
[QUOTE=Starving Artist] Already there, my friend. Here, have a shot. And I’m reading _The Testament_ this evening but I’ve finished _The Firm_, so here…enjoy it too. Cheers. 🙂 [/QUOTE] Much obliged. I have already read both books ten times though. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jackals-of-the-dope-i-pit-you/399708.md?page=22)