# James Randi and Dry Spots **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 13, 2004, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926 "2004-10-13T01:46:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/361 "2004-11-19T01:05:04Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#): > > > [@Princhester](#): > > > > I’m not going to debate you in Private Messaging for two reasons. > > He refused to accept any private messages from me. Words nearly fail me. You cannot, _cannot_ logically consider these two things to mean the same thing. There are two possibilities. You have absolutely no ability to comprehend the english language. Alternatively, you are a lying weasel who would baldly state that black was white in some desperate, doomed and stupid attempt not to lose face. You can clearly comprehend english when you want to. Ergo, option two. As if I didn’t know that already. > [@](#): > > Then, a few days later, he spews out abuse at me for not responding to his private message. He didn’t want me to send him a private message, and that’s what he got. But he blames me for what he demanded. The lack of thanks was trivial. I’m not that desperate for praise. The abuse was for calling me a moron (remember that now, or given that it is more than 24 hours since I last quoted you calling me a moron you can no longer remember doing so, Mr Goldfish?) in circumstances where in the last few days I had been very polite and quite helpful to you, as you have admitted. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/362 "2004-11-19T01:52:10Z")
All this stuff about posting on GQ only fuelling hate and subjecting you to abuse is utterly disingenous drivel. You know damn well no one can abuse you in GQ. You are just embarrassed to be publically seen to be indulging your anti-Randi obsession. > [@Peter Morris](#): > > No matter how often you deny it, I made it clear from the very start that Princhester refused any further private messages from me. > > No matter how often you quote me with that bit snipped, no matter how often you add things that I never said, you won’t alter the fact that I specified private messages, and meant private messages. No you did not. > [@Peter Morris](#): > > There were a couple of points where I’d have liked some further clarification - but you refused to accept any more questions from me. There is no specification of PM. I am forced to repeat myself: What the fuck were you thinking? Did you know you’d said what you said you hadn’t but hoped I wouldn’t remember? Were you playing up to an audience of lurkers hoping I wouldn’t quote you? Or do you actually not remember what you’ve done from minute to minute? Or perhaps you have such a capacity for cognitive dissonance that you can (in one and the same mind) do something while believing you haven’t done it? I mean what the fuck is going on? In all seriousness Peter, are you mentally the full box? Over on the Randi boards, CFLarsen started a thread about those that lie while knowing that the person they are lying to knows they are lying. He mentions a few examples, you amongst them. Most of his examples are of professional liars (John Edward, Silvia Browne etc). When they lie to those who know they are lying, they are usually doing so because they are playing up to an audience who do not know they are lying, and they need to do so to be able to keep up the illusion from which they earn their living. What’s your story though, Peter? You _must_ have known I had only said I wouldn’t debate you. You _must_ have known you hadn’t specified private messaging. You _must_ also have known that I would know you were lying. You must also have known that (going by my past behaviour), I _would_ call you on it, and I _would_ quote so that you were shown unarguably to be a liar. Are you a masochist? Do you enjoy being made to look a cad and a fool? Are you an optimist who actually thinks “this time, against all real hope, I’m going to get away with a lie”? Or are you a stupid obnoxious egotist who can never, never admit they are wrong or lose face and so is doomed to commit themselves to ever bigger lies in order to have something to say to justify the previous ones? ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/363 "2004-11-19T01:58:27Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > And that’s a major flaw in your debating technique. You find a tenuous reason to apply a label (surely someone can express admiration for something Randi said without necessarily feeling admiration for Randi himself) then use that label disparagingly in an attempt to discredit. Heck, I despise the concept of Marxism, but I’ve no doubt Marx made the occasional _bon mot._ Bryan, what exactly do you want me to say? Just take someone like Princhester. He has several of Randi’s books, which he’s always willing to quote from. He cites Randi’s test as evidence against all paranormal phenomena. He cannot bear the thought of Randi being wrong on anything. When I point out a factual error Randi has made, Princhester attempts to discredit the notion, by searching for anything else Randi might have meant by the words he said. \*Anything, all, \* no matter how ridiculous. Any criticism of Randi, Princhester takes as an attack on himself. I once called Randi a putz, but Princhester has taken this personally. He keeps shouting about how I called HIM and all other Randi fans putzes. He sees Randi as a wonderful heroic man who cannot be wrong about anything, ever. Am I wrong to refer to him as a Randi fan? Indeed, I think fanatic would be closer to the mark. So I call him a Randi fan, and comment upon his misbehaviour. Well, what of that? I have found that many Randi fans do share at least some of Princhester’s more unpleasent characteristics. There are a few reasonable people, but not that many. As I say. Randi is an ill-mannered jerk. His admirers are (mostly) people that find ill-mannered jerkery admirable. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/364 "2004-11-19T02:05:22Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > Or are you a stupid obnoxious egotist who can never, never admit they are wrong or lose face and so is doomed to commit themselves to ever bigger lies in order to have something to say to justify the previous ones? And yet more abuse. It’s been plain for a long time that this is all you have. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/365 "2004-11-19T02:16:47Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#): > > Just take someone like Princhester. He has several of Randi’s books, which he’s always willing to quote from. I have none of Randi’s books. I have never quoted from them. But don’t let your factual inaccuracy get in the way of you abusing Randi for being factually inaccurate. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/366 "2004-11-19T02:18:11Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#): > > And yet more abuse. So I take it that you accept you are an unmitigated liar (you haven’t denied what I wrote to that effect), but don’t like being abused for it? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/367 "2004-11-19T02:20:06Z")
