# JamieMcGarry - Wheel yourself on down here **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 25, 2011, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050 "2011-08-25T16:11:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/461 "2011-08-31T02:10:04Z")
> [@jamiemcgarry](#): > > Several times. But as I have said earlier, I admit, as far as the exercise equipment is concerned, they may not technically be in violation of any law. But the exercise equipment alone is not the only issue. It’s the exercise equipment and the parking lot incident and other, smaller issues at HHFC combined together that led me to write the DOJ; as I felt I was being discriminated against on the basis of my disability. Now I may have done so with a bit of naivete, but there was no fraudulence or deception or vengeance in my heart when I did so. And I’m not suing HHFC, I complained about them to the only agency I knew of. Big difference. If in your own words, the mission statement and the overarching goal of the fitness center is to cater to the disabled, how can you also claim that you are being discriminated on the basis of your disability? It sounds like they are discriminating against you because you’re a pain in the ass for them, despite your disability. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/462 "2011-08-31T02:15:59Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > BTW, I was thinking on his story about the guy who was blocked in and had to wait in the parking lot. I understand the point of the story was that there was a jerk parking in the handicapped spot, basically blocking the guy in. BUT…wouldn’t he also be blocked in by someone who was parked there legitimately? And if that were the case, would your friend have been willing to “make a scene” then? > > Besides, it’s not like the mall security would announce, “HEY, SOME JERK IS PARKED IN THE HANDICAPPED ZONE!!!” They’d simply announce that such and such license plate needs to come to the parking lot, and THEN they’d tell him that they’d need to move his vehicle. The other guy was supposedly on the stripped area next to the handicapped area, not in a legit spot (handicapped or otherwise). So this poor guy sat there and did nothing for 4 hours. Funny, it was the polar opposite of what Jamie did when someone parked illegally. How convenient. The person who seems to take everything to the extreme, the person who threw “False Dilemma” in my face, suddenly showed up with this story. As if to say there are two imply two options:Wait in the parking lot like a sucker or get confrontational with the illegal parker. How about calling the police and having them come and deal with it. I’ll bet, even if they couldn’t tow the car for whatever reason, the officer (after ticketing the other car) could have backed up the his van into the aisle so he could open the side door. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/463 "2011-08-31T02:24:55Z")
> [@jamiemcgarry](#): > > Well all this “nut-betting” and speculation from people here has wore me down. ] Oh please. You damn well know if you ran a business and got a letter that implied the possibility of a lawsuit you’d consult a lawyer too (unless you were just too damn poor or stupid to do so). A month or two ago I on one, if not two occasions tried to tell you that you needed to lay off your handicapped crusade here on the SDMB. For one, you don’t come off well (maybe its because your basically wrong or maybe its just because you can’t articulate your point well). Secondly, even if you WERENT coming off badly it still makes you wheelchair guy rather than random guy that happens to be in a wheelchair (the fact you come off badly doesnt help the second problem either). I didn’t do it to be mean or “right” or whatever. I did it because I had a good idea it would be bad for you and bad for the forum. Maybe your recent threads have shown that, you’ll change your tune and everybody (especially YOU) will be happier for it. Again, you may see this as a personal attack but its not. You have a real chance to be a NON CONTROVERSIAL and contributing member here. But, IMO you are blowing it. You are basically asking people here to tell you are right when it comes to your handicapped war. That just ain’t happening. Second, you think you are educating folks on all things handicapped, when you are mostly just pissing them off. Seriously, I am trying to help here. Give up on your crusade here and focus on the latest Top Chef or Dr Who or Is God real? kinda stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/464 "2011-08-31T02:27:38Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > **jamie** , you didn’t answer the question – do you think the gym should then buy the ADDITIONAL machine? Meh, I asked him 4 times. If he’s not going to answer it that’s a good enough answer for me. He did the same thing with everything else, but unlike the other things there isn’t a story to change since it’s my (hypothetical) story and with that since it’s my question, the one time he tried to weasel out of it on a technicality I had no problem rewording it but maintaining the integrity of the question. I still think it’s a good question. How useful his machine is, what disabilities he can think of, how he wants to define architectural barriers or March 2012 don’t matter, I just want to know if he feels someone else should get a machine that they want after he gets the one that he wants? (BTW Jamie, if you do answer my question, answer the original, carefully worded one, not this one)…it seems like a case of “fuck you, I got mine” ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/465 "2011-08-31T02:34:54Z")
