# Jamie Oliver's Food Revolution **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 27, 2010, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990 "2010-03-27T03:46:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/181 "2010-04-07T01:15:04Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > For many, _many_ years, my family would sit down to a wonderful holiday meal cooked by my grandmother or aunt, with challah, brisket, salad, turkey, casserole, etc. etc. Wonderful food. My younger cousin? Well, my aunt had swung by McD’s before heading over to grandma’s to get him fries and nuggets, which he ate at the table, and if you even suggested he try some real food he freaked. Kid’s lucky he’s got his dad’s beanpole metabolism or he’d be fatter than me. Yah, that would fly far in my house. He’d be voted off the island. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/182 "2010-04-07T02:20:08Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Yah, that would fly far in my house. He’d be voted off the island. 😉 Oh, it drove me nuts when some of the fam would do that with the kids. They’d get them whatever fast food they wanted rather than insist that they eat the good stuff with the rest of us. It wouldn’t have killed them. I suppose it was just easier to give in. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/183 "2010-04-07T02:54:50Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > See, if Jamie really knew what he was doing and wanted to compete he would simply serve a BBQ Chicken sandwich and “Cowboy Beans” (instead of refried beans), next to that fajita. The cowboy beans also have the advantage of not being fried. They are much lower in fat. Which also happens to remind me of a West Virginian specialty. White Navy Bean Soup with root vegetables, stewed with a smoked pork shank, Cornbread and Honey. Or at least that is a recipe that I learned from my Dad who was born in West Virginia. Beans and corn sustained many in the Hills. I haven’t really seem him get into local, traditional, and “roots cooking”. I guess that’s what I mean by provincial. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/184 "2010-04-07T03:41:16Z")
A version of that Navy Bean Soup is also a tradition in [The U.S. Senate’s Restaurant/Cafe](http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Cy1&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&q=senate+bean+soup&btnG=Search&aq=f&aqi=g-c5g3g-c2&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=)… It’s quite a delicious and famous soup. I like mustard as a condiment in mine… ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/185 "2010-04-07T18:53:44Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Or, I don’t know, perhaps they feel the need and responsiblity to actually get these children to eat a nutritious meal while they are in school for 7-8 hours a day, rather than languishing and not learning or performing at optimum. Maybe by serving a fajita, the are actively eliminating waste and serving a healthier meal through cognitive means? Ever thought of that? > > Be an interesting experiment to have two wastebaskets at that elementary school, one for the food leftovers from Jamie’s lunches, and one for the school’s lunches. At the end of lunch, weigh them and see which lunch program generates more waste, and through inferrence less tasty and preferable food.. Feeding them garbage they’ll eat is the path of least resistance. Poor choice long term, but when the districts job is to get through the day, the week, the next standardized test, the school doesn’t have time or necessarily willpower to develop these kids taste buds. And if they are going to get home and be able to snack on limitless junk, they might choose to be hungry (with all the associated behavioral problems) at school rather than eat whole grain spaghetti. ---
**Author:** ![flodnak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/838e76/32.png) [@flodnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flodnak)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2010, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/186 "2010-04-08T18:03:02Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Or, I don’t know, perhaps they feel the need and responsiblity to actually get these children to eat a nutritious meal while they are in school Someone should be a smart aleck enough to point out that if they want to get the kids to _eat_ a nutritious meal, they have to _serve_ a healthy meal. And that person shall be me. > [@](#): > > Maybe by serving a fajita, the are actively eliminating waste and serving a healthier meal through cognitive means? Ever thought of that? I might have thought of it if I could understand what you’re talking about. Serving a meal through cognitive means? 😕 I’ve heard of food for thought, but… It sounds like you’re using the old familiar “that’s all the kids will eat” argument. I’d ask then how the kids got that way. I’d invite you to look at the [What’s For School Lunch? blog,](http://whatsforschoollunch.blogspot.com/) which features pictures of school lunches from many different countries. You may notice that, although not all the American school lunches are crud, most of the cruddy lunches are American. The lunches from elsewhere in the world aren’t filled with “kid friendly” foods because the children won’t eat anything else. Why is that? ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/187 "2010-04-08T18:19:08Z")
> [@flodnak](#): > > Someone should be a smart aleck enough to point out that if they want to get the kids to _eat_ a nutritious meal, they have to _serve_ a healthy meal. And that person shall be me. > I might have thought of it if I could understand what you’re talking about. Serving a meal through cognitive means? 😕 I’ve heard of food for thought, but… Are you following the context at all? The kids have a choice of the school’s fajita lunch or Jamie’s supposedly healthier lunch of a BBQ chicken sandwich and refried beans. A fajita in this case is the healthier choice, and just so happens to be a very popular mexican dish which stands quite clearly in the American Collective Food Conscious and has a clear cognitive association of grilled meat and vegetables in a tortilla. It’s catchy and well known… I don’t know about you, but I have never in my life eaten a BBQ Chicken Sandwich with Refried Beans nor would I really want to. It frankly does not sound very appetizing. ---
**Author:** ![valleyofthedolls](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a4c791/32.png) [@valleyofthedolls](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/valleyofthedolls)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2010, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/188 "2010-04-08T18:36:07Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > It frankly does not sound very appetizing. Why do I get the feeling this less about your interest in what children eat for lunch in this country and more about defending what is probably your incredibly lousy diet. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2010, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/189 "2010-04-08T18:41:27Z")
It kind of reminds me of **ZPG Zealot** ’s anti adoption arguments. I mean, they’re just so wacky and bizarre. American food consciousness? I don’t think that it’s necessarily about what the food is and so much about preparation. Jamie Oliver as a professional cook can do a really good job making these foods from scratch, so that they resemble their basic ingredients. I’m sure he could make a really wonderful fajita or a pizza or whatever, in a way that this school on its budget with all its red tape can’t. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2010, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/190 "2010-04-08T18:45:02Z")
> [@valleyofthedolls](#): > > Why do I get the feeling this less about your interest in what children eat for lunch in this country and more about defending what is probably your incredibly lousy diet. Hey, You don’t know me… you don’t know what I eat. I heard you eat chilluns, Why do you hate America’s children so much? ---
**Author:** ![flodnak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/838e76/32.png) [@flodnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flodnak)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/191 "2010-04-09T07:35:38Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Are you following the context at all? I’m following the context just fine. The context is failing to help me parse the phrase “serving a healthier meal through cognitive means”, which is what I asked about. What do you mean? Why did you write “through cognitive means”? > [@](#): > > The kids have a choice of the school’s fajita lunch or Jamie’s supposedly healthier lunch of a BBQ chicken sandwich and refried beans. A fajita in this case is the healthier choice, and just so happens to be a very popular mexican dish which stands quite clearly in the American Collective Food Conscious and has a clear cognitive association of grilled meat and vegetables in a tortilla. It’s catchy and well known… I don’t know about you, but I have never in my life eaten a BBQ Chicken Sandwich with Refried Beans nor would I really want to. It frankly does not sound very appetizing. I know what a fajita is. Grilled vegetables are healthy. Grilled meat can be a good choice, too, if it’s not too fatty. Tortillas aren’t necessarily good for you, it depends what’s in them. Similarly, a barbecue chicken sandwich can be healthy or not, depending on how it’s made. Refried beans wouldn’t be my first inspiration for a side dish with that meal (and there’s a powerful example of “it depends on how they’re made” - mashed beans with salt and maybe some onions or peppers? or a mush made of beans, salt, and lard?), but I’m not sure what makes them “unappetizing” in this context. But speaking of following the context, we’re losing the thread here by focusing on a single meal, offered in a single school district that has recently had an enormous amount of attention concerning its school lunch program. There are multiple links in this thread to other school districts’ lunch menus, and I don’t remember seeing a fajita in the lot. Again, I encourage you to look at the pictures in the What’s For School Lunch? blog, and to see how bad it can get, let me add the [Fed Up With Lunch](http://fedupwithschoollunch.blogspot.com/) blog project. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 7:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/192 "2010-04-09T07:43:51Z")
> [@flodnak](#): > > I’m following the context just fine. The context is failing to help me parse the phrase “serving a healthier meal through cognitive means”, which is what I asked about. What do you mean? Why did you write “through cognitive means”?I know what a fajita is. Grilled vegetables are healthy. Grilled meat can be a good choice, too, if it’s not too fatty. Tortillas aren’t necessarily good for you, it depends what’s in them. Similarly, a barbecue chicken sandwich can be healthy or not, depending on how it’s made. Refried beans wouldn’t be my first inspiration for a side dish with that meal (and there’s a powerful example of “it depends on how they’re made” - mashed beans with salt and maybe some onions or peppers? or a mush made of beans, salt, and lard?), but I’m not sure what makes them “unappetizing” in this context. > > But speaking of following the context, we’re losing the thread here by focusing on a single meal, offered in a single school district that has recently had an enormous amount of attention concerning its school lunch program. There are multiple links in this thread to other school districts’ lunch menus, and I don’t remember seeing a fajita in the lot. Again, I encourage you to look at the pictures in the What’s For School Lunch? blog, and to see how bad it can get, let me add the [Fed Up With Lunch](http://fedupwithschoollunch.blogspot.com/) blog project. I looked at that blog and from a deconstructionist POV and it all looked pretty similar. I’m sorry, but I only saw a couple of truly crappy menus and the two were English. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/193 "2010-04-09T08:10:09Z")
> [@flodnak](#): > > Refried beans wouldn’t be my first inspiration for a side dish with that meal (and there’s a powerful example of “it depends on how they’re made” - mashed beans with salt and maybe some onions or peppers? or a mush made of beans, salt, and lard?), but I’m not sure what makes them “unappetizing” in this context. Well, It’s kind of like Meatpie and Peas porridge with gravy. Nothing wrong with that, or is there? Jamie, ya stupid cunt. [Cowboy Beans or Frijoles Charros](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frijoles_charros) is a better alternative.. wank all you want, but the nutritional information bears out. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/194 "2010-04-09T18:13:01Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > I looked at that blog and from a deconstructionist POV and it all looked pretty similar. I’m sorry, but I only saw a couple of truly crappy menus and the two were English. From a deconstructionist POV? What do you mean by that? ---
**Author:** ![valleyofthedolls](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a4c791/32.png) [@valleyofthedolls](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/valleyofthedolls)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/195 "2010-04-09T18:59:01Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Hey, You don’t know me… you don’t know what I eat. I heard you eat chilluns, Why do you hate America’s children so much? I wouldn’t want to eat America’s children. They’re too fat and have bad skin. Truly unappetizing. That aside, your mind is obviously made up so what’s the point of this thread? You’re not bringing anything to the table (no pun intended) and your tone and attitude make you come off like a self-satisfied shrew. Do you have any actual research that reflects even a portion of your opinions? ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/196 "2010-04-09T19:02:44Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > From a deconstructionist POV? What do you mean by that? Ante-post-neomodernism. Duh. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/197 "2010-04-09T23:00:01Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Well, It’s kind of like Meatpie and Peas porridge with gravy. Nothing wrong with that, or is there? Jamie, ya stupid cunt. > > [Cowboy Beans or Frijoles Charros](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frijoles_charros) is a better alternative.. wank all you want, but the nutritional information bears out. I asked you on page 1 not to use this word in this thread. You have ignored my instructions, and I have issued a warning for ignoring my instructions. **twickster** , Cafe Society moderator ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/198 "2010-04-09T23:04:25Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > I asked you on page 1 not to use this word in this thread. You have ignored my instructions, and I have issued a warning for ignoring my instructions. > > **twickster** , Cafe Society moderator You just gave him a warning for breaking a rule that doesn’t exist. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/199 "2010-04-09T23:18:11Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > You just gave him a warning for breaking a rule that doesn’t exist. There is a rule that posters should obey moderator instructions. That is the rule he broke, and that is the infraction I issued the warning for. **twickster** , Cafe Society moderator ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990/200 "2010-04-09T23:46:34Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > There is a rule that posters should obey moderator instructions. That is the rule he broke, and that is the infraction I issued the warning for. > > **twickster** , Cafe Society moderator I think that sets a bad precedent, so I opened [a thread in ATMB](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=559133) to discuss it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamie-olivers-food-revolution/533990.md?page=11)