And while we are on the subject of someone who has nothing but hot air to back them, I assume those cites and quotes are going to be here any second? You have, after all, 99% of a large website to which you’ve already been given a link that supports your position (you say), so surely those quotes can’t be too far away. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/368 "2004-11-19T02:22:29Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#): > > Just take someone like Princhester. … Am I wrong to refer to him as a Randi fan? Indeed, I think fanatic would be closer to the mark. Possibly, but this is where you run into trouble: > [@](#): > > So I call him a Randi fan, and comment upon his misbehaviour. Well, what of that? I have found that many Randi fans do share at least some of Princhester’s more unpleasent characteristics. There are a few reasonable people, but not that many. The problems are that: [ul][li]You’re making a generalization about Randi fans, that “not many” are reasonable. It’s understandable that you’d encounter hostility because you’re challenging a person they’d admire, but I’m sure there are thousands of Randi fans who’ve never heard of you and wouldn’t comment if they did. You have no basis for a general disparaging of the group.[/li][li]You’re labelling people as Randi fans who may not be. Simple agreement with Randi on a number of points doesn’t make someone a “fan” nor does siding with him against you.[/ul][/li] > [@](#): > > As I say. Randi is an ill-mannered jerk. His admirers are (mostly) people that find ill-mannered jerkery admirable. You might have a basis for the first part, but I don’t see how the “(mostly)” in the second part is valid in the least. It weakens your position because you show an inability to make distinctions. I have to ask; have you decided whether or not _I’m_ a Randi fan? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/369 "2004-11-19T03:23:41Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > I have none of Randi’s books. I have never quoted from them. But don’t let your factual inaccuracy get in the way of you abusing Randi for being factually inaccurate. **I’m** the one who quoted a Randi book. Yes, I have a copy of several of his books. And of course, the quote contradticted what Peter claimed Randi was saying. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/370 "2004-11-19T03:35:16Z")
> [@Mr. Miskatonic](#): > > **I’m** the one who quoted a Randi book Well, it’s not Peter’s fault. I guess Randi fans sort of blend into each other after a while. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/371 "2004-11-19T04:21:27Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#): > > I once called Randi a putz, but Princhester has taken this personally. He keeps shouting about how I called HIM and all other Randi fans putzes. That’d [be because this is what you said](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=3271936#post3271936): > [@Peter Morris](#): > > Randi has made a fortune trading on the gullability of skeptics.:wally You may now be attempting to argue that you were only calling Randi a putz, but you’ve never done so before. And the abuse, of course, undoubtedly started with you, since the above (in which you _certainly_ call skeptics “gullible”) is your very first post on these boards. But of course you just go on kidding yourself that you are Mr Niceguy and that it’s only us nasty skeptics who engage in abuse. > [@](#): > > His admirers are (mostly) people that find ill-mannered jerkery admirable. Ahhh, the irony. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/372 "2004-11-19T08:07:57Z")
**Peter Morris** , do NOT call other posters trolls. This is an official warning. Lynn Bodoni Administrator For the Straight Dope ---
**Author:** ![Ithaka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Ithaka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ithaka)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926/373 "2004-11-19T10:05:15Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#): > > Oh, so you think you can get away scott free with lies? No, only a complete idiot would think they could get away with lying on a forum such as this. It’s far to easy for anyone to just look back and check the facts. > [@](#): > > But you ignore the evidence and make up stuff to suit you. You accuse me of saying things I never said, and hurl abuse at me based ion your own inventions. Could you please quote where I have made stuff up. All I’ve done is use your on words against you. Please also show me where I have hurled abuse at you. Are you upset I called you a nincompoop? Ah, bless. > [@](#): > > I never accused Princhester of refusing all correspondence with me. I always said that he refused any further discussion through private messages on that subject. From your post no.287: > [@](#): > > you refused to accept any more questions from me You had just accused **Princhester** of flinging nothing but abuse at you. He pointed out that this was untrue and this is your response. There is no reference made by you to whether these questions that he refused to accept were on any particular subject or in any particular medium. As you now seem to accept they were specifically about one subject and only in PMs not in other forums. > [@](#): > > If you admit that you misrepresented me, and apologise, I can respect you for that. Don’t do so, and you will still be a liar. You must be joking. And I still resent your peremptory name-calling (remember what that word means?). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/james-randi-and-dry-spots/268926.md?page=18)