> [@jamiemcgarry](#): > > Well all this “nut-betting” and speculation from people here has wore me down. Continue to trash me, my character, my intelligence and my motivations in everything I do if you all wish\*. I need to step away from the discussion of everything HHFC/“parking-lot vigilante”-related. I will take this mediation session where it takes me, and let the results speak for themselves. **However, it’s serving no positive/beneficial purpose whatsoever in continuing on in the manner this has gone on.** So I’m bowing out. I’m sorry if I did a terrible job conveying what I wanted to say. So be it. I disagree on the bolded part. Due to the multitude of people who have argued with you and your actions, you will now be much better prepared if/when the mediation takes place. You’ve also got some good feedback that might help you explore alternatives before jumping to the last resort of filing futile ADA complaints. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/466 "2011-08-31T02:35:03Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > The other guy was supposedly on the stripped area next to the handicapped area, not in a legit spot (handicapped or otherwise). So this poor guy sat there and did nothing for 4 hours. Funny, it was the polar opposite of what Jamie did when someone parked illegally. How convenient. The person who seems to take everything to the extreme, the person who threw “False Dilemma” in my face, suddenly showed up with this story. As if to say there are two imply two options:Wait in the parking lot like a sucker or get confrontational with the illegal parker. > > How about calling the police and having them come and deal with it. I’ll bet, even if they couldn’t tow the car for whatever reason, the officer (after ticketing the other car) could have backed up the his van into the aisle so he could open the side door. Every mall I’ve been to has Security wandering through the parking lot in their little carts. So in four hours, not one came near the that part of the lot to see the car parked there and a stranded wheelchair user? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/467 "2011-08-31T03:09:38Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Every mall I’ve been to has Security wandering through the parking lot in their little carts. So in four hours, not one came near the that part of the lot to see the car parked there and a stranded wheelchair user? Or hell, just some other shopper. If I saw someone sitting there like that, I’d probably ask him if he needed help. ---
**Author:** ![inkling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f17d59/32.png) [@inkling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inkling)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/468 "2011-08-31T04:06:06Z")
> [@jamiemcgarry](#): > > This is simply untrue. They will not _necessarily_ have to spend one dollar if they do not see fit. HHFC can decline participation in mediation talks, there is no guarantee it will escalate beyond that level. But they did, or will. They’d be fools not to. You don’t have to have a lawyer to defend yourself in court, either, but as the saying goes, a man who represents himself has a fool for a client. They hired those lawyers to defend against your complaint. That costs them money, money they might very well not have spent (or spent on equipment for their members to use). You took an action that caused them monetary damage; that is the basis of a lawsuit. And if they decline to participate in mediation, what do you think happens? I’m pretty sure it’s not just that the whole thing goes away; I think the mediator will rule against them. In short, the ONLY thing it makes sense for HHFC to do is to retain one or more lawyers to vigorously defend them, and to show up for the mediation loaded for bear. They just can’t take the chance of doing anything else. As others have pointed out, lawyers do read Internet forums, and I would hardly be surprised to know that they already read everything you’ve written on this board, including all the times you have admitted that the gym has not broken any laws, that the whole thing was because of one manager, that you only wanted to make HHFC adhere to what you thought their charter meant, etc. This is me being the best friend I can be to you: withdraw your complaint formally and apologize, not just for this episode, but for all the trouble you have caused HHFC in the past. Then move on and never contact them again. Your complaint is going down in flames, because they are (or will be) prepared, and all you have is a gripe about something completely irrelevant to what the DOJ and the ADA are for. The finding is going to be against you, and they again will have every right to file suit against you. If they don’t, they are far nicer people than you have any right to expect. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/469 "2011-08-31T04:26:02Z")
You are confusing mediation with arbitration. Mediators don’t “rule” on anything. They try to get the parties to hash things out themselves. ---
**Author:** ![inkling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f17d59/32.png) [@inkling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inkling)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/470 "2011-08-31T04:35:05Z")
Okay, fair point. They’d still be fools not to prepare for it. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/471 "2011-08-31T04:50:14Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > They try to get the parties to hash things out themselves. Now I want hash browns. Can the hell bus make a detour at a Waffle House, please? ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/472 "2011-08-31T05:03:30Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I have no idea what the hell he’s talking about. My only beef with him is his constant lectures on how we should stop being such bullies. If that’s how he feels, he needs to stay out of the Pit. I think he was just lashing out in whatever way he could think of in a desperate attempt to cut you to the quick and make you see the terrible error in your ways. Unfortunately he’s not very good at insulting people. I agree that his constant “leave me alone - life is hard for me!” refrain is incredibly annoying. > [@ladyfoxfyre](#): > > If in your own words, the mission statement and the overarching goal of the fitness center is to cater to the disabled, how can you also claim that you are being discriminated on the basis of your disability? It sounds like they are discriminating against you because you’re a pain in the ass for them, despite your disability. This is something I don’t get either - and I’ve tried to ask him without any success. It makes no damn sense. It’s like getting kicked out of Curves for fistfighting with the other patrons and then turning around and yelling “this is just because I’m a woman, isn’t it!”. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/473 "2011-08-31T05:50:08Z")
I’m curious as to why a mediator would even dream of deciding against a business and in favor of someone who used an automobile as a weapon to get his way in that business’s parking lot. Are there any professional mediators who are actively posting members of TSDMB? I’d love to hear the rationale behind that decision if you were so inclined to render it. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/474 "2011-08-31T13:26:34Z")
Obviously, because the guy is a cripple. Isn’t that the same reason all the other bad things happen to **jamie**? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/475 "2011-08-31T14:25:28Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Every mall I’ve been to has Security wandering through the parking lot in their little carts. So in four hours, not one came near the that part of the lot to see the car parked there and a stranded wheelchair user? Should’ve pretended to smoke a joint. The rent-a-cops would’ve materialized instantly (or at least used to, back when I was a teenager). ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/476 "2011-08-31T15:59:17Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Or hell, just some other shopper. If I saw someone sitting there like that, I’d probably ask him if he needed help. Why, you patronizing bitch! ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/477 "2011-08-31T22:44:12Z")
I feel compelled to say one final thing as to why I feel I was discriminated against on the basis of my disability. For one, I don’t see how I ever used any equipment at HHFC in any manner inconsistent with use with which it was originally designed for. I was doing pullups on a _pull-up bar._ The fact that I was strapped to my wheelchair is really no different than other trainers strapping barbell-plate weights to their bodies in order to provide additional resistance to that of their body weight (which is exacty why I was strapped to my chair). I don’t see any difference in risk. Not to mention other, much more risky exercises, such as bench-pressing without a spotter, which _could_ result in death in an accident, that are allowed at HHFC without batting an eyelid. What is so spectacularly dangerous about _ **my** _ exercise that it must be banned? It my eye, it was because it was being _different_ and unusual, and unknown, rather than being _dangerous_, which got the exercise banned. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/478 "2011-08-31T23:08:30Z")
Do any of you remember the old hymn title game, the one where you add the words _in bed_ or _between the sheets_ at the end of the title? For example, _Come, Come, Ye Saints…in Bed_. Well, what we’re seeing here is something quit similar. It’s the _jamiemcgarry game_. He’s getting away with the crap he pulls in real life because his target has no choice but to add _in a wheelchair_ to whatever the target’s thinking. Let’s take as an example the incident where jamiemcgarry blocked someone in a parking spot. The target no doubt started to think \*WTF? Someone’s blocking me in. What a jackass…in a wheelchair!" On a bit of tangent, but not that much of one really, let’s see if mister irrational, I mean jamiemcgarry can grasp this. I’ve used the gymnasiums on the military bases and in the gyms I’ve used are posted instructions, actual regulations for which the user can be punished under military discipline for disregarding those instructions, informing the patron that it’s not permissible to use any of the exercise equipment in a manner that it’s not intended to be used. Also, when I was in college, my college’s gym also had rules against using the equipment in a manner it was not intended by the manufacturer to be used. The reason, of course, is that the gym and manufacturer not only do not want anyone to be injured but they also do not want to lose a lawsuit. Now, you might (note that I said _might_) be correct and the equipment just might be suitable for the exercise you wish to perform. Until you’ve gotten yourself trained and rated as a sports physiologist and equipment designer, perhaps you should entertain the idea that you simply do not know everything on the subject. You might also want to entertain the idea that you might be slightly insane. Seriously, dude, get some counseling. Until that happens, no doubt, we’re going to be regaled with another round of the _jamiemcgarry game_. The thing is, I, along with a few other posters here apparently, are convinced that before your wreck\* you were a jackass. Now you’re a jackass… in a wheelchair! Personally, I like the _hymn title game_ far better. \*I used the term _wreck_ because I agree with the idea that some crashes are not accidents. They were foreseeable. ETA: You can’t seriously believe that there’s no difference in shape between a wheelchair and weights. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/479 "2011-08-31T23:13:58Z")
> [@jamiemcgarry](#): > > The fact that I was strapped to my wheelchair is really no different than other trainers strapping barbell-plate weights to their bodies in order to provide additional resistance to that of their body weight (which is exacty why I was strapped to my chair). I don’t see any difference in risk. Not to mention other, much more risky exercises, such as bench-pressing without a spotter, which _could_ result in death in an accident, that are allowed at HHFC without batting an eyelid. What height were you at when you dropped from the machine to the ground? How close were other people? Had you crashed and burned, what were the chances that you would have injured others? Not everything is all about you. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2011, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050/480 "2011-08-31T23:22:00Z")
Now, that’s just crazy talk. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jamiemcgarry-wheel-yourself-on-down-here/594050.md?page=25)